Hair Loss Prevention
- 02-02-2005, 11:04 PM
- 02-03-2005, 01:07 AM
- 02-03-2005, 08:44 PM
Very informative to those who have yet to research. I see a lot of questions about various products on multiple boards.
For those that are wondering about finasteride. I bought 5mg Fincar (generic 5mg finasteride aka proscar) from Inhousepharmacy. I cut them into 1-1.25 sections with a pill cutter. This is a very cheap way to take finasteride.
I was very worried about gains, estrogenic sides and so on when I first started. I've been on it about 2 years now and I have had no negative sides. My sex drive is completely the same (although i am 22) and I havent noticed any decrease in gains. I ran a cycle, gained well and came off. After i was fully recovered I proceeded to gain another 5-6lb all natural muscle in my off time. I dont feel that it has hurt my gains in any way. DHT is somewhat of a natural anti-estrogen within the body. Worst case scenerio you might be more likely to put on fat since you have less DHT and slightly more estrogen. This has not happened in my case though. Im just saying it could be possible. Instances of estrogen induced gyno are very rare on finasteride. Everyone is different though. If running a heavy Test cycle its possible that on finasteride you could have higher estrogen. You could use arimidex in this case. I havent had any problems myself though.
Nothing will grow hair back well. Your best bet is to take a PROACTIVE approach and PROTECT the hair that you do have. In my case I feel that finasteride has protected my hair and reduced loss. I think I will have 3-4 years more time before people will notice its obviously thinning. Thats more than I would have had on nothing. Eventually you will always lose the battle though.
I might add that Ive been using Topicals the whole time too. Regrowth's (Dr. Lee's) Xandrox is a very good Minox AAcid blend. This is anti-dht AT THE SCALP + regrowth. I have also purchased products from Wholesalehaircare due to the better prices. I always questioned quality and formulation though. Im hoping someone reputable will produce and EXACT clone of Xandrox or his Spiro cream and sell it. They can jack up the price and STILL undercut Dr. Lee by a ton. This is a large market and very few places to get the stuff.That which does not kill us makes us stronger - Friedrich Nietzsche
02-04-2005, 12:03 AM
Good info on Finasteride. Ive never used it, Im saving it for the day that I may actually need it, as the topicals are working more than well enough for the time being.Nothing will grow hair back well. Your best bet is to take a PROACTIVE approach and PROTECT the hair that you do have. In my case I feel that finasteride has protected my hair and reduced loss. I think I will have 3-4 years more time before people will notice its obviously thinning. Thats more than I would have had on nothing. Eventually you will always lose the battle though.
You're spot-on about preventative maitenence. If someone who was sure they were going to suffer hair loss started using these products in their early 20's (as you are), they may never go through it. Everyone is differnet, but studies show that 80% of users see varying degrees of positive results from the AA/Minox/Spiro/Nizoral combo. That's a pretty good number. However, it still sucks for the other 20%.
In my case, my hair was obviously thinning, but the topicals did regrow a fair amount of hair and it continues to improve. With contined use, I hope I don't eventually lose the battle. If anything, I hope I keep my hair long enough for medical science to improve to the point where there is actually a cure for MPB and not just a treatment.
And if it dosent, then its a good thing I work out because Ill look better with a shaved head!
02-04-2005, 01:26 AM
People keep saying that you'll eventually lose the battle to MPB.
I don't know. I've been on finasteride/minox for 6.5 years and have a full head of hair after starting when the crown of my head was beginning to thin.
A buddy of mine has been at it for longer than I have, and he's got a full head of hair.
I'm just not convinced that hairloss isn't something that can be avoided.
ALSO: A really good site to get Proscar is at qhi.co.uk. No script needed, and about 5 months worth for $50 or so.
02-04-2005, 08:16 AM
Thanks for the link mtruther. I agree that it is possible to avoid hairloss if one is responsive to the treatments. For some guys, it might just slow down the ineveitable however.
02-04-2005, 10:23 AM
One problem I have with all the topicals is they all seem to give me dandruff after they dry. Currently I'm only using minox 5% but I noticed the same thing when using spiro and AA. Is there any way to prevent the dandruff? Currently I'm using finasteride 1.25 mg ED, nizoral 2% EOD, and minox 5% 2x ED.
02-04-2005, 12:47 PM
Ive had the same problem, here's the fix: At night, skip an application of the topicals and rub some good moisturizing lotion into your scalp. It'll make your hair all greasy but who cares, you're going to sleep.Is there any way to prevent the dandruff?
When you wake up, dandruff will be gone! It actually might take a couple applications but usually one is good enough for me.
Normal dandruff is caused by the Pityrosporum ovale fungus. If you're using Nizoral, this isnt an issue. Its just dry scalp from the chemicals in the topicals (ethanol, propylene glycol, etc)...skin lotion does the trick.
02-04-2005, 01:56 PM
I have the same problem. Dr. Lee's minox/AA has a compound in called BV. I rember it made my scalp silky. Great stuff.Originally Posted by BigVrunga
02-04-2005, 02:39 PM
Right from Dr.Lee's site:
Betamethasone valerate: Betamethasone valerate is a topical corticosteriod approved
by the United Stated Food and Drug Administration for treatment of various skin
disorders. It can be used in very low concentrations to reduce any inflammation
caused by propylene glycol or alcohol in the minoxidil formulation. Betamethasone
valerate has been in use in Western medicine for many decades and is very safe in
the low concentrations (0.025%) used in our special order minoxidil solutions. If
you don't have any drying or irritation from the propylene glycol or alcohol in
the minoxidil solutions, you can choose to use our standard minoxidil solutions
without betamethasone valerate in the base. Betamethasone in the low dosage found
in our special order solutions is not directly associated to hair growth.
02-04-2005, 03:02 PM
My hairline is starting to receade on the sides, the middle of my forehead is holding strong.. What am i better off using to stop the receading? Is proscar something a doctor will proscribe?
02-04-2005, 03:42 PM
My hairline is starting to thin and all I'm concerned about is KEEPING WHAT I HAVE. I currently have a full set of hair but I think I might start to thin in other places too, or my hairline will recede rapidly (dad and gramps are both bald as hell). I was wondering if someone could direct me towards a product that will be the most sufficient for what I wanna do.
02-04-2005, 04:02 PM
02-04-2005, 04:11 PM
I read it.. I am just trying to decipher if i am better off going with a stack like you posted or trying to get ahold of some proscar..Originally Posted by BigVrunga
My hair isnt really thining, i have thick ass hair, just the sides are starting to receade..
Thanks for the help,
02-04-2005, 05:16 PM
Do you have a lot of MPB in your family? I would apply anti-androgens to the top of the head, vertex, as well as the areas where its receeding. Use minoxidil only on the areas that are receeding.
02-04-2005, 05:20 PM
Cool thanks, i guess i am going to order some spiro, minox, and azleaic from custom...Originally Posted by BigVrunga
02-06-2005, 12:02 AM
Guys, thanks for the tip on Fluridil. I did some research on it, and it has gotten some pretty positive reviews from hairloss forums. That's good news considering most of the dudes who hang around those sites only do so if they haven't cured their problem.
Anyway, if you do go that route, make sure you apply the Fluridil separate from other compounds and nowhere near when you shower. The molecule is designed to break down easily in the presence of water, which prevents systemic absorption (and the resulting loss of libido). Thus, applying it with a minox solution (where some may contain some H20) would be counterproductive.
I still need to do some looking into its mechanism v. that of spiro, but again, the results from others have been promising.
02-06-2005, 08:46 AM
Again, great thread bro....sorry if I missed this but mind posting a link to a place someone could pick up some 'Regrowth Treatment' Nizoral? Thanks
02-06-2005, 12:30 PM
02-06-2005, 02:41 PM
Canada Pharmacy is as good a place as any as I've seen for Nizoral 2%.
I think Dr. Lee sells another version on his site, minoxidil.com.
Wholesale Hairproducts also carries Niz 2% along with minox and sometimes spiro. I've heard their solutions are a little spotty someitmes and fall out of solution, though. Still, it's good to know of other providers.
Another good site (especially for more innovative products) is Lipoxidil.com, though I don't believe they carry Nizoral 2%.
I did a lot of research on hairloss before I began taking androgens because frankly, having been down the road of realizing I was thinning up top and finally getting it to stop (and really regrow back to what I had), I have every intention of avoiding the hairloss thing.
One of the better discussion boards I've found is at hairsite4.com.
02-06-2005, 06:58 PM
Dr.Lee's 'Regrowth Treatment Shampoo' is superior to standard Nizoral. It contains 3% Salycilic acid, which aids in the penetration of Ketoconozole, the active ingredient which inhibits DHT.
Sure - www.minoxidil.com.Again, great thread bro....sorry if I missed this but mind posting a link to a place someone could pick up some 'Regrowth Treatment' Nizoral? Thanks
Keep in mind that Custom's Spiro is a potent 5% solution. (at a great price too, I might add) Its very pungent and IMO, isnt good for applying to the entire scalp. A milder, 2% solution should work better for this. Keep the 5% for spot treating problem areas like the hairline, vertex, etc.Cool thanks, i guess i am going to order some spiro, minox, and azleaic from custom...
02-07-2005, 09:47 AM
02-07-2005, 02:08 PM
One more question....
In the interest of time and money I might be just using Neutrogena T-sal (3% S/A) and Non-Pre. Strength Nizoral (1% K), seems as though this will be just as effective and much cheaper....any thoughts?
02-07-2005, 02:26 PM
02-14-2005, 02:03 AM
I just started using the Azelaic Acid 5% immidiately followed by Minoxidil 5% and 1-2min later followed by Spironolactone 2% stack from custom. I don't take any pro hormones. I think my hair just receded due to stress in college. hehe But seriously, it all happened in like a month and haven't receded more in years. It's just at the sides of my forehead. And the middle is thinner, but still there. I'm 26 now.
How long after applying the stack can I start sweating? I played some bball 30min after an application and it was burning a little one I started sweating. I'm more concerned with the sweat pushing the solutions out then the burning. And how long after the application can I wash my hair. I don't mind getting up an hour or more before I have to wake up to apply it and then take a shower. The stuff is really shiny on the skin and I'd rather not go outside looking like that. When it dries out, can I assume it's fully absorbed or how long do I have to wait?
Should I also get the nizoral 2% shampoo from here? http://www.nizoral2percent.com/hairloss.php
I was unable to locate Retin-A. Anyone have a link?
02-14-2005, 02:05 PM
Thanks, but won't it diminish the effectiveness of the minox if I only apply it 1x day?Originally Posted by BigVrunga
02-14-2005, 02:52 PM
You only have to apply the skin lotion once every few weeks or so to stave off the dandruff. Skipping one application every few weeks isnt going to hurt. If you're worried about it, apply the topicals and give them an hour or so to absorb, and then apply the lotion.
02-14-2005, 09:50 PM
02-15-2005, 01:39 AM
yeah finapecia is very good and its quite cheap... drugs are cheaper in india... btw, its not generic, just because its not made in america doesnt make it generic does it? generics are normally lower quality.. i dotn think u can say that about finapecia.
02-25-2005, 05:17 PM
02-27-2005, 12:34 AM
I read this whole thread but i'm still all little confused about this. Lots of factors concerning muscle loss, my question is
I'm going to be running a cycle of TestEN/TrenEN/Winny My cycle log is on here
I though i was loosing my hair when i did a M1T cycle i did shead some what but ive been clean for a while now and my hair seems to be thick but i think it's thinning..it's all a mind game.
Anyways I don't want to lose muscle can anyone create a working stack for me? it would be greatly appreciated
02-27-2005, 11:18 AM
Propecia use while doing 1AD or 1Test
I am new to Body Building and after reading everything still had a question about Propecia which I learned is just Finasteride from everyone, thanks. I have been taking Propecia, when I remember to, for about 7 years now.
I want to gain mass, and am eating quality foods, Protien, etc. I am going to start a product called 1-Test 1,4 AD THP Ether, that is in a liquid form that you take by mouth. My plans is to take 1-test for two weeks twice a day. Then I was going to follow with 6 oxo or Instone Forza-T. Not sure how long to do the 6-OXO phase but it sounds like at lease the same amount of time as the 1-Test phase, so two weeks is my plan right now. Then take 2-4 weeks off everything.
First question is about my 1-test/6-oxo plan. Does this sound ok for gaining mass?
Second question is about Propecia. Should I keep taking it just like normal (1 a day) or stop taking it during my 1-Test and 6-0X0 phases?
Goal, gain mass and keep the hair I have.
I also might try 1-AD next time, followed by 6-oxo.
Thanks for your expert advice.
02-27-2005, 02:11 PM
Bro if this stuff didnt work so well believe me, that would be my plan of actionOr you guys could just shave your head, get some tattoos, grow a goatee and be hardcore
Supersus - topicals arent systemic. You dont have to worry about muscle loss. As far as creating a working stack for you, my advice would be to go back a re-read the 1st post in this thread. Its got all the info you need.
Rock1041 - Ive never used propecia, but it wont hurt to keep taking it during a 1-test cycle. I would use topical spiro as well if you're worried about it.
02-27-2005, 03:35 PM
I was thinking about getting the Ketoconazole Powder from custom, and using it in my normal shampoo. But I was wondering, how would you go about mixing the shampoo and powder together? I don't think shampoo is that mixable lol.
Great post/read by the way.
02-27-2005, 03:40 PM
Bump, I was thinking the same thing. THis might be best asked in the Custom forum.Originally Posted by BOHICA
02-28-2005, 03:19 PM
03-24-2005, 12:00 AM
I'm 19 and just starting to use rogaine, I also ordered the spiro, AA, Minoxidil stack and am planning on visiting my dermatologist so that I can have propecia prescribed to me. My question is, is it normal to experience itching when you are first starting to use Minoxidil, and are any of these topical creams able to be applied to the front and mid section of the scalp or are they all just for use on the vertex?
03-24-2005, 12:12 AM
I get some itching from minoxidil/AA. I stopped using spiro, it combines with minoxidil and smells and burns. It also left the treated area bright red for a whole day afterwards. So it really didn't matter that I applied it at night as the next day I had to wear a hat to cover the red area. I'm also taking saw palmetto. It's cheap and figure it can't hurt. I've only been on it for a month and a half so too early to tell. You're supposed to notice something after 4-6months of treatment. I'll post my results then. I took alot of pre pics. I only lost hair at the temples and that's the hardest area to regrow so if it works there it will work everywhere.
03-24-2005, 01:30 AM
Yes, it's normal to itch when you first apply a topical. These topicals are usually in alcohol or a propylene glycol solution, so they're going to itch, especially when you first start. Less so with time. If you continue to have problems with minox, order from Dr. Lee's site, minoxidil.com. His is a little gentler on the scalp (plus it also dries more quickly). It is a bit more expensive, though.Originally Posted by fjc5006
Also, you should not apply minox and spiro at the same time. They react together, create a horrible smell, etc...
If you're looking for a cheap source of Propecia, get Proscar instead. They're the exact same thing (i.e. finasteride), except Proscar is in 5 mg pills v. the 1 mg pill for Propecia. If you want it without a script, try www.qhi.co.uk.
Don't expect your dermatologist to know a great deal about hairloss unless he specializes in the field. If you're looking to get more info, try the forums at harilosstalk.com or hairsite.com.
Best of luck, dude.
(and by all means, stick with the finasteride unless the sides are just unbearable for a long length of time. It's the best thing out there, IMHO)
03-24-2005, 12:39 PM
I'd also like to know what the definition of severe hair loss is. So far I think I've been losing hair for the past 8 months, although I did not realize it til now but I have been noticing in pictures taken earlier in the fall semester. I shed thin hairs on my pillow and a lot of thicker ones come out in the shower. However, in 8 months it has not yet become noticeable. Would that be classified moderate or severe?
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