- 11-17-2004, 09:45 AM
- 11-17-2004, 09:55 AM
- 6'7" 270 lbs.
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- Aug 2004
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Depends on what you take. What PCT is though, is getting your test levels back to normal as your estrogen levels can stay the same but your test levels decrease.
- 11-17-2004, 09:59 AM
I am talking about theory. If natual testosteron (HTPA) is suppressed after a cycle of PH/PS, then what about estrogen. Is it higher or lower than normal. Directly after your cycle???
11-17-2004, 11:03 AM
Lower, why would you think it would be higher?
11-17-2004, 11:11 AM
Lower for males since most estrogen in men is derived from testosterone. Not sure for women.
11-17-2004, 09:44 PM
I believe that to be true, for test to be lower directly after a cycle. But, I have read many conflicting ideas concerning PCT, as if estrogen levels would be elevated. Some would wonder why you would need an anti-estrogen post cycle If estrogen levels are low.
11-17-2004, 10:45 PM
I've also been led to believe that E levels are higher after a ph cycle due to the fact that when ur T levels are elevated your E levels also elevate to offset that. Therefore, when your go into PCT, your T levels drop off drastically until your own T rises again. Meanwhile estro is still elevated, hence the need for anti E such as Nolva. Is this incorrect?Originally Posted by Mavs
11-17-2004, 10:52 PM
look, the male body doesn't produce E ,whereas it does produce T. E in the male body comes from aromatization OF T. but the issue is this. after a cycle, the T/E RATIO is MUCH lower (ie much higher E in PROPORTION to T). THAT is the problem
levels of E are not the issue. the RATIO is the issue. Anti-e's lower E, which improves the RATIO
11-18-2004, 10:44 AM
OK, Now we have some that believe that estrogen levels are higher after a cycle. I understand that ratio between E/T is the real issue, but what it true, is estrogen levels higher or lower...Let's keep this discussion going. The more who chime in the closer we get to truth.
11-18-2004, 01:54 PM
- 6'0" 195 lbs.
- Join Date
- Jun 2004
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I heard that your estrogen levels rise quicker than test so thats why you need an anti e to keep the estrogen low and then you body raises test because you have neither.
11-18-2004, 07:09 PM
Ratio is key. Your body trys to keep certain levels of estrogen and testosterone. Obviously during a cycle, you have had much higher that normal levels of test. After a cycle your own test production is extremely low. Back to the question: what is your estrogen level??? Some would say estrogen is high because test has been high (body trying to balance that ratio)...and some would say low because most PH/PS don't aromatise and this is how our body makes estrogen, by test converting to estrogen.
Any other opinions/facts...someone have any studys they could post??? Any Mods wanna chime in???
11-19-2004, 12:07 AM
Originally Posted by Mavs
If E levels are low after a cycle then why the need for an anti-e?
11-19-2004, 06:41 AM
well first the aromatization brings estro up during cycle adn after cycle T is low E is high.
Secondly the aromatize enzyme is hgiher in body due to cyle and thus the a very good portion of the low T that is produced is turned into E.
Now the use of anti e is to shock the body of very low E levels. It sees this and makes more T to convert into E
11-19-2004, 07:51 AM
Would you agree with this: Since your body makes little estrogen & most estrogen is made my testosterone converting to estrogen. You have very little natural testosterone after a cycle, really none to convert to estrogen. So, let's say estrogen is slightly raised. Your t/e ratio is favoring estrogen (untill your natural test is restored)
11-19-2004, 04:18 PM
Yeah that sounds right but ive done a cycle without pct before and i can tell by the first week my body has started making at least a little T and that is being mostly converted to E.
11-19-2004, 07:36 PM
Why do you say that??? If Estrogen is present, then why would your body convert the little testosterone it has to estrogen??? Just curious!!!Originally Posted by BryanM
11-20-2004, 01:39 AM
From the weeks before it during the cycle. Your body keeps seeing the upped testosterone and trys to balance out the E in sink with T therefore it increases the aromatize enzyme and it is still increased for a matter of weeks( every person being case different).
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