M1,4AD - Your experience?
- 10-24-2004, 09:38 AM
M1,4AD - Your experience?
Hi everyone. I'm going to be doing a bulking cycle in a month or so. I'm *very* interested in trying M1,4AD because it's a precursor to Dianabol.
But... Dianabol is also notorious for causing water weight gain and gyno, and has a pretty bad reputation for producing temporary gains. I've searched through several threads, but haven't gained much insight about people's success using this compound. I don't see many comments that continue through PCT.
So - For those who've completed a cycle *and PCT*: How well does it work for bulking (strength and mass)? Are the gains temporary, or can they be kept? What did you stack with it, and why? Thanks for any replies
- 10-24-2004, 10:10 AM
It's pretty decent on its own but you need to dose it between 200 to 300mg/day. Obviousle it works better in a stack with something like 1 TEST or Tren. You have to expect some weight loss during PCT because of water loss. Overall, It is my favorite Methyl.
- 10-24-2004, 09:41 PM
I only used 60mg, but it works great stacked w/ 10mg M1T. It blunts the M1T sides better than most other combo options, including 4AD.
10-24-2004, 10:53 PM
I thought dbol was tough on the liver? If so, stacking m1t with m14 wouldnt be a very good idea...has anyone gotten bloodwork done for m14 yet?
10-24-2004, 10:56 PM
I believe that's because for a methyl, M1,4ADD is very low in hepatotoxicity, hence the 6 week ON cycles as opposed to M1T's 2 weeks and D-Bol's 4 weeks. But, I'd wait for somebody like Dr. D. to confirm that for you
EDIT: BTW, I'll be taking some soon stacked with SledgeTest and 1-Test. I've heard great things about it (mostly as part of a stack, not so much solo like with M1T or something), so I'm excited.
10-25-2004, 05:06 AM
Yes. Supersoldir had bloodwork done for Designer Supps. You might be able to find an article on it at DSs' website.Originally Posted by Enigma76
Bottom line, It was found to be reasonably mild.
10-25-2004, 06:00 PM
It may not be wise to combine them, but my instict is that the risk is justified. I feel so much better with the combo. I'm not recommending it, just saying that I generally have a good 'feel' for toxicity, but no numbers to quantitate in this case.
10-26-2004, 02:02 PM
I really don't have a problem with stacking methyls, in lighter doses anyway (puts on Nomex suit). My liver survived heavy drinking for 20 years, with nothing to show for it
What I haven't learned yet is how permanent any gains are - something I seem to have problems with... any input is welcome!
Last edited by IdahoSpud; 10-29-2004 at 08:21 AM.
10-26-2004, 03:20 PM
Generally, the "drier" the steroid the easier it is to keep the gains. There are so many variables to considder though when it comes to keeping gains. Two big ones are using propper PCT and keeping calories up for at least a couple weeks post cycle. I myself have made the mistake of trying to cut the fat gained on cycle too early and losing all my gains. Some lessons I have to learn the hard way.Originally Posted by IdahoSpud
10-26-2004, 06:53 PM
If I eat the same amount of calories pct my gains start to drop. I have to eat more pct. and thats pretty tough.
10-26-2004, 07:04 PM
I thought I read that SS's liver values were scary when he used both m14add and m1t together...
10-26-2004, 07:11 PM
yeah I read that too.
10-26-2004, 07:24 PM
But you have to take into account his liver values are scary on just M1T alone. LOL. I read that same thread.Originally Posted by g4ud1n
10-26-2004, 07:25 PM
It's obvious it was from the M1T , and if memory serves me right, he was not the only one to have bloodwork done.Originally Posted by g4ud1n
10-26-2004, 07:25 PM
i did a cycle of m1t weeks 1-2 and m14ad weeks 2-4. i know that is a short time but while i was on it i loved it. about a week in you will feel great and your appetite will sky rocket as well as your libido. even with the m1t, after my cycle was said and done, i did not even feel shut down! and the effects of the m14ad seemed to last for some time after i finished the cycle. pct consisted of nolva and then some clomid when i ran out of nolva. i kept every single pound but i also added some bodyfat cuz of all the food i ate while on the m14ad. i am ok with that though. i think 1 test trans with m14ad would be a good wat to go.
oh yeah and i gained 11 pounds
10-28-2004, 01:05 PM
Lean One, Are you saying you've used 200-300mg per day m1,4add?
10-28-2004, 01:25 PM
So you feel you were able to hang onto a good majority of the gains you attribute to M1,4?Originally Posted by Lean One
I too love this methyl but I have my doubts as to the longevity of the gains even with proper PCT and diet post cycle.
10-28-2004, 01:31 PM
In all honesty,when used alone it was tough to hold onto the gains. That's why It is best used in a stack or to jumpstart a cycle. That's when you can make the most of what it has to offer.Originally Posted by oldfart
10-28-2004, 01:37 PM
M1,4ADD vs 1,4 Andro
This question is not 100% in topic, but I'd like to know how M1,4ADD compares to 1,4 Andro.
10-28-2004, 01:47 PM
I don't think you can really compare the two since they are completely different.
10-28-2004, 01:51 PM
I mean in term of effects. I know the methylation changes a compound entirely. I'm considering to stock up one of the two...Originally Posted by ryansm
10-28-2004, 01:58 PM
I believe there is some threads that answer this pretty clearly. They definitely convert to different steroids.Originally Posted by Syr
1,4 is more for lean bulks where M1,4 is better for true bulks.
Considering the necessary dosage and the price per dose, stocking on either of these 2 is easier said than done. Although custom just lowered their price for M1,4 powder by 2 bucks a gram.
10-28-2004, 02:05 PM
Lots of people make this mistake Syr, but the effects are different too.
10-28-2004, 02:11 PM
does ANYBODY sell a 1,4 ESTERIFIED powder?
not a pre-made oral or some such, but an esterified powder for homebrewing?
10-28-2004, 02:16 PM
what was your dosing of each?Originally Posted by hogiejoe
10-28-2004, 02:16 PM
Actually, its not that i made a mistake, i completely dont know M1,4ADD as compound, while i already liked 1,4Andro (and cant find it in europe grr)
tnx for all the replies
10-28-2004, 02:38 PM
m1t........ 10 mgs weeks 1-2Originally Posted by gsteclipse97
m14ad.... 80 mgs weeks 2-4
this was my most succesful cycle yet(in terms of keeping gains) but i won't stack m1t with any other methylated compound again.
10-28-2004, 03:18 PM
nice i was thinking of something similarOriginally Posted by hogiejoe
10-28-2004, 04:53 PM
i'm pretty sure custom was trying to get 1,4 cyp check out his forum here
10-28-2004, 10:54 PM
what brands make m14ad and what form it is...oral, trans, powder...?
10-28-2004, 11:31 PM
I am two weeks in to a six week cycle. M1,4AD @ 140 mg/day, 1T and 4AD @ 400 mg/day transdermal. I love it so far. Positives: up 10 lbs, strength is up, libido is up, appetite is up, I look big. I feel like Superman. Negatives: Feel a little bloated, definately holding a lot of water, skin is oily, a few more zits than usual but who cares it's October in Michigan. Positives outweigh the negatives. This sure beats M1T. I feel horrible the whole time I take M1T. It is early but this shaping up to be my favorite cycle.
10-28-2004, 11:33 PM
sounds good alright, maybe a little high on the m14
10-29-2004, 02:28 AM
....any methyl is going to be oral. As for the brands, custom makes it and designer supps makes it.Originally Posted by Wolfe008
10-29-2004, 04:54 AM
The M stands for methylated. Methyl means oral. You can get it in tabs or powder to make an oral solution. Designersupps has tabs and Customnutrition has powder dirt cheap.Originally Posted by Wolfe008
10-29-2004, 10:17 AM
i do not understand how 140mg of m14ad can be to high.i think i have seen where people figure there is a 15% conversion from m14 to d-bole.most people recommend 25mg dbole daily why would'nt you take 160mg minimum of m14 to get to the basic rate of 25mg dbole.i am kinda lost on this and have seen several others talk about taking a very low rate of m14ad [70MG] i am a newbie been doing research but do not understand these wide fluctutions in the m14 rate?
10-29-2004, 10:26 AM
spongebob - It may not even be valid to compare m1,4ad hepatoxicity to dbol hepatoxicity.
Regardless of what it converts to, it's not the 15% that people are worried about. It's the whole 100% of your 140mg that is trying to get through your liver and possibly causing damage.
10-29-2004, 01:09 PM
good info. what are your stats?Originally Posted by Rock
10-29-2004, 03:13 PM
i see what you are saying.and if i understand you correctly then a person is better off using dbole for the gains and say at 25mg dbole is this easier on liver than how many mg of m14?thanks for the first reply.Originally Posted by rrgg
10-29-2004, 03:24 PM
If you mean this relative to hepatoxicity, then this might be true. I'm not sure. If you are saying this in general, then hell yes, dbol is better.Originally Posted by spongebob
I don't know how many mg m1,4ad is equal in toxicity to 25mg dbol. It's not a 1-1 relationship though. That's why I wrote the following:Originally Posted by spongebob
I was really just trying to say that you shouldn't focus on the 15% converted amount when considering hepatoxicity. The unconverted 140mg methyl is trying to get through your liver too. Someone please step in if I'm way off base here...Originally Posted by rrgg
Last edited by rrgg; 10-29-2004 at 05:26 PM.
10-29-2004, 05:01 PM
he's getting 1,4 acetate I believeOriginally Posted by glenihan
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