epistane as ai/test booster only

[dagger1]

What would the risk be of running epi 10mg mornings only 4weeks on 2weeks off. At low doses epis ai effects exceed its anabolic effects and boost lh and test. Similar to the idea of running anavar low dose mornings only impact to the hpta sould be minimal. Liver and lipid values shouldt be influenced at this low of a dose with 2week breaks either. Do you would get consistant results with little to no sides. Post or flame away

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

I'm gonna flame. Lol jk that's a stupid idea though, u wouldn't b suppressed or anything but u don't know how good the AI effect would b. I'm sure Erase or Forma would do a better job.

 

[dagger1]

It would still have the anabolic influence for 8 to 10 hrs a day that would far exceed natural recovery.

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

It would still have the anabolic influence for 8 to 10 hrs a day that would far exceed natural recovery.

Idk how u could even measure that though, it could b negligible.

 

[dagger1]

If its 10 to 12x more anabolic than test mg for mg then it would have the effect of 100mg + for the half day duration

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

If its 10 to 12x more anabolic than test mg for mg then it would have the effect of 100mg + for the half day duration

Those numbers don't equate to real life though.

 

[dagger1]

Should have put reasoning in original post to clear confusion for idea. No one reads 35 and older section. This idea wouldnt be for general user trying to make massive gains quick. This is for the 30plus generation that are in good health and allow them to gain lean muscle and burn fat ect like an 18-21 year old male. Similar to the idea of useing dhea but haveing it actually work without completely disrupting your natural test levels and hpta

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

Should have put reasoning in original post to clear confusion for idea. No one reads 35 and older section. This idea wouldnt be for general user trying to make massive gains quick. This is for the 30plus generation that are in good health and allow them to gain lean muscle and burn fat ect like an 18-21 year old male. Similar to the idea of useing dhea but haveing it actually work without completely disrupting your natural test levels and hpta

Ahhhhhhh okay I see now lol. I can see your reasoning now, r u on TRT too?

 

[dagger1]

No, dont qualify and lots of people insurance wouldnt cover it. Figured this would be affordable, around 25bucks for 6months. Question would be the safety of the idea

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

Idk how safe it would b. 6 months= 24 weeks= 168 days x 10mg= 1680mgs of epi. A week of epi at 30mg ED is 210mg/week, so 1680mgs of epi would b 30/30/30/30/30/30/30/30 so an 8 week cycle of epi at 30mg.

 

[dagger1]

Would use 4weeks on 2off to give body frequent breaks. At 10mg the ai effect shouldnt completely irradicate estrogen just lower it enough to signal lh pulses inturn more test production. There should still be some conversion to estrogen to keep lipids in check and bp from going up. But your t to e ratio could jump from a 7 to 1average to who knows which would be an advantage to a middle aged male. It would be 1800mgs over a year(2 bottles) would most likely. Take month or two off between bottles

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

we don't even really know that epi works as an AI anyways. Might or might not, some even say they get gyno while on the stuff if you believe that. but as for the anabolic effect I'd say there are better options to pulse like that.

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

Oh yeah I forgot 4 on 2 off. Well what's the worst that could happen, you'll just have to try it.

 

[dagger1]

Throwing ideas out there for future. Currently in last week of d-zine cycle. Would try anything new untill after pct and month or 2 off. As for ai effects i read different time frames anywhere from 14days to 2months after ending epi cycle, id trust lower end. The gyno seems to occure from higher dose cycle in some users possably from too little estrogen after cycle and improper pct protocals. Also its ability to utilize stim cells and lower fat storage would not allow the body (male body) to store estrogen in its normal manner and in turn have more effect on other tissues such as breast tissue which would then effect prolactin levels and what not. The whole reason for such a low dose.

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

Throwing ideas out there for future. Currently in last week of d-zine cycle. Would try anything new untill after pct and month or 2 off. As for ai effects i read different time frames anywhere from 14days to 2months after ending epi cycle, id trust lower end. The gyno seems to occure from higher dose cycle in some users possably from too little estrogen after cycle and improper pct protocals. Also its ability to utilize stim cells and lower fat storage would not allow the body (male body) to store estrogen in its normal manner and in turn have more effect on other tissues such as breast tissue which would then effect prolactin levels and what not. The whole reason for such a low dose.

Yeah that's what I've concluded too, plus ppl use nolva with epi which they shouldn't do.

 

[dagger1]

I dont agree on tapering any steroid but if epi is an effective ai at low dose i think it might be effective as its own pct as a e3d pulse, would not meet the non hormonal requirements needed by most anabolics but it could be an exception to the rule. It would be nice to see university studies on the designers available to see the impact on the body. But no one knows for sure of its true ai effect. Proviron works great in pct, other than its a methyl id think epi could work, hell they make a few otc pct with it in it that get slandered by everyone who uses traditional protocals but the few logs ive read of people useing arimedexin with havoc love it and have great recovery and no trouble keeping gains(yet to see bloodwork on it though)

 

[schwellington]

This is not a good idea

 

[dagger1]

This is not a good idea

Never said any of it was a good idea, its why i put the question out there. As for tapering i still wouldnt do it without seeing studies done i was just stateing if epi did have its claimed properties and were as effective as claimed in theory it would work, i wouldnt or wouldnt expect anyone to be a guine pig to the idea. I may in time try the 4weeks on 2 weeks off at 10mg as a maintance/slow developement practice unless someone can point out reasons that could have high risk or damage

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

Never said any of it was a good idea, its why i put the question out there. As for tapering i still wouldnt do it without seeing studies done i was just stateing if epi did have its claimed properties and were as effective as claimed in theory it would work, i wouldnt or wouldnt expect anyone to be a guine pig to the idea. I may in time try the 4weeks on 2 weeks off at 10mg as a maintance/slow developement practice unless someone can point out reasons that could have high risk or damage

Its really an unknown, i'd b intrigued to see what bloodwork would show.

 

[alwaysfirst]

Intersting, keep me posted

 

[heavylifter33]

we don't even really know that epi works as an AI anyways. Might or might not, some even say they get gyno while on the stuff if you believe that. but as for the anabolic effect I'd say there are better options to pulse like that.

WUT? uh...... not sure if srs

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

WUT? uh...... not sure if srs

you know for a fact it acts as an AI? If you have data and research to prove this I'd love to see it....I didn't feel any AI effect from it, nor did I get any creaky joints....I'm not saying it doesn't, just saying I haven't seen anything that proves it DOES....and for that matter even if it does, it probably varies from person to person.....unlike a true AI....

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

you know for a fact it acts as an AI? If you have data and research to prove this I'd love to see it....I didn't feel any AI effect from it, nor did I get any creaky joints....I'm not saying it doesn't, just saying I haven't seen anything that proves it DOES....and for that matter even if it does, it probably varies from person to person.....unlike a true AI....

It works like an AI for me definitely, but yeah everyone is different.

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

It works like an AI for me definitely, but yeah everyone is different.

in other words I was trying to say, is there any actual research on this? where you KNOW its acting as an AI? or does it just give some sides similar to an AI, but its actually not? like controlled studies where we see decreases in estrogen from using epi? I just don't recall seeing anything on the subject other than anecdotal reports from individual users. unless someone got bloodwork done with estrogen #'s to prove this...provided they used only epi of course....

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

in other words I was trying to say, is there any actual research on this? where you KNOW its acting as an AI? or does it just give some sides similar to an AI, but its actually not? like controlled studies where we see decreases in estrogen from using epi? I just don't recall seeing anything on the subject other than anecdotal reports from individual users. unless someone got bloodwork done with estrogen #'s to prove this...provided they used only epi of course....

Yeah I know what u mean, u need to see on cycle bloodwork and pre bloodwork of the person's baseline estrogen.

 

[dagger1]

Most bloodwork from epi cycle do show very low to non existant e2 levels, but the same goes with any compound that doesnt aromatise. Need to see bloodwork a few weeks after pct to see if e levels are still low

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

Most bloodwork from epi cycle do show very low to non existant e2 levels, but the same goes with any compound that doesnt aromatise. Need to see bloodwork a few weeks after pct to see if e levels are still low

Cuz how long is the AI effect u said?

 

[Whacked]

Sup Dagger.

I question why you think EPI would be superior for said cause in lieu of a potent AI like Erase. Moreover, doing things to support maximum endogenous production (such as the Erase) and lifestyle choices (food, stress, exercise, etc) along with Test Boosters (there are actually efficacious choices these days).

That said, I can appreciate the clever thought process here but I think you run the risk of adversely affecting HPTA.

As it is with moth hormonal pathways in the body, this is a tightly regulated system. As such, with consistent (daily) manipulation, you will inevitably impact the HPTA (at the very least, slightly). Additionally, in light of your strategy, cummulatively you will influence the axis. Only time will tell if it will shut you down or cause delayed recovery or permanent issues (highly doubtful).

What would the risk be of running epi 10mg mornings only 4weeks on 2weeks off. At low doses epis ai effects exceed its anabolic effects and boost lh and test. Similar to the idea of running anavar low dose mornings only impact to the hpta sould be minimal. Liver and lipid values shouldt be influenced at this low of a dose with 2week breaks either. Do you would get consistant results with little to no sides. Post or flame away

 

[jbryand101b]

Epi doesn't have any more anti e properties than other androgens like dht.

 

[dagger1]

Cuz how long is the AI effect u said?

Claims of ai effect are from a few weeks to a few months, so if they are accurate then test to estrogen ratio should still be very broad even a few weeks after pct if it has long lasting effects. I do know typical signs of low estrogen exist because most users of epi keep muscle hardness, vascularity and fat metabolism well after cycle is over. It may also be why epi gains are easier to maintain after cycle compaired to m-drol or h-drol.

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

Claims of ai effect are from a few weeks to a few months, so if they are accurate then test to estrogen ratio should still be very broad even a few weeks after pct if it has long lasting effects. I do know typical signs of low estrogen exist because most users of epi keep muscle hardness, vascularity and fat metabolism well after cycle is over. It may also be why epi gains are easier to maintain after cycle compaired to m-drol or h-drol.

Yes I do have to agree with, not to mention the dry joints. I'm on epi now.

 

[dagger1]

Ran idea past doctor that lifts at my gym. He suggested against it simply that it is not the same as trt in anyway and that oral delivery would not be the way to go and after a few rounds it would catch up with me. Told me if i choose to experiment with my own body which he is not advising then to at least keep time on and time off the same. Said if he were to choose somthing like this he would run 2weeks on and 2weeks off and only run three or four short cycles max and then take few months odd. Said not to use any oral more than 15 to 16 weeks out of the year. Suggested just ordering test if i have a sourse and running it at a low dose in 3week cycles to keep supression low and run mild pct on off time

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

Ran idea past doctor that lifts at my gym. He suggested against it simply that it is not the same as trt in anyway and that oral delivery would not be the way to go and after a few rounds it would catch up with me. Told me if i choose to experiment with my own body which he is not advising then to at least keep time on and time off the same. Said if he were to choose somthing like this he would run 2weeks on and 2weeks off and only run three or four short cycles max and then take few months odd. Said not to use any oral more than 15 to 16 weeks out of the year. Suggested just ordering test if i have a sourse and running it at a low dose in 3week cycles to keep supression low and run mild pct on off time

Yeah I figured there would b some type of drawback with running it like that. So I guess test is the way to go for u bro.

 

[jason79]

WUT? uh...... not sure if srs

It's also important to remember that the anti-e properties are shown with the unmethylated molecule that's (was) prescribed as a breast cancer treatment in Japan. The otc ds epi, is 17a-methylated which makes it a different molecule.

 

[Whacked]

Your Doc is wise

LOL

Ran idea past doctor that lifts at my gym. He suggested against it simply that it is not the same as trt in anyway and that oral delivery would not be the way to go and after a few rounds it would catch up with me. Told me if i choose to experiment with my own body which he is not advising then to at least keep time on and time off the same. Said if he were to choose somthing like this he would run 2weeks on and 2weeks off and only run three or four short cycles max and then take few months odd. Said not to use any oral more than 15 to 16 weeks out of the year. Suggested just ordering test if i have a sourse and running it at a low dose in 3week cycles to keep supression low and run mild pct on off time

Sup Dagger.

I question why you think EPI would be superior for said cause in lieu of a potent AI like Erase. Moreover, doing things to support maximum endogenous production (such as the Erase) and lifestyle choices (food, stress, exercise, etc) along with Test Boosters (there are actually efficacious choices these days).

That said, I can appreciate the clever thought process here but I think you run the risk of adversely affecting HPTA.

As it is with moth hormonal pathways in the body, this is a tightly regulated system. As such, with consistent (daily) manipulation, you will inevitably impact the HPTA (at the very least, slightly). Additionally, in light of your strategy, cummulatively you will influence the axis. Only time will tell if it will shut you down or cause delayed recovery or permanent issues (highly doubtful).

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

Your Doc is wise

LOL

Whacked u hit the nail on the head brother.

 

[Whacked]

Not really, I was a lil upset I finally got it right and I got blown off

LMAO

haha

Whacked u hit the nail on the head brother.

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

Not really, I was a lil upset I finally got it right and I got blown off

LMAO

haha

Lol I feel u bro, your points made sense though.

 

[Whacked]

haha thanks pimp LOL

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

Not really, I was a lil upset I finally got it right and I got blown off

LMAO

haha

actually....what happened was....we all got together and decided you got SO MANY things wrong in the past, we figured you need to get SEVERAL things nailed on the head....and THEN we will give you credit....but not just for one nail on the head LMFAO! (j/k of course.....)

 

[Whacked]

HAHAHA! LOLOL

 

[dagger1]

Finished d-zine cycle, decided to expeirment with epi as morning only bridge pre pct, on second week. Gained 8lbs on d-zine recomp. 10 days into epi(dynamic formulas 15mg) 15mg at 9am ed. Useing finaflex preworkout in combo. So far havent lost weight or strength, libido is back up, no crash comeing off d-zine. Figured 30 days on epi to help solidify gains(vascularity is going up dramaticly on epi) then starting clomid and pct support supps. Didnt have much atrophy from dymeth at 15,15,15,30,30 over 5weeks but did get shutdown and total loss of libido in 4th week which came back 4th day on epi. Ill repost after 30th day before pct

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

Finished d-zine cycle, decided to expeirment with epi as morning only bridge pre pct, on second week. Gained 8lbs on d-zine recomp. 10 days into epi(dynamic formulas 15mg) 15mg at 9am ed. Useing finaflex preworkout in combo. So far havent lost weight or strength, libido is back up, no crash comeing off d-zine. Figured 30 days on epi to help solidify gains(vascularity is going up dramaticly on epi) then starting clomid and pct support supps. Didnt have much atrophy from dymeth at 15,15,15,30,30 over 5weeks but did get shutdown and total loss of libido in 4th week which came back 4th day on epi. Ill repost after 30th day before pct

That's pretty interesting.

 

[dagger1]

Testing its possabilities as low dose solidification and allowing the body to bounce back a little on its own to make simplified pct which im hopeing will be a breeze

 

[dagger1]

22days into morning only epi bridge. Strength and lbm gains still at 7 of 8lbs. Feel great all day, vascularity up some(expecially early day and for 4 to 5hrs after workouts) . Quite certain its lh boosting effects are accurate as the boys are swollen every morning and sex drive is very high(wife likes). 8days and will start post cycle, will likely use this method in future to help mature shrot oral cycles unless somthing doesnt pan out once pct is started.

 

[alwaysfirst]

22days into morning only epi bridge. Strength and lbm gains still at 7 of 8lbs. Feel great all day, vascularity up some(expecially early day and for 4 to 5hrs after workouts) . Quite certain its lh boosting effects are accurate as the boys are swollen every morning and sex drive is very high(wife likes). 8days and will start post cycle, will likely use this method in future to help mature shrot oral cycles unless somthing doesnt pan out once pct is started.

Good job!
Do you do 15mg everyday first thing? Do "feel" good at nights also and how's your sleep?

 

[dagger1]

Only 15mg at 9am. Sleep is 6 to 8hrs(normal for me) feel fine at night, appitite stays strong, normally dont feel tired or worn down untill around 10pm(my job works the crap out of me in 90+ tempatures). Did get typical epi constipation and some mild stomach cramps but are bearable.

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

22days into morning only epi bridge. Strength and lbm gains still at 7 of 8lbs. Feel great all day, vascularity up some(expecially early day and for 4 to 5hrs after workouts) . Quite certain its lh boosting effects are accurate as the boys are swollen every morning and sex drive is very high(wife likes). 8days and will start post cycle, will likely use this method in future to help mature shrot oral cycles unless somthing doesnt pan out once pct is started.

Very good to hear actually, I'm glad this is working out perfectly.

 

[Lhns2]

Dang, awesome to hear this is working so well.

Sent from my super duper VS920 4G using Am.com app!

 

[dagger1]

NO

Very good to hear actually, I'm glad this is working out perfectly.

Wont know if it works perfectly untill the start of pct next week. If it works out should be near 50% of natural test production im hopeing and then sail through pct without loseing strength or muscle