The best legal ph for bulking???

[survey]

Im looking for the best ph to help me gain some muscle weight thats easy to maintain. Also, I dont want to deal with superdrol-like sides.

 

[live to lift]

Hdrol or epi but getting and keeping gains will be in the food you eat. And propper pct!

 

[live to lift]

Do your research.

2nd that

 

[ManBeast]

Age? training history? stats (ht/wt/bodyfat?)

 

[fueledpassion]

As I've said in other threads, you can either choose to eat clean and only reasonable amounts of calories and put on lean mass only (those lbs are the easiest to keep), or u can eat dirty like the majority and have a swinging weight during the 4 to 6 weeks of PCT. Ur choice. Personally, I'd suggest setting modest goals in total weight gain and try to clean up the diet before starting the cycle. Whats better to u - having 15lbs of mass in 4 weeks only to keep 6-7 or to just put on 6-7lbs and keep 6-7lbs?

 

[JoeySon]

As I've said in other threads, you can either choose to eat clean and only reasonable amounts of calories and put on lean mass only (those lbs are the easiest to keep), or u can eat dirty like the majority and have a swinging weight during the 4 to 6 weeks of PCT. Ur choice. Personally, I'd suggest setting modest goals in total weight gain and try to clean up the diet before starting the cycle. Whats better to u - having 15lbs of mass in 4 weeks only to keep 6-7 or to just put on 6-7lbs and keep 6-7lbs?

So I can't bulk with mozzarella sticks and hotdogs?!

 

[ISU152]

So I can't bulk with mozzarella sticks and hotdogs?!

you can bulk your gut up :dance:

 

[JoeySon]

Haha I'm just a smart ass, I never understood "dirty bulking", I'm sure it works for some people but to
Me it's just an excuse to eat like **** for a couple months

 

[machorox123]

Haha I'm just a smart ass, I never understood "dirty bulking", I'm sure it works for some people but to
Me it's just an excuse to eat like **** for a couple months

I wish I could dirty bulk.. I hate people with amazing genes

 

[ISU152]

Haha I'm just a smart ass, I never understood "dirty bulking", I'm sure it works for some people but to
Me it's just an excuse to eat like **** for a couple months

Yeah, by no means would I say that I bulk cleanly but I don't go overboard like a lot of guys

 

[grngoloco]

I just say I'm bulking wgen I get cravings... lol

 

[mtb2005]

As I've said in other threads, you can either choose to eat clean and only reasonable amounts of calories and put on lean mass only (those lbs are the easiest to keep), or u can eat dirty like the majority and have a swinging weight during the 4 to 6 weeks of PCT. Ur choice. Personally, I'd suggest setting modest goals in total weight gain and try to clean up the diet before starting the cycle. Whats better to u - having 15lbs of mass in 4 weeks only to keep 6-7 or to just put on 6-7lbs and keep 6-7lbs?

Could not AGREE MORE! Well said.

To add to that:

PH are illegal in the US so there are no "legal" ph anymore, the new stuff is hogwash. Secondly, with the versions that were banned--you get half the results with twice the negative side effects.

My suggestion is follow this prior diet advice----take in 1.5-2 grams of protein per body lb and consume 3000 calories or more a day. Make sure you eat every 3 hours and make sure you eat I'm the AM--the highest NATURAL TEST LEVELS--and only consume a protein hake before bed---your body fasts over night and isn't active so no carbs. Consume enough water but not too much--too much water flushes vitamins.

If you wanna use anything use the real stuff man--your body will thank in the short and long term.

Supplements to take with or without anabolics:

Glutamine--10g a day spread evenly. Take 2g during workout if you want as it is greatly diminished when lifting heavy weights.

Creatine--no explanation needed since I'm sure you've used this thinking it will get you "jacked"

L-argnine-- pre cursor to nitric oxide. It displayed your blood vessels which allows for more oxygen and nutrients to flow to your muscles hence increasing your pump and increasing vascularity

BCAA-little bit of everything in it--essential to maintain anabolism and prevent catabolism.

Acetyl L-Cartiniine (Very under the radar IMO)---this will assist with natural test levels, enhanced mood supposedly as well and may prevent water retention allegedly.

If you still want to go the PH route----you'll need Liver protection so milk thistle. And PCT just like anabolics as it inhibits your HPTA (lowers natural test in laymen terms)---you'll need REAL stuff clomid, nolvadex(not the xt junk in stores), maybe hcg.

You can go on eBay and still get the banned stuff --SPAWN is what I'd go with--similar again allegedly to Trenbolone the most potent AAS there is.

Hopefully this helps. Good luck and be safe. Read read read read and research more.

 

[fueledpassion]

Could not AGREE MORE! Well said.

To add to that:

PH are illegal in the US so there are no "legal" ph anymore, the new stuff is hogwash. Secondly, with the versions that were banned--you get half the results with twice the negative side effects.

My suggestion is follow this prior diet advice----take in 1.5-2 grams of protein per body lb and consume 3000 calories or more a day. Make sure you eat every 3 hours and make sure you eat I'm the AM--the highest NATURAL TEST LEVELS--and only consume a protein hake before bed---your body fasts over night and isn't active so no carbs. Consume enough water but not too much--too much water flushes vitamins.

If you wanna use anything use the real stuff man--your body will thank in the short and long term.

Supplements to take with or without anabolics:

Glutamine--10g a day spread evenly. Take 2g during workout if you want as it is greatly diminished when lifting heavy weights.

Creatine--no explanation needed since I'm sure you've used this thinking it will get you "jacked"

L-argnine-- pre cursor to nitric oxide. It displayed your blood vessels which allows for more oxygen and nutrients to flow to your muscles hence increasing your pump and increasing vascularity

BCAA-little bit of everything in it--essential to maintain anabolism and prevent catabolism.

Acetyl L-Cartiniine (Very under the radar IMO)---this will assist with natural test levels, enhanced mood supposedly as well and may prevent water retention allegedly.

If you still want to go the PH route----you'll need Liver protection so milk thistle. And PCT just like anabolics as it inhibits your HPTA (lowers natural test in laymen terms)---you'll need REAL stuff clomid, nolvadex(not the xt junk in stores), maybe hcg.

You can go on eBay and still get the banned stuff --SPAWN is what I'd go with--similar again allegedly to Trenbolone the most potent AAS there is.

Hopefully this helps. Good luck and be safe. Read read read read and research more.

Commenting only on those in bold:

Just wait and see my end cycle pics! Test/EQ/MAST...so freggin awesome imo. I've put on solid muscle this time around. Never in my past has an oral done for me what the good stuff has. And best yet, I still have 5 weeks or so left!

As for SPAWN, that's pretty old school, but not too old lol. It's actually a stack between pro-dienolone (X-Tren) and Epistane. It's a good lean muscle mass gainer and usually provides 10-15lbs of gains for most people BUT it hurts the joints. Neither of those convert to estrogen which is another reason I would personally run hCG on a cycle of that even if the cycle were only 4 weeks. Thats just me though.

 

[hvactech]

Could not AGREE MORE! Well said.

To add to that:

PH are illegal in the US so there are no "legal" ph anymore, the new stuff is hogwash. Secondly, with the versions that were banned--you get half the results with twice the negative side effects.

My suggestion is follow this prior diet advice----take in 1.5-2 grams of protein per body lb and consume 3000 calories or more a day. Make sure you eat every 3 hours and make sure you eat I'm the AM--the highest NATURAL TEST LEVELS--and only consume a protein hake before bed---your body fasts over night and isn't active so no carbs. Consume enough water but not too much--too much water flushes vitamins.

If you wanna use anything use the real stuff man--your body will thank in the short and long term.

Supplements to take with or without anabolics:

Glutamine--10g a day spread evenly. Take 2g during workout if you want as it is greatly diminished when lifting heavy weights.

Creatine--no explanation needed since I'm sure you've used this thinking it will get you "jacked"

L-argnine-- pre cursor to nitric oxide. It displayed your blood vessels which allows for more oxygen and nutrients to flow to your muscles hence increasing your pump and increasing vascularity

BCAA-little bit of everything in it--essential to maintain anabolism and prevent catabolism.

Acetyl L-Cartiniine (Very under the radar IMO)---this will assist with natural test levels, enhanced mood supposedly as well and may prevent water retention allegedly.

If you still want to go the PH route----you'll need Liver protection so milk thistle. And PCT just like anabolics as it inhibits your HPTA (lowers natural test in laymen terms)---you'll need REAL stuff clomid, nolvadex(not the xt junk in stores), maybe hcg.

You can go on eBay and still get the banned stuff --SPAWN is what I'd go with--similar again allegedly to Trenbolone the most potent AAS there is.

Hopefully this helps. Good luck and be safe. Read read read read and research more.

dont agree entirely on this post...creatine, beta alanine, and/or agmatine would be your staples for supps, at least for the majority of people.....glutamine and arginine? dont waste your time or money!

 

[Husker89]

glutamine is a great supplement idiot, arginine i agree sycks but glutamine is super important for your stomach, its in your stomach lining and needs replenshing every2-3 days and your muscle besides water is heavily made up of glutamine.

dont agree entirely on this post...creatine, beta alanine, and/or agmatine would be your staples for supps, at least for the majority of people.....glutamine and arginine? dont waste your time or money!

 

[hvactech]

glutamine is a great supplement idiot, arginine i agree sycks but glutamine is super important for your stomach, its in your stomach lining and needs replenshing every2-3 days and your muscle besides water is heavily made up of glutamine.

wow.. so we are name calling are we, save your immaturity for another website smart guy

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/weight-loss/46550-glutamine-very-important.html

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplements/46367-glutamine.html

 

[Husker89]

just dont give bad advice, glutamine is sooo cheap too, there is no reason not to take it.

wow.. so we are name calling are we, save your immaturity for another website smart guy

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/weight-loss/46550-glutamine-very-important.html

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplements/46367-glutamine.html

 

[hvactech]

just dont give bad advice, glutamine is sooo cheap too, there is no reason not to take it.

likewise.....the glutamine debate will go on forever but each is their own when it comes down to it....

 

[Husker89]

fair enough sorry for getting angry ive been dealing with a lot of people saying some crazy **** like injecting clomid lol

likewise.....the glutamine debate will go on forever but each is their own when it comes down to it....

 

[hvactech]

yeah i was just reading the post earlier on that one

 

[jbryand101b]

yeah i was just reading the post earlier on that one

goose creek eh? how's life out there in the creek? im from scummerville.

anyhow, if i take glutamine, will i get big an smert like you guyz?

 

[hvactech]

goose creek eh? how's life out there in the creek? im from scummerville.

anyhow, if i take glutamine, will i get big an smert like you guyz?

grew up in summerville and went to fort...as long as you stack it with tribulus

 

[JoeySon]

fair enough sorry for getting angry ive been dealing with a lot of people saying some crazy **** like injecting clomid lol

Yea husker I saw that thread the other day too..wow, just wow.

 

[schwellington]

Could not AGREE MORE! Well said.

To add to that:

PH are illegal in the US so there are no "legal" ph anymore, the new stuff is hogwash. Secondly, with the versions that were banned--you get half the results with twice the negative side effects.

My suggestion is follow this prior diet advice----take in 1.5-2 grams of protein per body lb and consume 3000 calories or more a day. Make sure you eat every 3 hours and make sure you eat I'm the AM--the highest NATURAL TEST LEVELS--and only consume a protein hake before bed---your body fasts over night and isn't active so no carbs. Consume enough water but not too much--too much water flushes vitamins.

If you wanna use anything use the real stuff man--your body will thank in the short and long term.

Supplements to take with or without anabolics:

Glutamine--10g a day spread evenly. Take 2g during workout if you want as it is greatly diminished when lifting heavy weights.

Creatine--no explanation needed since I'm sure you've used this thinking it will get you "jacked"

L-argnine-- pre cursor to nitric oxide. It displayed your blood vessels which allows for more oxygen and nutrients to flow to your muscles hence increasing your pump and increasing vascularity

BCAA-little bit of everything in it--essential to maintain anabolism and prevent catabolism.

Acetyl L-Cartiniine (Very under the radar IMO)---this will assist with natural test levels, enhanced mood supposedly as well and may prevent water retention allegedly.

If you still want to go the PH route----you'll need Liver protection so milk thistle. And PCT just like anabolics as it inhibits your HPTA (lowers natural test in laymen terms)---you'll need REAL stuff clomid, nolvadex(not the xt junk in stores), maybe hcg.

You can go on eBay and still get the banned stuff --SPAWN is what I'd go with--similar again allegedly to Trenbolone the most potent AAS there is.

Hopefully this helps. Good luck and be safe. Read read read read and research more.

Spawn is nothing like trenbolone

I've used trenbolone


Spawn is a combo of dienolone and epithio aka epi

 

[jbryand101b]

PH are illegal in the US so there are no "legal" ph anymore, the new stuff is hogwash. Secondly, with the versions that were banned--you get half the results with twice the negative side effects.

Read read read read and research more.

what is bolded is good advice, you should stop giving it out, and take your own medicine, cause everything you said about steroids and pro hormones is complete bull shiit.

whats up with all the dumbassses posting dumb shiit.

 

[jbryand101b]

Spawn is nothing like trenbolone

I've used trenbolone


Spawn is a combo of dienolone and epithio aka epi

incorrect.

 

[ManBeast]

Agreed, that is like saying Equipoise and Dianabol are nothing alike, just because they behave differently doesn't mean they aren't chemically similar.

 

[zendog]

High dose epi works almost as good as Superdrol for me

 

[fueledpassion]

Agreed, that is like saying Equipoise and Dianabol are nothing alike, just because they behave differently doesn't mean they aren't chemically similar.

While in one way your point is right, in another Schwellington's point is equally right. So they are chemically similar, but in fact one gives dry, slow gains while the other gives instant wet gains. One has little to no conversion to estrogen while the other has lots of conversion to estrogen. One is hard on the joints while the other is not..get the drift?

Dienolone IS NOT as strong as Trenbolone. And 200mg/day of pro-dienolone still wouldn't amount to 400-500mg of Tren-E or 300mg of Tren-A per week.

While chemically the pro-dienolone is very similar to Trenbolone molecule, it would be unwise to tell someone that they are very similar in nature. They simply aren't. Trenbolone is 500/500 and anabolic/androgenic ratio which is unheard of. Something with that much androgenic activity is ridiculously strong unlike dienolone and nandrolone. Dienolone is very low in androgenic activity as well as nandrolone (Deca). They both are less than half as androgenic as test (<50)...Also, Trenbolone has a much more exaggerated effect on thermogenesis. I recall night sweats with dienolone's to be at random and usually a pretty mild situation of sweating and insomnia - nothing benadryl couldn't fix. Yet when my brother took Trenbolone sleep was impossible and the night sweats were so bad that he thought he'd pissed his bed when he woke up the next morning.

 

[Husker89]

ya for real and this guy saying all prohormones suck and u get twice the negative affects with everyone versus the older steroids. CRAZY

Yea husker I saw that thread the other day too..wow, just wow.

 

[Husker89]

to MTB2005 explain why u believe u get half the results and twice the negatives sides with newer drugs, or do u wanna just say ur an idiot and take the statement back?

what is bolded is good advice, you should stop giving it out, and take your own medicine, cause everything you said about steroids and pro hormones is complete bull shiit.

whats up with all the dumbassses posting dumb shiit.

 

[jbryand101b]

While in one way your point is right, in another Schwellington's point is equally right. So they are chemically similar, but in fact one gives dry, slow gains while the other gives instant wet gains. One has little to no conversion to estrogen while the other has lots of conversion to estrogen. One is hard on the joints while the other is not..get the drift?

Dienolone IS NOT as strong as Trenbolone. And 200mg/day of pro-dienolone still wouldn't amount to 400-500mg of Tren-E or 300mg of Tren-A per week.

While chemically the pro-dienolone is very similar to Trenbolone molecule, it would be unwise to tell someone that they are very similar in nature. They simply aren't. Trenbolone is 500/500 and anabolic/androgenic ratio which is unheard of. Something with that much androgenic activity is ridiculously strong unlike dienolone and nandrolone. Dienolone is very low in androgenic activity as well as nandrolone (Deca). They both are less than half as androgenic as test (<50)...Also, Trenbolone has a much more exaggerated effect on thermogenesis. I recall night sweats with dienolone's to be at random and usually a pretty mild situation of sweating and insomnia - nothing benadryl couldn't fix. Yet when my brother took Trenbolone sleep was impossible and the night sweats were so bad that he thought he'd pissed his bed when he woke up the next morning.

i have no idea what your point is?

 

[fueledpassion]

The part where Schwellington was told that his opinion about Spawn being nothing like Trenbolone "was incorrect". There were two posts arguing with his statement and my point is regarding those comments.

 

[mtb2005]

From Many forums, much reading and from PERSONAL USE. There's a reason they were banned outright, steroids are scheduled need a px for most.

You telling me Real chemicals don't work better than PH's is asinine and whomever said I should heed my own advice is also a moron.

Ph are just that drugs altered to increase hormone production in your body where as juice is the actual hormone/chemical itself IM released--intra muscular for you guys who are uninformed.

Additionally, when steroids are injected IM, they by pass liver and kidney and are not 17aa altered--they are release directly into your blood stream over time depending upon their ester--ester for those of who don't know is the manner on which the chemical is bounded to carbon atoms changing when it's released. No liver issues there. And PH's can work but not as well as real juice.

You wanna bulk up lean---EQ/test or Tren/test. Versus a PH

Hmmmm? That's like saying smoking that fake pot works better than weed in getting you stoned.

 

[mtb2005]

And glutamine along woth BCAAs are proven to be anticatabolic--seen it on this site as a matter of fact. L--Arginine like I said is a precursor to nitric oxide--dudes use it For limp dick bc of the pump it gives by dialiting blood vessels....you could also jus use a ore work out supp like Jack3d, Assault, or c4.

 

[mtb2005]

Saying PH work just as good as real hormones is asinine. That's like saying that fake K9 stuff gets u a high as good as real weed. Lmao.

My logic behind twice the negatives half the results? Personal experience myself and experience with 3 other people I know. Terrible acne and gyno main problems. I still got bad sides from real stuff but liver wasn't affected.

All I'm saying real stuff is better for you bc you know exactly what is in it. The PH you really have no clue aside from
What they "tell you"

 

[Husker89]

but that is a different argument. Ur saying the compounds are better for u in both ways positive and negative affects because they just are, not because supplements are MISLABELED. O you have anecedotal evidence with a whole three people AND yourself, that is some solid logic dude.

Saying PH work just as good as real hormones is asinine. That's like saying that fake K9 stuff gets u a high as good as real weed. Lmao.

My logic behind twice the negatives half the results? Personal experience myself and experience with 3 other people I know. Terrible acne and gyno main problems. I still got bad sides from real stuff but liver wasn't affected.

All I'm saying real stuff is better for you bc you know exactly what is in it. The PH you really have no clue aside from
What they "tell you"

 

[Husker89]

when u say prohormones u are talking about legal steroids right like superdrorl and halodrol.

Saying PH work just as good as real hormones is asinine. That's like saying that fake K9 stuff gets u a high as good as real weed. Lmao.

My logic behind twice the negatives half the results? Personal experience myself and experience with 3 other people I know. Terrible acne and gyno main problems. I still got bad sides from real stuff but liver wasn't affected.

All I'm saying real stuff is better for you bc you know exactly what is in it. The PH you really have no clue aside from
What they "tell you"

 

[mtb2005]

I never said MISLABELED my man. Did that word ever creep onto my post? No I did not.

Prohormones are not as good as real anabolics Period. And yes SuperDrol is known to make hair drop from follicles like crazy (so does tren) especially if you are dispositions to it. If you want anecdotal evidence google it.

the 2nd generation PH's are crap compared to the stuff that came Out before the ban.

 

[mtb2005]

The new SuperDrol isn't the same as the SuperDrol that came out 10 years ago. Legal steroids are available with a px. PH are not legal steroids no Matter what advertisement your reading in muscle mags.

 

[Husker89]

A. Mislabeled means what ur retarded ass said that "they dont have what they say in the bottle" that means the bottle is mislabeled. Also deca is a legal steroid and u can get deca dick and the worst suppression from that. Obviously superdrol is harsh but to say all of these are twice as bad on both side(positive and negative affects) is just wrong. I dont read muscle magazines and i know 10 times what ur retarted ass does. So if a steroid is legal meaning a doctor writes it versus a steroid that is legal without a prescription one is someone superior to the other because of a piece of paper by a doctor, nice try but admit ur an idiot and get on with it.

The new SuperDrol isn't the same as the SuperDrol that came out 10 years ago. Legal steroids are available with a px. PH are not legal steroids no Matter what advertisement your reading in muscle mags.

 

[mtb2005]

I said when you dont know whats in it, as in proprietary blends with labels that you the consumer just dont know what that is. Its a rule of thumb saying about PH--twice the sides half the results But ok dude you're right I'm wrong PH are better than real steroids. You can retort but I'm done.

"never argue with a fool, people my not know the difference."

 

[mtb2005]

Don't get it twisted though, I never said they don't work. But they are hepatoxic 17aa alkylates and people Tend I over due it bc they can legally buy them and f themselves up in the long run

 

[Husker89]

methytestosterone and dianabol are 17aa and they are the "good" steroids, so ur argument again falters. I like injectable and old school steroids better than newere steroids too (dont call one kind real and the other not they are both real steroids that isnt debatable) but to say that one has twice the sides and half the positive affects is retarded, and then to say cuz they are methylated but so is dianabol and methlytestosterone which are "good" steroids.

Don't get it twisted though, I never said they don't work. But they are hepatoxic 17aa alkylates and people Tend I over due it bc they can legally buy them and f themselves up in the long run

 

[Husker89]

and for people getting them easier and misusing them that is an abuse problem as it would be with dianabol or testosterone if too much is used NOT a inherent compound problem, argument continues to falter.

Don't get it twisted though, I never said they don't work. But they are hepatoxic 17aa alkylates and people Tend I over due it bc they can legally buy them and f themselves up in the long run

 

[mtb2005]

I'm well aware dbol and winni and anavar are 17aa--quit talking like a condescending prick. Stop talking like A. A hardass and B. a dbag. Debate with class.

Secondly these new hdrol n sdrol products pale in comparison to first generation. And none compare to real anabolics so any argument
You make against that is flawed.

Regardless you don't discuss you scream and yell like a moron. I'm done with this thread. People like you an your attitude RUIN forums. Go with huskers advice all--I don't know anything except my entire first post was right on. See yas

 

[Husker89]

ur argument keeps changing first it was newer steroids are half as effective and twice as bad on sides, then when u realized that was wrong you say "ur screaming and yelling" even though all i have is nicely placed points no exclamation marks so thats stupid, then i have a "bad attitude" and now ur leaving cuz ur so right that u cant even post anymore( bc u have no argument and u know it)

I'm well aware dbol and winni and anavar are 17aa--quit talking like a condescending prick. Stop talking like A. A hardass and B. a dbag. Debate with class.

Secondly these new hdrol n sdrol products pale in comparison to first generation. And none compare to real anabolics so any argument
You make against that is flawed.

Regardless you don't discuss you scream and yell like a moron. I'm done with this thread. People like you an your attitude RUIN forums. Go with huskers advice all--I don't know anything except my entire first post was right on. See yas

 

[ManBeast]

I'm guessing most of the new products pale in comparison to the older ones are due to the fact many older compounds were found to be contaminated with other compounds... and were often hell on peoples' systems

 

[Husker89]

they are all "real anabolics u fing idiot" what dont u get about that. Masteron is an anabolic steroids just like superdrol(methylmasteron) Stop saying real anabolics like superdrol and all the others arent steroids man, thats SOOOOO stupid.

I'm well aware dbol and winni and anavar are 17aa--quit talking like a condescending prick. Stop talking like A. A hardass and B. a dbag. Debate with class.

Secondly these new hdrol n sdrol products pale in comparison to first generation. And none compare to real anabolics so any argument
You make against that is flawed.

Regardless you don't discuss you scream and yell like a moron. I'm done with this thread. People like you an your attitude RUIN forums. Go with huskers advice all--I don't know anything except my entire first post was right on. See yas

 

[mtb2005]

PH'S ARE NOT STEROIDS- they are pro-hormones other wise they'd be called Anabolic STEROIDS. And yes they were hell on ppls systems.