Self Fulfilling Prophecies and methyl steroids
- 09-16-2004, 12:59 PM
Self Fulfilling Prophecies and methyl steroids
I can recall a time not so very long ago. A time when M1T was "extreme" in regard to its potential dangers. A time when use and mis-use was a very serious concern by many members on the board. A time when statements like; "every kid wanting to get huge will be eating this **** like candy" and was of a serious concern. Our conscienses were very finely tuned to the potential dangers of the use and abuse of these compounds by anyone, and especially young kids just coming into the BB world/sport, with very little to no training and diet experience.
Fast forward to today. We have 20-21yr olds weighing in at 145-165lb advising other 145-165lb kids who want to get huge by doing this or that methyl. Kids who don't know how to eat or train right. Kids who have trained for the first time in their lives now wanting to take steroids.
What happened? Where is the board conscience that used to be so prominant? Is there a board conscience?
Please note: I am not anti steroids, nor anti kids (young men), nor anti kids on steroids. I'm sure this may offend a few too many. But surely there are some here who remember "back in the day" when we used conscience and caution when supplying advise.
I'm sure I'm not alone here.
Last edited by David Dunn; 09-16-2004 at 06:49 PM. Reason: correct type-o's and grammar
- 09-16-2004, 01:03 PM
No the overall tone of the board has not changed but we as admin and mods need help to combat this.. I have been banning and correcting a ton more than I used to lately so please feel free to correct misconceptions and address anything you feel needs to be addressed.
09-16-2004, 01:34 PM
Matthew_D...I do appreciate your reply. I do want to emphasise that I was in no way referring to the staff and or mod/admin team directly. I was more or less referring to the community of the board. Thank you for your affirmation.
I can remember back when I first cycled androgens. I got back into training again for the first time in too long. I trained for a while and saw that I still had it. But I knew that it was consistancy and discipline that were going to get me the long term results. I spent an entire year researching androgens while perfecting my diet and training. After that year I did my first cycle. It was Nor-ADerm. Anyone even remember what that is? I then gradually proceded to 1,4dione and finally a 1T/4AD cycle. This progression took about a year. I cycled a few more 1T/4AD cycles before the "goods" started hitting the boards.
I guess it's just me...but progression is a big part of progress. Or maybe I am just getting too old
BTW...seriously, not looking to offend or attack anyone here. It has been a concern of mine for a while and I just decided that today was the day to open the discussion.
09-16-2004, 02:15 PM
I do see and feel what you are saying B51, however I feel we must address what our roles should be. I'm sure there will be disagreement on this but I'll simply lay down what I feel my role is.
As you stated, there are an incalculable number of kids who want to take these methyls and have a poor concept of proper diet, training, and rest should be. I view this as a given and my main emphasis is on trying to make sure these kids do not harm themselves irrepairably. I cannot impart on them the value of experience in a few paragraphs nor can I hammer common sense or intelligence into anyone that does not want them.
I could utter the mantra "Make sure your diet and training are in order.." with every post but will it really be taken into consideration? We must also realize that these substances are not the sole propriety of body builders and therefore there are no hard and fast "rules" as to what level of fitness one has to be at in order to use PH's. I myself am not a BBer and my diet at times would make a natty cry.
What I can do is make sure they know the proper way to use these substances with proper PCT. I focus on giving out safe recommendations aimed at getting person X through a cycle without damaging themselves. I could demand to know what their diet and training are like but Person X could simply blow smoke up my ass to get info and do the cycle anyways.
If other MODS or members wish to concentrate on the poster's diet, training and lifestyle that is great but I simply don't feel as though I am advanced enough to dole out calorie-specific advice to anyone.
09-16-2004, 02:31 PM
I have to tell you guys this..Last night I was playing Quake 3 Excessive mod(great game)
and someone came in named Methyl-1..I went into spectator mode and starting chatting with him.I told him about my liver problems,well he was so interested we starting talking on instant message..He never heard of Nolva and all he was using was 6oxo for PCT.I asked him his age and he told me 17..We talked for an hour I linked him to anobolics forum and my thread F.Y.I...He read stuff about lactating and ball shrinkage and freaked out..Well he told me he was going to stop as of right now,he was only taking 5mg for 2 days but was worried about side effects.I just thought I would share with you,and I felt so good because I feel I really helped this kid out..I do not think the staff here promotes this stuff,but when people ask they give there advice and that is what makes this forum great..
09-16-2004, 11:46 PM
It's a shame cause with a little knowledge and discepline they would probably grow so fast they wouldn't even think about prohormones or roids. I don't think they should be used untill your near your genetic peak. Plus now with the media talking about athletes and steroids all the time it's just gonna get worse cause now kids will be thinking about it more. Now they think well if Barry Bonds takes em how bad could they be? Or they open a Flex magazine and see 2 page adds how m1t can give ya 20 pounds of muscle in 2 weeks. With no mention of side effects or pct.
09-17-2004, 12:22 AM
When it comes down to it we here at AM are about safety first. If that means we have to lose a few battles to win the war then so be it. A lot of bro's come on dead set on taking this or that and want advice. Do you suggest then that we ignore him and say don't take it your not old enough or experienced enough? Or do we stay in line with our goal (safety) and recognize the fact that this person is going to use it anyway and give him sound advice that will make the cycle as safe as possible.
We don't suggest those under 21 take anything but they will. We don't suggest nor promote it but in that instance I'd rather give the person a few tips to make it safe then to tell him to buzz off.
09-17-2004, 12:47 AM
Good discussion. I'm actually happy I lifted incorrectly and dieted insufficiently for my first 3 years - got the newbie gains regardless. If I wandered into BB.com, I might have been tempted to try some androgen prematurely. Ignorance was bliss. I did waste alot of money on crappy supplements and musletech though...
And also, those with a poor diet usually won't maintain any gains after a M1T cycle. And defintily not with PCT.
Feeding the stereotype "you can't keep your gains"
My Little Site about Hair Loss & Anabolics-
hair loss from steroids dot com
09-17-2004, 12:19 PM
I agree with you b5150, but I really think Bioman hit it on the head. I browsed this board for over 6 months before ever posting my first response. I dedicated myself to research, and was satisfied that I could come on here and give helpful information to people. I try and tell people a safe way of doing cycles, and always stick with the board policies because I agree with what they have to say. Lately it seems there are a lot more posts dealing with very uneducated questions. The best way to deal with this is to give good safe advice, and tell them to do some research.
09-17-2004, 12:29 PM
The biggest problem I think from talking to these kids is,they think the stuff i safe because it's legal..Big problem IMO
09-17-2004, 12:40 PM
I am not in disagreement with any of these replies.
But in regard to them I would like to add this. It is always good to give sound advise when it is asked for. But in some cases it is showing someone how to do the wrong thing the right way. But I will not go into what is right or wrong and level of experience for PH/PS use. But there should be some sort of prerequisite of knowledge or level of understanding demonstrated by the inquirer before such advise is delivered.
I will say that I think encouraging someone to search for themselves is the better way to go. For instance; "Hey bro, search around some on the board using the "search function". Use the key words "PCT, NOLVA, 6-OXO". Read up a bunch on this stuff". I'm not going to ramble on using examples.
"We can feed them fish, or teach them to be fishermen"
09-17-2004, 12:53 PM
I would just like to say you are the coolest 45 yr old I have ever known of in my entire life Madman. Playing Quake 3? And you are ripped? Damn, you sure you aren't a 20 year old masquerading as a 45 yr old Don't ever let old age hit ya.Originally Posted by MaDmaN
Oh and also you did the right thing in schooling that kid about M1T. He should be very thankful you took the time to educate him.
09-17-2004, 12:58 PM
Originally Posted by TheUsual
Thanks usual..I felt it is my responsability to at least try to help..As far as quake goes im even in a clan..IX-MaDmaN the IX clan...that is why I use Madman as my username it is also my quake name..
09-17-2004, 01:00 PM
More in line with this discussion, has anyone else noticed the vast difference between post and thread counts of the PH and Anabolics Forum Sections vs. the Diet & Nutrition and Training sections? That right there sums up the problem I think. I am starting to follow the school of thought of "maybe it's a good thing the gov't is outlawing PH's".
09-17-2004, 01:20 PM
I don't know...I'm younger than a lot of you, but I think it's kind of dishonest to actually think someone is making a bad decision, but then pretend like "everythings cool" and give them advice. I don't see how you're making the problem any better. If a reporter were to visit this site, he/she would see you doling out cycling info to kids, vs. telling them what they need to hear, which is what my coaches told me, which is GET OFF YOUR LAZY ASS AND STOP LOOKING FOR A SHORTCUT AROUND HARD WORK.
The net result of the "they're going to do it anyway" approach is more f-ed up kids, not less. The 5% that do it right at a young age would have done it right without your help, b/c they can read/research and apply knowledge.
Epiphyseal Growth Plates don't need a lot of encouragement to start closing, and I would never in a million years tell a kid there is a "safe" way to cycle, b/c I don't believe there is, based on the extensive research I have done since my early 20s.
Why does everyone get so pu$$y and afraid to tell a kid what's up? Is that your idea of good role modeling? The 90s sensitive bull****, that assumes we're all born with paper-thin skin and fragile egos? How many coaches of professional teams take that approach. If you've been an athlete of any level of success, you know the answer, it's ZERO...Strong people respond to strength. I don't give a f--- what happens to the rest, b/c they don't matter in my equation. If a kid can't handle reality, why change it to make him/her feel better...just so you can save face and appear cool? That's lame.
09-17-2004, 01:23 PM
Usual, yes, it was the first thing I noticed when I came to these boards...and it's the same at every other one.
If I was a scientist I would say people primarily come here for drug-related information.
09-17-2004, 01:34 PM
The Mods and Vets here do a good job pushing safety first. Some Experienced steroid users stay away from M1T - while 16year old are juicing up without liver protection and PCT. How ironic
My Little Site about Hair Loss & Anabolics-
hair loss from steroids dot com
09-17-2004, 01:39 PM
How do you safely avoid growth plate closure, bro? Extra Milk Thistle?
And how many kids can get bloodwork done? That's a key element of safety.
09-17-2004, 01:40 PM
I must reiterate: this is NOT directed at the MOD/ADMIN of AM, but rather the community in general.
"No, I am not my brothers' keeper, I'm his brother"
09-17-2004, 01:49 PM
Ditto, B5150...the Mods/Admins have a host of responsibilities/functional requirements to balance...plus they make this place available...and no one is encouraging censorship.
09-17-2004, 02:02 PM
Maybe the gov't does know best in the end, eh? They say "we must save the stupid masses from themselves" and we go and prove them right
09-17-2004, 03:14 PM
Let me clarify the intent of my post was about giving advice to newbies and or people with poor body building discipline. I did use the term "kids" but I did not mean to imply that I advocate giving advice to people under the age of 20. I have done so on occassion but it was generally an oversight rather than intentional.
This board has had a standing policy of banning underaged members from posting in the AAS section or at the very least we sternly warn them to stay away from PH/AAS until they are of age.
One has to realize that there dozens of people joining the site everyday and it is simply not practical to do a background check on all of them. We tend to let their actions/postings dictate whether we look into whether or not they are who they say they are. Kids are clever but I feel that the board does its best to keep them out.
09-17-2004, 03:18 PM
09-17-2004, 04:15 PM
09-17-2004, 04:19 PM
I'm right with bioman here, I along with every other mod or admin here would never advise or say it was ok for an underage kid to take ph's or AAS.Originally Posted by bioman
And yes finding the answer for yourself is always better I can't stand when people ask the same question 20 times.
Overall fella's we as a board need to pay attention to these young men and guide them in the right direction, not just pimp products and sponsors like some other boards I won't mention. We the Mods and admin can only read so many threads so if anyone see's something wrong feel free to address it or pm one of us.
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