Going through PCT and my workouts SUCK ASS....Need a jumpstart from somewhere :(

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    Going through PCT and my workouts SUCK ASS....Need a jumpstart from somewhere :(


    Just finished my second cycle of 1-AD. The first cycle I didn't feel to bad coming back to the gym after the cycle, but this time around I feel extremely fatigued and weak. My lifts have dropped a LOT, much more so than the first. I am using 6-OXO, just like the previous, 400mg/day. No problems with gyno or anything of those, but a HUGE loss in endurance..

    My question is this. What are you guys using when coming off a cycle to stay "pumped" in the gym? Would a good thermogenic do the trick, but without taking all my hard earned mass away? Would it be safe to try NO2 or something of the sort to help compinsate?

    Any ideas are appreciated...

    josh

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    nolva
    creatine
    ECA
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    Good advice from Beelzebub. I'm currently using :
    ephedra hcl-25mg
    green tea extract-400mg
    caffeine-100-200mg..................prework out and I have tons of energy to make it through.
    •   
       

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    I suffer from the same problems, but haven't been OFF in a while . I plan on adding some kind of next-gen cell volumizer when I do come off in a couple weeks. Hopefully Custom will have his Swole clone out soon. I might just homebrew, using some Citulline Malate powder from 1fast, maybe some AAKG or some other kind of Arginine, Glycociamine, Glucoronlactone, ect. I really hate not getting good pumps.
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    I have been experimenting with pre workout stims for the last few weeks, so far the best combo I have come up with is:

    15mins pre workout:

    25mg eph. HCL
    300mg caffeine
    5g taurine
    1000mg ALCAR
    start sipping workout shake of 25g whey, 30g dex, 5g creatine, 2g taurine

    I also have some tyrosine I am planning on starting. probably start with ~500-1000mg per workout.

    Works like a treat. I have great energy for the whole workout, and the most amazing pumps ever(not that that matters)
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    Quote Originally Posted by meathead1987
    I have been experimenting with pre workout stims for the last few weeks, so far the best combo I have come up with is:

    15mins pre workout:

    25mg eph. HCL
    300mg caffeine
    5g taurine
    1000mg ALCAR
    start sipping workout shake of 25g whey, 30g dex, 5g creatine, 2g taurine

    I also have some tyrosine I am planning on starting. probably start with ~500-1000mg per workout.

    Works like a treat. I have great energy for the whole workout, and the most amazing pumps ever(not that that matters)
    Does that upset your stomach at all (taurine with caffeine,ephedrine)?

    I usually take my stims (eph, Y-HCL, caff, ect,) with ALCAR about 2 hours after eating some oatmeal with a protein shake. Then head to the gym, and sip on my mix from Trueprotein.com of Hydro whey/hydro casein/dextrose/malto/BCAA, plus 10g creatine and 5g taurine added, using about 30g carb/30g prot total mixed in 1L water, starting right after my last warm-up set, finishing it right at the conclusion of my training. Then about 20-30 min after training I consume my first "meal", which is usually oatmeal or oatmeal/shredded wheat with about 60g protein shake (70%MPI/30%CFM whey). I've been doing this or something very similar for the better part of 3 years now, and I really don't even like to train without it.
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    Nope, I dont get any stomach discomfort. I did when I was using 10g taurine pre workout, but as soon as I lowered it to 5g I was fine.

    My nutrition varies. If I hjave plenty of time, I have 250g oats, 300ml milk and some friut about 2hrs pre workout, then have those supps abt 15mins pre.

    If I'm a bit shorter on time, Ill have 250g weetabix with milk and fruit(higher GI) and train ~75minutes later.

    The extent of which these work is pretty immense. They give me heaps of energy for the duration of even my highest volume workouts. Last upper workout was 37sets(90mins+) and last lower workout was 16sets(75mins) I did Deads, SLDL and squats in 1 workout no problem.

    My journal can be found here:

    http://forum.avantlabs.com/?s=&act=S...ew=getlastpost

    it has details of my workouts, and various sup logs including ALCAR as a sleep aid(works excellently) andmy pre workout stim log.
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    I do not have access to Ephedra.....unless someone can point me in the right direction
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    Try a citrulline malate product. I used SAN's Ox on my last few PCTs, it really helps give you the energy & endurance to train when you don't otherwsie feel like it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prime Rib
    I do not have access to Ephedra.....unless someone can point me in the right direction
    www.1fast400.com

    Its ephedrine HCL made by megapro. I think its the top seller over there.
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    Or...


    Quote Originally Posted by Prime Rib
    I do not have access to Ephedra.....unless someone can point me in the right direction
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18329
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    Longdog wrote: Try a citrulline malate product. I used SAN's Ox on my last few PCTs, it really helps give you the energy & endurance to train when you don't otherwsie feel like it.
    I've been interested in the claims of endurance, recovery, and energy from citrulline malate, but I'm confused about this product. It sounds like you end up with more arginine after taking it. Is that true or not? (Not everyone wants more arginine) Thanks.
    Last edited by rrgg; 09-03-2004 at 03:08 PM.
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    I have maintained my energy, strength and bodyweight after a cutting cycle with M4ohn. I used Nolva 2wks @ 4ml and 2ml, 6OXO @ 6oomg, 400mg and now 200mg and take my energy package about an hour before hitting the gym in the morning. In it for a strong burst of energy and good pumps I use;
    Ephedrine HCL 25 mg
    Caffeine 200mg
    Green Tea 400 mg (plus 2X more later...1200 tot.)
    ALCAR 1000mg
    ALA 600mg (plus 2 more X later....1800 tot.)
    Swole (2x/day on workout days, 1X or rest days)
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    Nolva, Tribulus, ECA, ZMA, and lots and lots of food.
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    Where can I access a true "ECA" stack? (Ephedra, Caffiene, Aspirin) ?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prime Rib
    Where can I access a true "ECA" stack? (Ephedra, Caffiene, Aspirin) ?
    Look around for some Ephedrine HCL on supplement sites, buy some caffeine pills, and use some yohimbe tabs in place of the asparin.
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    Heres an update on my pre workout Stimulant log. Today I tried:

    15mins pre:

    25mg Eph HCL
    300mg Caff anhydrous
    1000mg Tyrosine
    1000mg ALCAR
    5000mg Taurine
    Start sipping shake of 30g dex, 25g whey, 2g taurine, 5g creatine

    My workout was awesome. I got a 15lb PR on squats to name but 1 achievement. Definately give that a shot.

    Prime rib, you can buy ephedrine HCL and caffeine anhydrous from 1fast400.com and asprin from just about anywhere.
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    I know some of you are taking creatine with your preworkout "boost". Is the caffeine affecting the effectiveness of the creatine at all for you? I know I've read many things saying that taking caffeine with creatine isn't a good idea, because creatine brings blood and water to the muscles and caffeine is a diruetic and will just take the creatine out of the system. Do any of you think of this as a myth or do you have a good timing as to when to take them together?
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    A small amount of caffeine increases creatine uptake.
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    Could you define "small?"
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    ~100mg I believe

    I saw a study, posted by nandi on CEM about it a while back. I think it only becomes hazardous if you dont drink enough, or take over 500mg
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    Oh, that's only about 8oz of coffee.
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    I have no idea how much coffee it is, I use caffeine anhydrous from 1fast. But I suppose a cup of cffee would also work well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fightercowboy
    I know some of you are taking creatine with your preworkout "boost". Is the caffeine affecting the effectiveness of the creatine at all for you? I know I've read many things saying that taking caffeine with creatine isn't a good idea, because creatine brings blood and water to the muscles and caffeine is a diruetic and will just take the creatine out of the system. Do any of you think of this as a myth or do you have a good timing as to when to take them together?
    I think those were old arguments that have been laid to rest. I believe as long as you consume proper amounts of fluids (ie:water) during the day, then one should not have a problem. I'd have to give up my triple and quadruple shots of espressos and diet Pepsi's, and I'm not about to do that.
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    A triple shot of espresso is only 300mg, which is I think is less than a "grande."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutchman
    I have maintained my energy, strength and bodyweight after a cutting cycle with M4ohn. I used Nolva 2wks @ 4ml and 2ml, 6OXO @ 6oomg, 400mg and now 200mg and take my energy package about an hour before hitting the gym in the morning. In it for a strong burst of energy and good pumps I use;
    Ephedrine HCL 25 mg
    Caffeine 200mg
    Green Tea 400 mg (plus 2X more later...1200 tot.)
    ALCAR 1000mg
    ALA 600mg (plus 2 more X later....1800 tot.)
    Swole (2x/day on workout days, 1X or rest days)
    hey dutchman..what have you noticed on 6-oxo?

    and swole(is that swole creatine)..have u notcied anything on it compared to regular micronzined monohydrate?
  

  
 

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