DIENOLONE GYNO HELP (need clarification)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sourdough View Post
    ok... that I know... can 11-keto test aromatize?
    No, 11-keto test does not aromatize and from the research I've done, epistane acst as an ai. So, I don't understand what is going on.

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    i wouldnt take the nolva till later.
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    certainly odd to me as well...




    maybe its not really gyno??? but youve felt a lump, not just puffy nips right???
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    **** can get real weird. ive had puffy nips no lump, non puffy lil lump, both at same time, something i thought was a lump not a lump. Letro cleared it up for me faster than hell. then i used Formestane to come off the letro.
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    good to know. letro is working wonders for me as well.

    Pain is almost GONE. Lump is SIGNIFICANTLY smaller, went from pea sized to about 1/4th or 1/5th of the size. almost cant find it now. And it's been less than a week.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sourdough View Post
    certainly odd to me as well...




    maybe its not really gyno??? but youve felt a lump, not just puffy nips right???
    Yeah, the lump is there nips not really puffy, just sensitive.

    Quote Originally Posted by bigwhiteguy29 View Post
    **** can get real weird. ive had puffy nips no lump, non puffy lil lump, both at same time, something i thought was a lump not a lump. Letro cleared it up for me faster than hell. then i used Formestane to come off the letro.
    That's good to know, kind of reassuring. how did you dose the formestane?

    Quote Originally Posted by 808rebel View Post
    good to know. letro is working wonders for me as well.

    Pain is almost GONE. Lump is SIGNIFICANTLY smaller, went from pea sized to about 1/4th or 1/5th of the size. almost cant find it now. And it's been less than a week.
    My pain is reducing, however, the lump is still there and I have sensitivity to my nipple area and just below the nipple area right at the top abdomen area. I'm glad Letro is working for you, i'm still waiting for letro to arrive

    thank you everyone for the help.
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    Ill jsut tell you the whole story.

    Ran a high dose Pmag and Furuza cycle 6 weeks, Clomid pct with erase. I started Erase too early and i had high Serum levels off the clomid and also used Forkslin which caused estro issues in PCT. i went back on Erase and it helped but I still got rebound again. i started playing and feeling my nip glands too often and pinching them to see if it was there. caused big time irritation. so dont do this!

    to fix it i got letro went day by day 1.0 1.25 1.50. 1.75. 2.0 by the time i got just a few days in it already started to help big time. then i went to 2.5 for about 15 days and back down to 2.0 for 5 days then dropped it day by day .5 less each day at .5 i started formestane (topical from CEL) 150mg for 5 days, 100mg for 10 days and 50mg for like 10 days. i only have a tiny bit left. i also weight 240 and have a little high body fat over 15% i think. 100mg would be sufficent. i honestly felt the form did great.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigwhiteguy29 View Post
    Ill jsut tell you the whole story.

    Ran a high dose Pmag and Furuza cycle 6 weeks, Clomid pct with erase. I started Erase too early and i had high Serum levels off the clomid and also used Forkslin which caused estro issues in PCT. i went back on Erase and it helped but I still got rebound again. i started playing and feeling my nip glands too often and pinching them to see if it was there. caused big time irritation. so dont do this!

    to fix it i got letro went day by day 1.0 1.25 1.50. 1.75. 2.0 by the time i got just a few days in it already started to help big time. then i went to 2.5 for about 15 days and back down to 2.0 for 5 days then dropped it day by day .5 less each day at .5 i started formestane (topical from CEL) 150mg for 5 days, 100mg for 10 days and 50mg for like 10 days. i only have a tiny bit left. i also weight 240 and have a little high body fat over 15% i think. 100mg would be sufficent. i honestly felt the form did great.
    Bigwhiteguy, thank you very much for sharing. That is a great help to my decisioin on what to run and for how long. Really appreciate it.
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    did you run a serm and daa+erase for your pct? just wondering
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    Quote Originally Posted by newbie96 View Post
    Bigwhiteguy, thank you very much for sharing. That is a great help to my decisioin on what to run and for how long. Really appreciate it.
    no prob man
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    Quote Originally Posted by Masciaman View Post
    did you run a serm and daa+erase for your pct? just wondering
    yeah and i also did bioforge v II and when i started that is when i started to flare up
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    BUMP!

    -So the lump is pretty small, but its still there, and idk if it's improving. I've seen a lot of reccomendations on formestane. Any suggestions to which brand? CEL is pretty cheap and reputable, I may go that route.. but is ****'s RS-Transderm the same thing? If so I may go that route.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 808rebel
    BUMP!

    -So the lump is pretty small, but its still there, and idk if it's improving. I've seen a lot of reccomendations on formestane. Any suggestions to which brand? CEL is pretty cheap and reputable, I may go that route.. but is ****'s RS-Transderm the same thing? If so I may go that route.
    Transaderm is dhea. It's a upstream hormone not like formastane which is an AI. **** has a transdermal formastane supp as well though. I'd look into that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattrag View Post
    Transaderm is dhea. It's a upstream hormone not like formastane which is an AI. **** has a transdermal formastane supp as well though. I'd look into that.
    ahhhh thats why I was confused. I was mistaking ****'s Transderm for MrSupps Forma Stanzol
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    808, can you give us an update on how things worked out for ya? hopefully everything cleared up. im interested on how the form worked for you following the letro
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    Quote Originally Posted by heebs10 View Post
    808, can you give us an update on how things worked out for ya? hopefully everything cleared up. im interested on how the form worked for you following the letro
    i did it and it worked just as well as the letro did IMO. letro worked really well in the middle of letro cycle but as a tapered down the bump came back once on form it went back down. my gyno was so little though so i dont know.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigwhiteguy29 View Post
    i did it and it worked just as well as the letro did IMO. letro worked really well in the middle of letro cycle but as a tapered down the bump came back once on form it went back down. my gyno was so little though so i dont know.
    thanks for the reply. are you off the form now? if you are off the form, was there any rebound?
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    I have something similar, ran letro for 3 weeks when I started tapering down I felt the sensitivity coming back the lump never went down. I started letro at 2.5 again for a week and still feel the sensitivity.

    I started tamoxifen and erase today, I'm hoping this can help restart things and help with getting my testosterone/estrogen ratio back into a favorable range.

    Has anyone had a similar experience and had any success running something similar?

    Am I just doing things all wrong?

    Thanks guys in advance.
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    i honestly felt letro worked great for a weak and then kinda ehhh after. it was research grade but from a quality source. Form was great to me, first time in a transdermal form. I ended up buying 3 more bottles. I can only feel it if I really try and its really hot out. It worked well i am happy. No I am not on it. i ended 5 weeks ago. no rebound.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigwhiteguy29 View Post
    i honestly felt letro worked great for a weak and then kinda ehhh after. it was research grade but from a quality source. Form was great to me, first time in a transdermal form. I ended up buying 3 more bottles. I can only feel it if I really try and its really hot out. It worked well i am happy. No I am not on it. i ended 5 weeks ago. no rebound.
    im glad to here it worked well for you and that you didnt get any rebound. i have been using TD form for about a week now while i was waiting to get my letro (started TD form and nolva when i first felt sensitivity about a week ago but at that point it was already pretty late since there was already a good sized lump that i somehow didnt notice developing earlier) anyways, i just got my letro and started it last night. the form hasnt helped with the lump at, at least from what i can tell anyways. it seems to help reduce the puffiness temporarily but begins to become puffy again towards the end of the day. i also was using some ATD that i had lying around because my form is a few years old and i wasn't sure if it had degraded at all. i also got some caber when i bought my letro but im not sure if i should use it/need it. i got my chems from IP (formerly IR) so i think they have a pretty good reputation of having legit chems, i hope.

    did you initially have puffiness in addition to the lump, BWG? and if you did, did that resolve as well?

    thanks for the help so far.

    if anyone else has any input or advise, i would appreciate your wisdom.
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    Quote Originally Posted by heebs10 View Post
    im glad to here it worked well for you and that you didnt get any rebound. i have been using TD form for about a week now while i was waiting to get my letro (started TD form and nolva when i first felt sensitivity about a week ago but at that point it was already pretty late since there was already a good sized lump that i somehow didnt notice developing earlier) anyways, i just got my letro and started it last night. the form hasnt helped with the lump at, at least from what i can tell anyways. it seems to help reduce the puffiness temporarily but begins to become puffy again towards the end of the day. i also was using some ATD that i had lying around because my form is a few years old and i wasn't sure if it had degraded at all. i also got some caber when i bought my letro but im not sure if i should use it/need it. i got my chems from IP (formerly IR) so i think they have a pretty good reputation of having legit chems, i hope.

    did you initially have puffiness in addition to the lump, BWG? and if you did, did that resolve as well?

    thanks for the help so far.

    if anyone else has any input or advise, i would appreciate your wisdom.
    erase didnt do the trick for me and i used forkslin in pct and also drank and played with my nips. all create estrogen. i also used a sh!t natty testbooster herb **** that made it worse with forkslin from bioforge. i kept playing withthe nips and that whats made them bad.

    letro helped really well then as you said with form and letro got puffy towards the end of the day. got puffy but lump smaller so i jsut decided to taper off. they came back to normal 2 weeks after that. get some p5p and l-dopa just incase because playing with them can release prolactin. they will be puffy till your body mellows out, worry about the lump. puffyness comes with time and being on nothing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by heebs10 View Post
    im glad to here it worked well for you and that you didnt get any rebound. i have been using TD form for about a week now while i was waiting to get my letro (started TD form and nolva when i first felt sensitivity about a week ago but at that point it was already pretty late since there was already a good sized lump that i somehow didnt notice developing earlier) anyways, i just got my letro and started it last night. the form hasnt helped with the lump at, at least from what i can tell anyways. it seems to help reduce the puffiness temporarily but begins to become puffy again towards the end of the day. i also was using some ATD that i had lying around because my form is a few years old and i wasn't sure if it had degraded at all. i also got some caber when i bought my letro but im not sure if i should use it/need it. i got my chems from IP (formerly IR) so i think they have a pretty good reputation of having legit chems, i hope.

    did you initially have puffiness in addition to the lump, BWG? and if you did, did that resolve as well?

    thanks for the help so far.

    if anyone else has any input or advise, i would appreciate your wisdom.
    a couple of thing bro...

    I have personally used ATD with stellar results regarding gyno reduction, but be warned, it crushes your Est levels and therefore your libido will likely suffer.... unless your est levels are just outta control, then it may even raise your libido as it brings it down to optimal levels...

    Your Form should be fine... no matter how old it is, it will still be fairly effective as long as it hasnt crashed outta solution and wont go back in after reheating and shaking...

    Lastly... I love IP... I used them for years... but more and more things are beginning to have me question their legitimacy on all products, one being the testing of their peptides and finding out they werent as they said... who knows where this leaves their RC's for estrogen control, but I wouldnt risk it... never had the same results from the last 3 bottles of Torem as I did from the very first bottle I got from them when they first started offering it...

    BUT if your getting puffy nips while on letro by the end of a day... your letro is bunk bro... cause it has a LOOOONG half life... something between 36-72hours I think... I gotta look it up again but its LONG and shouldnt see fluxuations within a day...

    Are you taking anything for prolactin as well?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sourdough View Post
    a couple of thing bro...

    I have personally used ATD with stellar results regarding gyno reduction, but be warned, it crushes your Est levels and therefore your libido will likely suffer.... unless your est levels are just outta control, then it may even raise your libido as it brings it down to optimal levels...

    Your Form should be fine... no matter how old it is, it will still be fairly effective as long as it hasnt crashed outta solution and wont go back in after reheating and shaking...

    Lastly... I love IP... I used them for years... but more and more things are beginning to have me question their legitimacy on all products, one being the testing of their peptides and finding out they werent as they said... who knows where this leaves their RC's for estrogen control, but I wouldnt risk it... never had the same results from the last 3 bottles of Torem as I did from the very first bottle I got from them when they first started offering it...

    BUT if your getting puffy nips while on letro by the end of a day... your letro is bunk bro... cause it has a LOOOONG half life... something between 36-72hours I think... I gotta look it up again but its LONG and shouldnt see fluxuations within a day...

    Are you taking anything for prolactin as well?
    first of all, thanks again for the help bigwhite and Sour!

    idk if my ATD has been helping, but like i said, the form seemed to help with the puffyness for the majority of the day but comes back towards the evening. and yes, the form does still seem to be effective. as for the letro, it may be to soon to tell if its helping as i have only been on it 2 days now and i have been tapering up, so im only at about 1mg so far. also, i still used form the first day i took the letro, as i read that you should still use your anti-e the first day of letro. and your right about the long half-life, i think its like 48 hours roughly.

    your saying that you no longer trust IP's chems anymore? ...dam.. it was really cheap compared to other RC sites, so maybe it is bunk.

    also, i took 0.5 mg of caber (also from IP) monday night. it also has a super long half life so i was thinking i would use it every 3rd day? think caber is to much? should i use vitex or some sort of L-dopa instead?
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    also, low/no libido sucks but if i have to suffer with gyno, she can suffer with not getting my D for a little bit. if i have to sacrifice libido temporarily in order to get the most effective treatment, its worth it.
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    bigwhite, what company was the form from that you used?
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    Quote Originally Posted by heebs10 View Post
    bigwhite, what company was the form from that you used?
    C.E.L. got it dirt cheap dude like 21.95 so i got 4 of them.

    i didnt feel letro till 1.5 but main 2.0 and i did 10 days at 2.5. libido hurt.

    I know nothing about caber expect its not stable in liquid form????

    p5p and L-dopa are good. just make sure you have a really empty stomach with L-dopa it abosrbs sh!tty. Even a whey shake can F it up. do it right before bed and do a shake 1 and 15 mins before with NO CARBS.

    Do not play with nips.

    Form was good and you will get a lil puffy after the letro and form. estro gets higher at night. you can break up your dose but i would just wait out til lyour body gets back to normal. maybe get some I3C 200-400 a day and resveratral 600-900 a day later on like end of form. i did 150/100/50/50 or form. letro about 2-3 days over lap of form.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigwhiteguy29 View Post
    C.E.L. got it dirt cheap dude like 21.95 so i got 4 of them.

    i didnt feel letro till 1.5 but main 2.0 and i did 10 days at 2.5. libido hurt.

    I know nothing about caber expect its not stable in liquid form????

    p5p and L-dopa are good. just make sure you have a really empty stomach with L-dopa it abosrbs sh!tty. Even a whey shake can F it up. do it right before bed and do a shake 1 and 15 mins before with NO CARBS.

    Do not play with nips.

    Form was good and you will get a lil puffy after the letro and form. estro gets higher at night. you can break up your dose but i would just wait out til lyour body gets back to normal. maybe get some I3C 200-400 a day and resveratral 600-900 a day later on like end of form. i did 150/100/50/50 or form. letro about 2-3 days over lap of form.
    thanks for the help bro. looks like CEL stopped making their TD form but theres still a little out there. im all out of my form so i guess im gonna pick up some of that for after the letro. i also picked up another bottle of letro from a different source since it sounds like IP may not be the same quality as they used to. this new Solution of letro should be of high Purity, if you catch my drift. man, i really hope this works.
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    Quote Originally Posted by heebs10 View Post
    thanks for the help bro. looks like CEL stopped making their TD form but theres still a little out there. im all out of my form so i guess im gonna pick up some of that for after the letro. i also picked up another bottle of letro from a different source since it sounds like IP may not be the same quality as they used to. this new Solution of letro should be of high Purity, if you catch my drift. man, i really hope this works.
    I am always so paranoid about resource chems every cycle i buy two serms. 1 at one place 1 from another. this time i had a bottle of clomid on hand and a bottle of nolva on hand so i just bought torem. my nolva is g2g, my clomid is underdosed but works so so, trying out Torem from a legit place, sh!t was 80$ but a huge bottle.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigwhiteguy29 View Post
    I am always so paranoid about resource chems every cycle i buy two serms. 1 at one place 1 from another. this time i had a bottle of clomid on hand and a bottle of nolva on hand so i just bought torem. my nolva is g2g, my clomid is underdosed but works so so, trying out Torem from a legit place, sh!t was 80$ but a huge bottle.
    yeah, good technique dude. better safe then sorry. $80 for torem... thats a ton! i think i know where you got it and it seems like a legit source
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    Quote Originally Posted by heebs10 View Post
    yeah, good technique dude. better safe then sorry. $80 for torem... thats a ton! i think i know where you got it and it seems like a legit source
    the world would be so much easier if we could talk about sources on here. i really do not see the reason why. the Feds have google to you know hahaa
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigwhiteguy29 View Post
    the world would be so much easier if we could talk about sources on here. i really do not see the reason why. the Feds have google to you know hahaa
    lol so true!

    so i have been on letro for a week now and im not sure if theres much improvement. there might be a little reduction in size and it may be a little softer but its hard to tell. i also try to touch it as little as possible so i havent gave it a real good examination really. nipples are kinda puffy right when i wake up in the morning but are normal by the time im outta the shower, which is the first thing i do after i wake up. they stay pretty normal through the day ten get kinda puffy again in the evening. not sure if its due to hormone fluctuations throughout the day or it could actually be a temperature thing idk. libido is surprisingly decent. it was nonexistant the first few days but sorta came back after that, so thats kinda nice. even though it doesnt really hurt, it drives me nuts when something bumps into my titties lol, i guess because i can feel the lumps and i dont want anything to "stimulate" them and make it worse.

    did you experience anything like this? (particularly pertaining to puffyness fluctuations and slow/minimal reduction in lump size at first when you were on letro)
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    Quote Originally Posted by heebs10 View Post
    lol so true!

    so i have been on letro for a week now and im not sure if theres much improvement. there might be a little reduction in size and it may be a little softer but its hard to tell. i also try to touch it as little as possible so i havent gave it a real good examination really. nipples are kinda puffy right when i wake up in the morning but are normal by the time im outta the shower, which is the first thing i do after i wake up. they stay pretty normal through the day ten get kinda puffy again in the evening. not sure if its due to hormone fluctuations throughout the day or it could actually be a temperature thing idk. libido is surprisingly decent. it was nonexistant the first few days but sorta came back after that, so thats kinda nice. even though it doesnt really hurt, it drives me nuts when something bumps into my titties lol, i guess because i can feel the lumps and i dont want anything to "stimulate" them and make it worse.

    did you experience anything like this? (particularly pertaining to puffyness fluctuations and slow/minimal reduction in lump size at first when you were on letro)
    everything you just stated is 100% dead on exactly. stay at 2.5 for another 10 days then start dropping. add form is with 1-2 days left at about .75 letro then .5
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigwhiteguy29 View Post
    everything you just stated is 100% dead on exactly. stay at 2.5 for another 10 days then start dropping. add form is with 1-2 days left at about .75 letro then .5
    thanks big, its very reassuring to hear that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by heebs10 View Post
    thanks big, its very reassuring to hear that.
    you just gotta play the waiting game. 2 weeks after my form is when mu puffness went away. not that puffy to begin with though. i am running dzine right now at 45 mg and my little gyno i had is gone. i feel about 3 weeks into the dzine its gone. I hear the andro hard stuff is a good PH for getting rid of gyno. try that out next for a nice light cycle for a summer cut.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigwhiteguy29 View Post
    you just gotta play the waiting game. 2 weeks after my form is when mu puffness went away. not that puffy to begin with though. i am running dzine right now at 45 mg and my little gyno i had is gone. i feel about 3 weeks into the dzine its gone. I hear the andro hard stuff is a good PH for getting rid of gyno. try that out next for a nice light cycle for a summer cut.
    yeah i have been researching AH and similar DHT related hormones a lot lately. i was tossing around the idea of using something along the lines of AH while tapering off letro in hopes of further reduction but mostly to minimize the possibility of rebound
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    Quote Originally Posted by heebs10 View Post
    yeah i have been researching AH and similar DHT related hormones a lot lately. i was tossing around the idea of using something along the lines of AH while tapering off letro in hopes of further reduction but mostly to minimize the possibility of rebound
    instead i think you need to get to baseline for awhile and cruise there. let everything mellow out. run the androhard in feb-march
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    I just ran across this thread, and I thought I'd chime in. I've had great results with a combination of curcumin/formestane dissolved in oil, and taken orally. I was able to see a difference in days. Since formestane is an anti-progesterone as well- it would be your best bet... If you can find it Also, you might want to look into raloxifene. It's been shown to be more effective in treating gyno than nolva. I apologize if this information was already discussed in this thread, as I'm too lazy to read through it.
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    this thread is entertaining.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    this thread is entertaining.
    hah!
  

  
 

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