And who said oral fina sucks.........

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  1. And who said oral fina sucks.........


    I aint even working my legs and already within a day and half of starting my hamstrings are slightly sore as if i had worked them a few days ago LOL! It could be that i haven't worked my legs in a month so the androgens are just putting the muscle back due to muscle memory, I already put on 4 lbs in 2 days and ive only done one workout(chest) since starting on the night of the 3rd! I don't think ive gained any fat or its been very minimal.


    You gotta know how to use the orals effectively( timing, dosages, frontloading etc etc). A wise man never tells his secrets hehehe.


  2. Originally posted by pjorstad
    I aint even working my legs and already within a day and half of starting my hamstrings are slightly sore as if i had worked them a few days ago LOL! It could be that i haven't worked my legs in a month so the androgens are just putting the muscle back due to muscle memory, I already put on 4 lbs in 2 days and ive only done one workout(chest) since starting on the night of the 3rd! I don't think ive gained any fat or its been very minimal.


    You gotta know how to use the orals effectively( timing, dosages, frontloading etc etc). A wise man never tells his secrets hehehe.
    ????

    Do tell...forget that "wise man never tells" bull****.  This is a discussion forum where EVERYTHING you post is analyzed by peer review.  Obviosuly, if you know something that will help other bros publish it here and let's have a crack at it.  As you know, this is groundbreaking work since the majority of oral tren users say it is ****.  Well, they may be wrong and you may be the only person on this planet that has gotten it right.  So, enlighten us...

    Chemo
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  3. I was joking around about the secret part


    Seriously though big daddy chemo a lot ofpeople are saying orals are ok and my observation is the ones that say they don't work that well are making some big mistakes.


    Im frontloading between 300-350 for the first 5 days, after that im going down to 240 mg(12 pellets) for the rest of cycle. The first mistake is a lot are doing less and you should do more in the first few days to get it in your sytstem faster which can be done with orals. 2nd a lot of people are doing it only 2 times a day. Im doing it split up 4 different dosages. Also i use my highest dosage before my workout this is VERY important probably one of the biggest reasons why people don't see as good results on orals as they should. ANother huge mistake is post workout(3 hours about after your preworkout dose) you should use your 2nd highest dosage of the day. the other 2 dosages should be lower.

    An example of how i would do it on a WORKOUT day for the first 5 days is

    2 pellets in the morning at wakeup 6 pre workout 4 postworkout and then 3 pellets at another time and probably in the first 2 days of starting 1 to 2pellets in the middle of the night.
  4. Smile ROFL


    I think that 4 pounds is from Ben N Jerry's and not some oral induced workout rage.

  5. Maybe you should take them with a teaspoon of flax for a 'ethergel' effect. Just a thought. Good luck with your cycle dude.
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  6. FLAX!!


    No use butter!!!

    You could have doubled your "gains"

  7. Interesting pogue. Most of the time i try to take it with fat in the meal. Will that be good enough???


    As for psychological i don't notice awhole lot except at night i can tell my blood pressure and heart is slightly elevated but for the most part my sleep isn't really effected yet. Its in the early stages so myblood levels aren't saturated yet.


    Hey a lot of its water weight milo, maybe some food weight, maybe some fat, but there is some muscle in theire too and im sore as hell(previously wasn't getting sore and if i did it was nothing like this). Contrary to popular belief milo fina DOES add water weight, in fact all androgens do by increasing red blood volume.


    Anyways well see how it goes. Ill keep everyone updated as we move a long
  8. Re: FLAX!!


    Actually milo having a very high dosage preworkout is so important its not funny. Thats like saying a girl scout can gointo the gym lift weights and then AFTER she is done will all the sudden gain muscle just because she took some fina AFTERWARDS(other thenthe obvious muscle correlation due to hormone changes)

    High anabolics BEFORE AND DURING WORKOUT is THEE reason for muscle gains. You need them 2nd highest postworkout TOO to keep protein synthesis and an anbolic environment when cortisol levels are elevatedand protein synthesis is starting to kick in.
  9. hmmm


    uhhhhh.......

    errr...

    ummmm...

    I soooo wish I had the time to respond properly to this.

    During my degree program... I studied steroid chemistry for two years as part of my thesis (majored in Molcular Bio with a minor in biochem).... so that being said..

    errr.....

    ummmm.......

    COMPARED TO IM OR EVEN TRANSDERMALS ORAL FINA SUCKS.

    yes Im sure you may have gotten results.... going from nothing to ANYTHING will help..

    but imagine what would have happened if you would have went out and bought yourself a damn kit (or homebrewed) and shoved a needle in your ass.

    BTW its physiologically IMPOSSIBLE to gain 4lbs of anything except water in four days.

    if you dont beleive me... just work out the Kcal content of 4lbs of fat and muscle and tell us again how you gained 4 lbs.

    Dont get me wrong Im happier than a ***got in jail that you love Fina... but just keep in mind that if oral = good for you... than IM = 10 TIMES GOOD

    Ive tried both methods and I took a whole hell of a lot of fina..

  10. COMPARED TO IM OR EVEN TRANSDERMALS ORAL FINA SUCKS.

    Thats nice with the degrees and all but im not impressed. Ill listen to patrick arnold and big cat over you.

    According to patrick arnold with the ESTER left a lone transdermal fina is 20 percent MAX , chewed and swallowd its 20-30 percent. Add the factor of convenience, price, and the ability to frontload much faster in the first 2 days with oral, it surpasses transdermal with flying colors when the ester is left a lone.


    And i didn't say 4 lbs of muscle i say a lot was water and food weight but i did definitely get some ENHANCED muscle gains already.

  11. Personally, if I was gonna try oral fina I'd either try the flax method I mentioned above or make some cyclo fina.

    I think oral fina will probably work, but you'll have to take a lot and its probably not very cost effective.

  12. As said by patrick arnold oral is better then transdermal fina if you leave the ester a lone. He has a study to prove his point.

    With transdermals you have to use a messy thing and its a huge hassle and the cost is extra too. It takes even longer to frontload because of the slower absorption and you can't even vary the dosage as outlined above, which is niceto do. Also orals lower SBHG which is very nice too.

  13. Originally posted by pjorstad
    As said by patrick arnold oral is better then transdermal fina if you leave the ester a lone. He has a study to prove his point.

    Which he has yet to post. I asked him myself a while back and he said the study isn't specific. His statement of "oral is better than trans" was pertaning to his transdermal which is only about 15% because it was an inferior formula. I've done fina everyway you can and oral does work but not as well as the trans I've used with BDC gels, not to mention its less expensive. You'll get results but not as well as trans and you seem to forget the taxing your liver will take with fina pellets.


    If anyone is wondering I did 15 pellets per day and saw ok results. I used much less with BDC gel and got better results. The only reason I used oral was because I got the carts for really REALLY cheap. I wouldn't do it again because its just too expensive. I got more cramping and back pain with oral fina than anything else. Don't know why.
    For answers to board issues, read the Suggestion and News forum at the bottom of the main page.

  14. Ok thanks for your experience. Oral i think is probably better the first 2 days to get the system blood levels up faster. But since based on your experience you have seen better with less ill try the dsmo method and saran wrap. Ill try 12 pellets split up in 2 dosages per day starting this evening. Ill see how it goes.

  15. Screw it i just put a teaspoon of dsmo, yikes i didn't realize how much a teaspoon is it spreads over my whole upper body LOL, that **** burns and stinks! Im sticking with oral, im blowing up fast , just because igot great genetics doesn't mean you gotta hate me LOL! J/K



    Heres one guys view on dsmo vs oral from gotfina messageboard. A lot say oral sucks but most are saying it due to placebo and because of the tradition that oral sucks, not necessarily because they can pinpoint a difference.





    Hey guys. I have been a board member for at least a year I believe. My first means of administration was DMSO. I did 6 pellets per day. My gains and fat loss were excellent. My strength increase was very impressive.

    I did 2 cycles last year...

    Now for the interesting part. I started a cycle in the middle of Jan with DMSO. About 3 weeks into it, I got sick and tired of using the DMSO and I forgot to do it one night but I had some pellets with me. I orally took the pellets that night and said "f**k it" and continued.

    Let me tell you that I notice NO DIFFERENCE between DMSO and oral (for me). It is less aggrivating and very easy. I have the same (more) strength gains that I did last year.

    This is not an opinion, I actually did it...

    I may try the inject next...

  16. Originally posted by pjorstad
    According to patrick arnold with the ESTER left a lone transdermal fina is 20 percent MAX , chewed and swallowd its 20-30 percent.
    Listen pjorstad...I'll say this one more time for you:  SAPONIFY THE DAMN ESTER AND GET MORE THAN 20% ABSORPTION!  You keep quoting PA's thoughts but offer very little content other than, "Well, I heard someone say..."

    The intent of this board is for ALL anabolic topics and is not limited to transdermals.  As I have said in NUMEROUS threads: when dealing with fina the preference of administration route is (1) inject (2) transdermal - saponified ester and (3) oral ===> IN THAT ORDER

    If removing the ester is too much work for you then consider another hobby other than body mesopmorphosis.  Everything you do in this lifestyle is centered around working for what you want and this is merely a stepping stone.  Too many bros have the attitude of taking the easy way up.  Forget convenience...long live EFFECTIVENESS!

    Chemo

  17. Originally posted by Bobo
    I got more cramping and back pain with oral fina than anything else. Don't know why.
    Lower back pain can be an indicator of liver distress.

  18. Originally posted by John Benz

    Lower back pain can be an indicator of liver distress.
    Yeah I thought that could be the case. I've heard of it before on Winny and Dbol since they 17AA. Another reason to do it a different way.
    For answers to board issues, read the Suggestion and News forum at the bottom of the main page.

  19. Originally posted by Big Daddy Chemo


    : when dealing with fina the preference of administration route is (1) inject (2) transdermal - saponified ester and (3) oral ===> IN THAT ORDER

    .  Forget convenience...long live EFFECTIVENESS!

    Chemo
    bump on that reply . long live injecting and effectiveness !
  20. heheh


    Look bro... we arent saying that oral fina doesnt do anything... just that you have to take SO much to get anything out of it.

    Just TRY transdermal or IM and see your results..

    BTW I got really full lower back pumps if I did ANYTHING that involved lower back within a week of starting Fina..... and I was doing IM.

    I think most people just arent used to have your lower back muscles pump up like that.

  21. I know what you are saying big daddy chemo im not stupid. But ive asked you before and you say its only 50 percent yield. When you add the hassle of doing it, the fact that its only 50 percent yield and the fact that you have to apply transdermal all over you 2 times a day in the end there is little advantage. If you had an easy to do recipe for 100 percent yield or close to it then it would be better




    John benz as far as the lower back thing its mostly due to the nature of fina. On 1-test i got back pain a lot and could barely even due squats. I used to get a pump on my forearm when sleeping because of the lower blood flow when resting tight against pillow, in fact it happened to me for this first time last night.

  22. Originally posted by pjorstad
    I know what you are saying big daddy chemo im not stupid. But ive asked you before and you say its only 50 percent yield. When you add the hassle of doing it, the fact that its only 50 percent yield and the fact that you have to apply transdermal all over you 2 times a day in the end there is little advantage. If you had an easy to do recipe for 100 percent yield or close to it then it would be better




    John benz as far as the lower back thing its mostly due to the nature of fina. On 1-test i got back pain a lot and could barely even due squats. I used to get a pump on my forearm when sleeping because of the lower blood flow when resting tight against pillow, in fact it happened to me for this first time last night.
    1. You want 100? Inject it. If you feel you can't do that when you want the most effective way, then your in the wrong game. You can't see the difference between 50% and 20%? Can you say expense? As for ease, you have yet to try it so once again, for the LAST TIME, DON'T BASH SOMETHING YOU HAVE NOT TRIED! . If you want the lazy way out its simple, THIS IS NOT THE BOARD FOR YOU. People here will do the extra little effort to get more effectiveness and not go by what the "other guy" has said.

    2. You get the same problems with oral Winny and Dbol after a while. I've done extremely high doses of 1-test and never had that problem. Its not the same with 1-test.
    For answers to board issues, read the Suggestion and News forum at the bottom of the main page.

  23. Yes it is the same as 1-test ive had the SAME EXACT problems with back pumping etc, its the nature of 1-test and fina. So far i don't have back pain but if know in a nother week a or 2 if i do anything related to back work my back will be aching most of the week to some degree. In fact right now fina and 1-test seem the same to me so far except fina hasn't made me lethargic like 1-test.


    Like i said the yield is only 50 percent for conversion, if it was 100 percent then i would change my mind. Hell i would inject too but im scared of doing it wrong, i wish i had someone to help me make sure im doing it right and im scared about abcesses etc etc.
  24. Re: heheh


    Originally posted by Milo Hobgoblin
    BTW I got really full lower back pumps if I did ANYTHING that involved lower back within a week of starting Fina..... and I was doing IM.

    I think most people just arent used to have your lower back muscles pump up like that.
    Bobo isn't "most" people. He is in tremendous condition and would know the difference between a pump and a pain from some other cause.

  25. Originally posted by pjorstad
    Yes it is the same as 1-test ive had the SAME EXACT problems with back pumping etc, its the nature of 1-test and fina. So far i don't have back pain but if know in a nother week a or 2 if i do anything related to back work my back will be aching most of the week to some degree. In fact right now fina and 1-test seem the same to me so far except fina hasn't made me lethargic like 1-test.


    Like i said the yield is only 50 percent for conversion, if it was 100 percent then i would change my mind. Hell i would inject too but im scared of doing it wrong, i wish i had someone to help me make sure im doing it right and im scared about abcesses etc etc.
    pjorstad,

    I get back pumps from simply doing high rep deadlifts. The back pain from liver distress is much different. Realy like a pulled muscle except that it comes and goes.
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