Complete Nutrition (ALMOST) F***** Me Up. Need Advice For First Cycle
- 07-06-2011, 02:21 AM
Complete Nutrition (ALMOST) F***** Me Up. Need Advice For First Cycle
This is going to be a long thread. Apologize in advance. First off and foremost- I am openly admitting that I am BRAND NEW to prohormones, I have never done a cycle before and am looking for as much information as possible. I have googled and researched for hours, but information is vast and often times conflicting. Instead of reading for 5 hours again and going in circles I figured I'd just create my own post. PLEASE don't jump on me, as I am admitting I don't know much, and want to know as much as possible before potentially f****** up my system. Ok, we got that out of the way.
I am almost 26, have been lifting for 8 years. Currently 200 lbs., 6 foot tall. Want to hit 220. I lift 5 days a week. I keep a decent diet, admittedly don't eat enough though (somedays 4000 calories if I can and somedays 2000)- I am an extremely busy working professional and it just depends on what food I can fit in. I have friends at Complete Nutrition, love their regular supplements. All supps. I am currently taking: Optimum Nutrition Whey, Optimum Nutrition Casein, Optimum Nutrition Opti-Men (Multi), CN Titan Protein (Recovery) + CN Morph (Carbs), CN CX5 Creatine, CN NX6 (N.O.), AST Sports BCAA, Max Muscle Full Blown Extreme (Pre-Workout), CN (Legal Limit Labs) 3-Test-Oxo Natural Test Boost (Don't know if this is necessary).
Being that I have friends at CN, they of course hooked me up with 5 Deca-Zol AND Epi-Cynodrone. What a joke. I have not opened either bottle. Started doing research as I knew these were pretty serious, but never thought I'd find out what I did. Of course you all know that 5-Deca is Superdol and Halodrol, Superdrol being the harshest OTC PH available. Reading from other sites it says to NEVER stack 2 methyls. But this isn't to mention that they told me to start the Epi-Cynodrone (another 2 methyl stack, Epistane and Cynostane) 2 weeks in. Why don't I just order a new liver. Pretty positive that no combination of Liver Assist or optimizer would be enough to support this, am I correct? Then, they tell me to take 3-Test Oxo during cycle and use 6-estro for PCT. Read online that ALL OTC PCT's are absolute s***. After reading online I'm thinking the advice they gave me was for a trip to the ER.
You have to learn to crawl before you can walk, and walk before you can run, and run before you can sprint, so why the hell would they sell me Superdrol the harshest PH available that's also COMBINED with Halodrol, and then all the other stuff. One guy on another forum wrote that would be a harsh cycle for someone who's extremely experienced. The best part is 5-Deca Epi-Cynodrone and 3-Test Oxo are all sold together in a kit from Legal Limit Labs. You've probly seen it on their shelf. I know CN employees don't know what the f*** they're talking about when it comes to PH's.
I will not be going anywhere near this cycle. I AM, however, still interested in doing a medium, introductory cycle of something that has a little less risk associated with it. Primarily concerned about cholesterol, liver, and gyno. I know these are usual risks, but after reading about all the different PH's out there, it seems that many have less of these risks. I read somewhere that for beginners Halodrol was good by itself, or Epi was good by itself. This is where I am completely lost and have no idea where to turn. If there is a good beginner cycle, I need to know the BEST possible PCT, and all instructions of when and how to use it. I think this covers everything, again please forgive me for being a NOOB but at least I'm doing my due diligence instead of jumping in the deep end without knowing how to swim.
Thanks in advance for ANY advice you guys can offer me.
P.S. I need to add this- I stated above that I had never done a cycle of anything. Not sure if this counts but when I was a complete idiot MORON at age 18 I took 1 full bottle of Androstenedione. Absolutley retarted, I know... We all make mistakes, this was mine, I was extremely stupid back then. Hopefully this didn't mess anything up. Just wanted you to know in case it could affect me now.
- 07-06-2011, 04:50 AM
Sounds like you are doing the right thing not jumping into those methyl combos as a first cycle. Just by doing research you saved yourself a lot of liver:-) Androstenedione is worthless $hit and a bottle shouldnt do much in any area so dont worry about it.
Even though epi and cyno shouldn't be one of the worst stacka available I would recomend something like epi solo for a first run. Maybe Anabeta for 8 weeks with epi the first 4 and pct the last 4 would be a sweet stack. I always had nice results pulsing epi at 40 mgs 2 on 2 off but for some thats a bit weak. If you want to run a straight cycle start at 20 mgs and work your way up to 40-50 mgs ed.
As pct im a sucker for clomid. And for a epi cycle 50/50/25/25 should be ok with something like erase from w 2. Anabeta should also make pct a breeze. Nolva would also work at 20/20/10/10. If you dont feel like anabeta theres a lot of sweet additions you can make to your pct to add extra benefits.
Supportsupps like, cycle support, cycle assist, Q10, ALA, NAC should minimize the neg's.
- 07-06-2011, 07:59 AM
I say go with hdrol... Seems like a good beginner cycle... Make it four weeks 50/75/75/75 if your feeling up to it add one more week...
Pct with nolva 20/20/10/10
That's about as easy as it gets.
07-06-2011, 08:18 AM
07-06-2011, 12:32 PM
Your first mistake is buying any product there. You can get anything they have for a third of the price, if not a quarter of the price online.. cx5 is 70 bucks! Its ****ing creatine for christs sake! They're hype.
Hold on to that 5 deca and epi. Maybe a couple years down the road when you feel like you're ready it would make for a great bridge. I just ran that exact same cycle..
07-06-2011, 06:27 PM
Dude, I dide the exact same stack, 5deca followed by epicynodrone and blew up! I think I gained close to 25 pounds. I did the 3 test oxo and and 6 estro for PCT. I was completely fine! Still kept about 80% of my gains after PCT. My advise would be to just run one of those bottles to get your feet wet. If you wanna bulk do the 5 deca if you wanna cut do the epicynodrone. Yes, S-drol and H-drol can be liver harsh BUT the are dosed LOW in 5-deca, your not getting a full a full whop of both so its not crazy hard on your liver like if you were to stack a full bottle of hdrol with sdrol. They are both legit PH's and side effects are low/non existant on both. Your 26 years old and have done AAS before... Either one of them will be a walk in the park!
07-06-2011, 07:13 PM
Kudos on being smart and going the route you're going. And also nice job on writing everything out concisely like you did. Reps.
As far as what to do, first thing is first and that's keeping cals where they need to be. Running a cycle of anything without your cals where they are isn't going to yield the results you want. I know that working can make it hard, but you have to plan ahead - cook your meals out on Sunday, rely on shakes or protein bars (better protein bars are the only ones I'll eat anymore) and/or keep beef jerky or other things around the office if you need to.
And as for the cycle, I'd say halodrol or epi are both good options. I noticed more out of epi than h-drol.
Make sure you've got your on-cycle supports lined up: multi-vitamin, creatine, fish/krill oil, cycle support (e.g. N2Guard, Cycle Assist, Cycle Support). For PCT, people are always split on nolva or clomid. Torem is an option, too. Based on what you decide to use, just let us know and we can set up the amounts for you. Along with the SERM, some OTC estrogen and/or cortisol control are good (Erase or Formastanzol) and I'd rock a natural test booster along with it (I think you said you had one, so if that works, use it, otherwise my go to recommendation is DAA+ either HCGenerate or Phytoserms).
Ask questions whenever you have them (so long as you've already searched to make sure it wasn't already answered haha).
Psalm 34:10 - "The lions may grow weak and hungry, but those who seek the Lord lack no good thing."
EvoMuse Rep | Inspire to Evolve
07-06-2011, 07:46 PM
wtf, all of y'all read all that? cliffs anyone?
Olympus labs super pct, don't cycle without it. It's the best IMO. Get some an you'll be glad you did Olympus labs rep
07-06-2011, 08:28 PM
all I can contribute is: Good job not just taking that crap.
I can recommend: sticking around this forum and doing your research here... I learned a LOT and dont believe everything you read, pick which people's advice to trust (post count is a decent but not perfect indicator)...there are some VERY knowledgable helpful people on this site. MidwestBeast is one of them.
Can learn a lot here... just take your time and be patient. I been on since April and I am still learning.
Log of EPIC by FRL - http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplement-reviews-logs/202576-should-epic-frl.html
07-06-2011, 08:57 PM
Yea broski job well done,run something like 40mg anavar for 6-8 weeks. Im running that soon,have friends that have taking it,say its way better then Epi,most will say run epistane for your first cycle but from what ive heard and seen Anavar is better quality,just harder and more expensive to get ahold of. And the post above me is right as cherry pie,EVERYTHING i know about PH's/AAS I learned from AM. Just adventure around different forums,read some articles and keep asking questions.
Expose yourself to your deepest fear; after that, fear has no power, and the fear of freedom shrinks and vanishes. You are free.
07-06-2011, 10:34 PM
*dont worry about your liver so much, it can take a beating and recover fine
*methylated steroids are harder on lipids/cardiovascular system- this should be your concern
*find a way to shorten your posts
*tell your "friends" they are morons
07-06-2011, 10:41 PM
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