PH for test base

  1. Elite Member
    TexasLifter89's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  190 lbs.
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,237
    Rep Power
    38249
    Level
    62
    Lv. Percent
    8.53%
    Achievements Activity AuthorityActivity ProPosting ProPosting Authority

    PH for test base


    Sup guys, so I don't even have a clue what is currently out on the market, but lets say I was looking for something I could run that would convert to a test base, what would you recommend?

    I remember people doing this with PP dermacrine back in the day, but I have no clue if there is anything better out currently.
    - Join Me: Tex89 M-Sten RX Log... Dicing that iron -
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/222790-tex89s-msten-rx.html

  2. Diamond Member
    MidwestBeast's Avatar
    Stats
    6'1"  228 lbs.
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Age
    29
    Posts
    10,049
    Rep Power
    3128069
    Level
    80
    Lv. Percent
    2.48%
    Achievements Posting ProPosting AuthorityActivity AuthorityActivity ProActivity Veteran

    Quote Originally Posted by TexasLifter89 View Post
    Sup guys, so I don't even have a clue what is currently out on the market, but lets say I was looking for something I could run that would convert to a test base, what would you recommend?

    I remember people doing this with PP dermacrine back in the day, but I have no clue if there is anything better out currently.
    What's the timeline you're working on?
    Psalm 34:10 - "The lions may grow weak and hungry, but those who seek the Lord lack no good thing."
    EvoMuse Rep | This is what we've been workin on... | Inspire to Evolve
  3. Diamond Member
    jbryand101b's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    14,865
    Rep Power
    2755207
    Level
    87
    Lv. Percent
    92.39%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityActivity VeteranPosting ProPosting Authority

    4-androstenediol converts directly into testosterone.

    run for a base at about 600-800mg e/d.
    •   
       

  4. Professional Member
    TheDarkHalf's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  198 lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Age
    29
    Posts
    4,398
    Rep Power
    10717
    Level
    45
    Lv. Percent
    90.84%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    4-androstenediol converts directly into testosterone.

    run for a base at about 600-800mg e/d.
    Are there any 4-AD products that are still out that are known to be effective?
  5. Board Sponsor
    Royd The Noyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    5,336
    Rep Power
    803882
    Level
    58
    Lv. Percent
    20.74%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDarkHalf View Post
    Are there any 4-AD products that are still out that are known to be effective?
    4-AD by ams. Dermacrine does to a greater degree then oral dhea.
    ForeRunner Labs
    The Future of Human Performance
    Please LIKE FRL on Facebook

  6. Elite Member
    TexasLifter89's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  190 lbs.
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,237
    Rep Power
    38249
    Level
    62
    Lv. Percent
    8.53%
    Achievements Activity AuthorityActivity ProPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    4-AD by ams. Dermacrine does to a greater degree then oral dhea.
    I've used 4ad on 2 seperate occasions on the highest recommended dosage on the back and didn't see much out of it. I ran 2 bottles back to back on it, has it been improved since the oral suspension version?

    I used dermacrine before as well, but the topical just didn't fit my lifestyle very well (texas heat, running around campus, etc). Between the 2 what would you recommend from an unbias standpoint?

    Quote Originally Posted by MidwestBeast View Post
    What's the timeline you're working on?
    Nothing set in stone, just looking down the road for when I get myself back to par.

    I'm considering running it with m14add or Dbol, or any of the PH I currently have on hand.
    - Join Me: Tex89 M-Sten RX Log... Dicing that iron -
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/222790-tex89s-msten-rx.html
  7. Board Sponsor
    Royd The Noyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    5,336
    Rep Power
    803882
    Level
    58
    Lv. Percent
    20.74%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Do you mean the sublingual 4-ad, or the old caps?
    There was a recent study on 1-andro that actually showed these ph's are converting to a greater degree to the diols and testosterones, than they are to the diones, which I think is surprising to all of us, but also good news.
    ForeRunner Labs
    The Future of Human Performance
    Please LIKE FRL on Facebook

  8. Professional Member
    TheDarkHalf's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  198 lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Age
    29
    Posts
    4,398
    Rep Power
    10717
    Level
    45
    Lv. Percent
    90.84%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    4-androstenediol converts directly into testosterone.

    run for a base at about 600-800mg e/d.
    So how would this differ if you're using the liquid version of AMS 4-AD? I notice if you were doing tabs it'd be 3-4 per day....so would that be an equivalent of 3-4ml of the liquid?
  9. Elite Member
    TexasLifter89's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  190 lbs.
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,237
    Rep Power
    38249
    Level
    62
    Lv. Percent
    8.53%
    Achievements Activity AuthorityActivity ProPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    Do you mean the sublingual 4-ad, or the old caps?
    There was a recent study on 1-andro that actually showed these ph's are converting to a greater degree to the diols and testosterones, than they are to the diones, which I think is surprising to all of us, but also good news.
    it was 4ad UTT.
    - Join Me: Tex89 M-Sten RX Log... Dicing that iron -
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/222790-tex89s-msten-rx.html
  10. Diamond Member
    jbryand101b's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    14,865
    Rep Power
    2755207
    Level
    87
    Lv. Percent
    92.39%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityActivity VeteranPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDarkHalf View Post
    So how would this differ if you're using the liquid version of AMS 4-AD? I notice if you were doing tabs it'd be 3-4 per day....so would that be an equivalent of 3-4ml of the liquid?
    well, im refering to 4-androst-ene-diol, which is banned. op didn't say he wanted only legal means. just something that converted directly into test.
    it is still available in places.

    4-dhea is a little different. never ran it though.

    i've never used dermacrine either, so I cant comment on it.

    but I have ran 4-andro-diol. it's good stuff.

    I would think that if 1 step 4-andro-diol which has it's own mimimal intrinsic activity, needs to be ran in the 600mg's then 4-dhea would need to be ran as high, if not higher.
  11. Board Sponsor
    Royd The Noyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    5,336
    Rep Power
    803882
    Level
    58
    Lv. Percent
    20.74%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by TexasLifter89 View Post
    it was 4ad UTT.
    The new rd's are a little different but likely not to a great degree when it comes to results. There are lots of factors involved in the conversions. As an example a diet high in saturated fats could reduce results.
    ForeRunner Labs
    The Future of Human Performance
    Please LIKE FRL on Facebook

  12. Board Sponsor
    Royd The Noyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    5,336
    Rep Power
    803882
    Level
    58
    Lv. Percent
    20.74%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    well, im refering to 4-androst-ene-diol, which is banned. op didn't say he wanted only legal means. just something that converted directly into test.
    it is still available in places.

    4-dhea is a little different. never ran it though.

    i've never used dermacrine either, so I cant comment on it.

    but I have ran 4-andro-diol. it's good stuff.

    I would think that if 1 step 4-andro-diol which has it's own mimimal intrinsic activity, needs to be ran in the 600mg's then 4-dhea would need to be ran as high, if not higher.
    The old andro studies comparing sublinguals to oral caps showed that a 25 to 40 mg sublingual dose was equivalent to about 300mgs of an oral cap.

    So if you were dosing 600mgs of the oral diol, then an equivalent sublingual dose would only be 50 to 80mg per day.

    Now translate that into the androseries ams uses and I would think that double the diol dose should yield similar results. So for 4-ad rd's 4 or 5 tabs per day.
    ForeRunner Labs
    The Future of Human Performance
    Please LIKE FRL on Facebook

  13. Professional Member
    gymrat827's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  207 lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    4,659
    Rep Power
    10111
    Level
    46
    Lv. Percent
    70.88%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    I don't think anything will touch topical dermacine. There was a few page thread going a little while ago, look it up.

    I would be interested if LG science 1-D would do anything if dosed high enough
  14. Diamond Member
    jbryand101b's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    14,865
    Rep Power
    2755207
    Level
    87
    Lv. Percent
    92.39%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityActivity VeteranPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    The old andro studies comparing sublinguals to oral caps showed that a 25 to 40 mg sublingual dose was equivalent to about 300mgs of an oral cap.

    So if you were dosing 600mgs of the oral diol, then an equivalent sublingual dose would only be 50 to 80mg per day.

    Now translate that into the androseries ams uses and I would think that double the diol dose should yield similar results. So for 4-ad rd's 4 or 5 tabs per day.
    you never fail to capture my intrest in 4-ad rd tabs. if I only had the money...lol.
  15. Board Sponsor
    Royd The Noyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    5,336
    Rep Power
    803882
    Level
    58
    Lv. Percent
    20.74%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    you never fail to capture my intrest in 4-ad rd tabs. if I only had the money...lol.
    Ha I wish I could tell more. If I wasnt so busy with school I could organize my notes and pump out some articles on this stuff.
    ForeRunner Labs
    The Future of Human Performance
    Please LIKE FRL on Facebook

  16. Elite Member
    TexasLifter89's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  190 lbs.
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,237
    Rep Power
    38249
    Level
    62
    Lv. Percent
    8.53%
    Achievements Activity AuthorityActivity ProPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    Ha I wish I could tell more. If I wasnt so busy with school I could organize my notes and pump out some articles on this stuff.
    So in your opinion, 4ad RD vs Dermacrine LV... unbias what would you go with?
    - Join Me: Tex89 M-Sten RX Log... Dicing that iron -
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/222790-tex89s-msten-rx.html
  17. Board Sponsor
    Royd The Noyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    5,336
    Rep Power
    803882
    Level
    58
    Lv. Percent
    20.74%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by TexasLifter89 View Post
    So in your opinion, 4ad RD vs Dermacrine LV... unbias what would you go with?
    4-ad, I'm not that familiar with the lv though. I think the topical dermacrine of old is probably superior to the lv. Still 4-ad overall.
    ForeRunner Labs
    The Future of Human Performance
    Please LIKE FRL on Facebook

  18. Diamond Member
    jbryand101b's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    14,865
    Rep Power
    2755207
    Level
    87
    Lv. Percent
    92.39%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityActivity VeteranPosting ProPosting Authority

    oral dhea is a waste of money.

    rls supplements bought the rights to primordial performances transdermal dermacrine. it is suposed to be the exact same product.

    I like the sound of the 4-ad rd tabs.
  19. Elite Member
    Tomahawk88's Avatar
    Stats
    5'7"  250 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    9,005
    Rep Power
    629267
    Level
    64
    Lv. Percent
    36.85%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Dermacrine TD has treated me great on my Superdrol cycle right now. I do agree the current version is a pain when it comes to applying. Living in Georgia I can sympathize. If only Derm dried faster and more effectively

    But ya I didnt particularly like my experience with Derma LV.
  20. Elite Member
    RickRock13's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  185 lbs.
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Age
    40
    Posts
    9,352
    Rep Power
    989353
    Level
    67
    Lv. Percent
    23.27%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomahawk88 View Post
    Dermacrine TD has treated me great on my Superdrol cycle right now. I do agree the current version is a pain when it comes to applying. Living in Georgia I can sympathize. If only Derm dried faster and more effectively

    But ya I didnt particularly like my experience with Derma LV.
    Yeh I agree with Tom here. I'm running topical Dermacrine on cycle right now as a test base and it really helps with the lethargy and libido issues, the only bad part is it seems like a second job to put that stuff on every day...
    Recoverbro Elite
    "This is what we've been working on"
  21. Elite Member
    TexasLifter89's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  190 lbs.
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,237
    Rep Power
    38249
    Level
    62
    Lv. Percent
    8.53%
    Achievements Activity AuthorityActivity ProPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomahawk88 View Post
    Dermacrine TD has treated me great on my Superdrol cycle right now. I do agree the current version is a pain when it comes to applying. Living in Georgia I can sympathize. If only Derm dried faster and more effectively

    But ya I didnt particularly like my experience with Derma LV.
    Quote Originally Posted by RickRock13 View Post
    Yeh I agree with Tom here. I'm running topical Dermacrine on cycle right now as a test base and it really helps with the lethargy and libido issues, the only bad part is it seems like a second job to put that stuff on every day...
    Have you guys had blood work done to see what it's doing for your On cycle T levels? I'm just interested to know how well it actually works (however I can relate to the feeling it gives you).

    I see quite a few catchy transdermals, but I just can't see myself using them. They are safer and everything, but just sooo inconvenient for me at the moment. I would really like to see some blood tests comparing the 4ad rd to dermacrine for on cycle test benefits.
    - Join Me: Tex89 M-Sten RX Log... Dicing that iron -
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/222790-tex89s-msten-rx.html
  22. Elite Member
    Tomahawk88's Avatar
    Stats
    5'7"  250 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    9,005
    Rep Power
    629267
    Level
    64
    Lv. Percent
    36.85%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by TexasLifter89 View Post
    Have you guys had blood work done to see what it's doing for your On cycle T levels? I'm just interested to know how well it actually works (however I can relate to the feeling it gives you).

    I see quite a few catchy transdermals, but I just can't see myself using them. They are safer and everything, but just sooo inconvenient for me at the moment. I would really like to see some blood tests comparing the 4ad rd to dermacrine for on cycle test benefits.
    Sorry no blood work for this cycle. Def notice a difference from past cycles.

    I agree having to devote time for drying is a pain.
  23. Diamond Member
    jbryand101b's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    14,865
    Rep Power
    2755207
    Level
    87
    Lv. Percent
    92.39%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityActivity VeteranPosting ProPosting Authority

    I'm suprised nate didn't opt to use the same w/e he uses for the formastanz & chlorothoxy.

    that stuff dries fast as hell.
  24. Elite Member
    Tomahawk88's Avatar
    Stats
    5'7"  250 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    9,005
    Rep Power
    629267
    Level
    64
    Lv. Percent
    36.85%
    Achievements Activity ProActivity AuthorityPosting ProPosting Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    I'm suprised nate didn't opt to use the same w/e he uses for the formastanz & chlorothoxy.

    that stuff dries fast as hell.
    Yes the Forma-Stanzol dries while I apply it. No time spent waiting around for it to dry.
  

  
 

Similar Forum Threads

  1. test base
    By orvise in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 03-06-2004, 02:29 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Log in
Log in