Need Some Input On PH Choice

massbuilder77

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Ready to do another cycle...looking to cut some BF, went to PP's website and found out that they have cut out their old product line...I'm late on my news...

Anyways, I have done a cycle of PP TBol last year and learned alot from it. Now I'm ready with what I've learned in terms of diet and cycle support supps for a new cycle to chop down some BF, just get ready for the beach :D

I don't want something that is strong enough to require Clomid for a PCT, would prefer an OTC PCT regime.

I see Super DMZ or SDrol discussed but sounds too harsh.

Stuff like RNP Havoc or tren Xtreme seems to be fairly mild but can't seem to determine if it requires a real PCT or something OTC.

I'd like to know how to review various PHs and tell if they are better suited for bulking or cutting, but I don't know what to look for.

Thx for the input.
 

drudixon

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Havoc is supposed to need a real pct. Haven't run myself to say one way or another.
 
bakerderek0

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Both havoc & tren xtreme should be ran with a serm in pct. Tren xtreme is not a mild ph, it is mild on the liver, but the prolactin sides are considered very high.

I wouldn't run anything weaker than havoc. It's a waste in my opinion.
 

OnTheRoadTo

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You want an epistane clone and a real PCT. Head and shoulders above halo.
 
massbuilder77

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Thx for the feedback...looks like Havoc is going to be a good choice.

Any ideas on good sites to acquire a serm?
 
bakerderek0

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We can't post sources. Google research chemicals
 
massbuilder77

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Aside from the serm, anything other recommendations for cycle support or PCT?
 
Boagrius

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massbuilder77

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I would add Erase and DAA. Pretty good at rebounding test
I recall now I used Erase & DAA as my PCT when I did the cycle of PP Tbol...

Guess it wouldn't be a bad idea to add some kind of liver juice or support during cycle
 
Boagrius

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I recall now I used Erase & DAA as my PCT when I did the cycle of PP Tbol...

Guess it wouldn't be a bad idea to add some kind of liver juice or support during cycle
You can. I use milk thisle throughout cause its cheap and it works well enough to avoid problems.
 
RickRock13

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Aside from the serm, anything other recommendations for cycle support or PCT?
Adding in a good test booster to your PCT such as HCGenerate would be a good idea too :)
 
Dragon13

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Want lo lose BF + OTC PCT = 11-spray or 11-oxo. No PCT needed, really.
 

myleslup

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you could run halodrol but its still sketchy with otc pct
 
massbuilder77

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Want lo lose BF + OTC PCT = 11-spray or 11-oxo. No PCT needed, really.
doesnt E-Pharm sell that? i really don't know anything about it so glad your brought it up.

it would be nice to run something like this...my schedule is very erratic I can see it being a PITA trying to make sure I keep cycle going right
 

OnTheRoadTo

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S4 shouldn't be used by anyone. I like anabolic innovations cycle support for on cycle.
 
Boagrius

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SARMS are still being tested and not widely used. I would not go that far if you want a weak PH for this cycle. Also, 11-oxo is not strong enough solo. Stick with the Havoc or H-drol.
 

SirOtis11

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Curious as to what you'll choose and what PCT to go with. GL
 
Dragon13

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SARMS are still being tested and not widely used. I would not go that far if you want a weak PH for this cycle. Also, 11-oxo is not strong enough solo. Stick with the Havoc or H-drol.
Strong enough for what exactly? OP only wants to see teh abzzzz. He said he wants to cycle to "chop down some BF, just get ready for the beach". :sigh1: I don't even know why I posted in this thread. 11-oxo will work fine, 11-spray even better.
 
junkyarddogzz

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Sarms are amazing.....I would choose this over PH any day.
 
junkyarddogzz

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Ostarine/Mk-2866 Vs. Pro-hormones

The newest sarm or selective androgen modulator on the net is the exciting and extremely versatile Ostarine, aka "Mk-2866. Its Sarm like capabilities, Selective Androgen Receptor Modulators (SARMs) provide the benefits of traditional anabolic/androgenic steroids such as testosterone (including increased muscle mass, fat loss, and bone density), while showing a lower tendency to produce unwanted side effects. They are a unique class of molecules currently under development for treatment of many diseases, muscle loss, and joint repair(1). Mk-2866 has sown to have far superior anabolic capabilities to any other sarm available on the market today.

Osta-Sarms comparisons.

If you were looking for a comparison between the anabolic capabilities of Mk-2866 and pro-hormones, "hormones that convert into an active steroid such as Methyl-1,4AD into its target steroid, Dianabol" Then probably the best comparison after extensive use and experimentation is that of Dienedione wich is a well used and popular non-methylated steroid that converts to the steroid known as 17b-hydroxy-estra-4,9,(10)-dien-3-one (dienolone) or as most of us think of as Tren. Now the normal use of tren is to follow a 4-6 week protocol with doses ranging from 90-130mg for most users "these are average doses" And over 4-6 weeks you can expect between 6-12lbs of muscle gain with 60 percent remaining after pct and a few weeks down the line "again this is for the average user" Then thats followed by a PCT and the role of the post cycle therapy is to quickly return your testes and lh "luteinizing hormone" to fully functioning, wich isnt too difficult with this mild non methylated pro-hormone.
Now Dienedione wich is a 19-nor t compound has decent progestational effects which may lead to gyno symptoms, libido loss and aggressive mood swings. Part of the reason gyno may be a problem with this compound is also because it lacks androgenic potency and down-regulates DHT levels during cycle, which is the body’s natural estrogen blocker, so estrogen levels can rise during a cycle.

So why the comparison between Mk-2866 and a pro hormone like Tren?

There are a few good reasons, A 24mg, 4 week cycle of osta sarms should if the diet is spot on provide at least 5lbs of easily maintainable muscle, but you will get an increase in estrogen levels, partly because its not androgenic at all, and it increases free estradiol not to a high rate, but it might be through this means it has such an amazing effect on joints and tendons, and helps with the recovery of so many joint related injuries as sudies have reported(2).
The gains though just like tren are very lean, Users of tren nearly always report fat loss, ive seen rapid fat loss every time ive used Ostarine, body composition changes, and muscle hardening. But here the comparisons stop and Mk-2866/ Ostarine comes into its own.

Mk-2866 v Pro-hormones the facts.

Before a prohormone cycle you need to prepare your body, Milk thistle at 1g a day for 2 weeks prior, Hawthorn berry at 1g a day for 2 weeks prior to the cycle, Then during the cycle you need support supps, Formestane is probably your prefered choice of an A.I or aromatize inhibitor, Then you need your blood pressure supports, your liver supports, And then after the cycle you need a strong PCT " Post cycle therapy" or all your hard earned gains go out of the window. You will need a test booster, probably most will use a serm like Nolvadex to restart the leydig cells production of testosterone, An A.I again that needs to be tapered off to avoid rebound gyno from to much estrogen suppression, a cortisol blocker like low dose 11-oxo, and then your health supports, and cholesterol supports, and because your taking cholesterol supports you need co-enzyme q10 wich gets depleted by most cholesterol supplements.
So your talking about quite a lot of money being laid out, and the potential for side effects is quite high... hair loss, acne, and BPH "benign prostatic hyperplasia" to name but a few. So many other factors are involved aswell but to disscuss all of them would take an age.
The difference with Mk-2866 is dramatic, no need for prior cycle supports, no sides on cycle and in the blood tests ive seen no inhibition, just mildly raised estrogen levels. The gains are easy to maintain, no need for a PCT as you would with a pro-hormone, You have high oral biovailabilty without damage to your liver through conversion or being methylated, and you have a great sense of well being while on... and OSTARINE can be ran repeatedly without waiting for your normal rest period between cycles, Time on the pro-hormone + PCT = Time off.

Ostarine/ Mk-2866 potential uses

This is a new product, its potential is almost unlimited, its versatile enough to be incorporated into PCT therapies, It can be ran in between cycles, and it can be used to huge effect when taken as a standalone anabolic.
It binds strongly to the androgen receptor, but without the side effects normaly associated with high levels of DHT. It shows considerable properties as a hardening agent just slightly less than those of S4, wich itself is 1/3 as androgenic as Testosterone.
Its ability to cause fat los means it can be used on a cutting cycle and can be stacked effectivley with thermogenic or or nervous system stimulators.
Its potential to help heal those with debilitating injuries, and to speed up injury recovery makes its medicinal properties highly desirable, and all this without negative impact on your cholesterol, Blood pressure, Hair line, prostate, Heart or any other organ(3), Ostarine hands down blows pro-hormones out of the water if this was a UFC fight it would be a first round TKO.

The only question remaining is wether or not your willing to step up to the plate and pioneer the way fowards in the bodybuilding and fitness world?



Research.

1.A selective androgen receptor modulator with minimal prostate hypertrophic activity restores lean body mass in aged orchidectomized male rats.

Allan G, Sbriscia T, Linton O, Lai MT, Haynes-Johnson D, Bhattacharjee S, Ng R, Sui Z, Lundeen S.

Reproductive Therapeutics, Johnson & Johnson Pharmaceutical Research and Development, L.L.C., 1000 U.S. Route 202 South, Raritan, NJ, USA. [email protected]

A selective androgen receptor modulator with minim... [J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol. 2008] - PubMed result



2.Front Horm Res. 2009;37:163-82.Anabolic applications of androgens for functional limitations associated with aging and chronic illness.

Bhasin S, Storer TW.

Boston University School of Medicine, Section of Endocrinology, Diabetes, and Nutrition, Boston Medical Center, Boston, MA 02118, USA. [email protected]



3.Narayanan R, Mohler ML, Bohl CE, Miller DD, Dalton JT.

Preclinical Research and Development, GTx, Inc., Memphis, Tennessee, USA.

Selective androgen receptor modulators in preclini... [Nucl Recept Signal. 2008] - PubMed result

Androgen receptor (AR) plays a critical role in the function of several organs including primary and accessory sexual organs, skeletal muscle, and bone, making it a desirable therapeutic target. Selective androgen receptor modulators (SARMs) bind to the AR and demonstrate osteo- and myo-anabolic activity; however, unlike testosterone and other anabolic steroids, these nonsteroidal agents produce less of a growth effect on prostate and other secondary sexual organs. SARMs provide therapeutic opportunities in a variety of diseases, including muscle wasting associated with burns, cancer,



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Written by Russianstar.
 

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