m4ohn good, bad
- 06-29-2004, 01:35 PM
m4ohn good, bad
I would say that m4ohn is not really a good product. m1t still seems to be the best overall mass and result oreinted pro hormone out there. I tried 14 mg per day ds m4ohn, good diet training etc, all the basic training principals I been lifting for five years so I am not new to this. I seem to have been losing weight and overall lifting ability, some would say its good for cutting but really I think its way overhyped. I did this for two weeks and hve decided I do not want to increase to five pills a day. I am going to finish out with m1t for two weeks and then a full pct with nolva/clomid. My point to this thread is to see if consumers only of this product agree, overhyped and a waste of time and money, or not. When I say consumers regular guys who buy this stuff not producers or vendors. No offense to them but they are runnig a buisness.
- 06-29-2004, 01:42 PM
My knee-jerk reaction to this is to say that patience is a virtue and this is not a 2 week androgen. Why you are losing lifting ability? I don't know, but don't expect an androgen to lift for you.
I am just now starting my third week at a very low dose of 8mg/day, and so far I think it is a reasonable product. Sides are non-existent, I'm up 4 pounds, and some vascularity effects are starting to be shown. I'm running this for 6 weeks and will hold my ultimate conclusion till then, but so far I've seen pretty much what I expected/wanted out of the low dose cycle.
- 06-29-2004, 01:53 PM
With the exception of M1t & a few AAS, all androgens take 2 weeks minimum for any type of results. 14mg/day is a very mild dose, except for 150-160 pounders.
M4OHN was never touted as being a great mass builder, it provides mild lean gains. Not 8 lbs of water & 2 lbs LBM in 2 weeks like m1t. You will not retain water, it will all be LBM gains. And it takes time, thats why 6-week cycles are recommended for M4OHN. I think if you run it at 20mg or more for 6 weeks next time around, you'll feel differently. Just don't expect to expect to gain 15lbs. If you want to bulk, there are obviously better options. I ran it at 20mg with 1-test & liked it a lot. The only thing that sucks, is unless you can get it in powder- it's too expensive to get 20+mg per day with tabs. A cycle would run you a few hundred bucks.
06-29-2004, 02:19 PM
Originally Posted by Longdog
How so? The tabs that DS sells and that Mike has now for 29.99 come in a 90 ct. at 4mg's each. You could run a cycle of 24mg/day for 30 days for 60 bones, thats 2 bottles. Last time I checked, 60 bucks for a cycle is CHEAP!! Many people have gotten so spoiled on not only M1T gains, but the price...not saying you LD, but people in general...
06-29-2004, 02:43 PM
OK, I may have overstimated that a bit. It would be about $100 for 6 weeks at 28mg though. And that's barely over a gram of M4OHN, which would run about 1/3rd that price in powder.Originally Posted by Jergo
06-29-2004, 02:44 PM
Originally Posted by Longdog
Hell yeah, powder is where its at no doubt. Too bad it's all sold out...
06-29-2004, 03:34 PM
Some of these posts are ridiculous. People need to do more research before they purchase and use these PH/PS. If you bought M4OHN with the understanding that it will put massive amounts of muscle on you then you should have read more before buying. This is like saying Anavar and Winstrol are not good products because they don't produce the gains/mass that dbol or Anadrol do. M4OHN is compared closer to the likes of Anavar which is a lean mass/cutter AAS while M1T is a mass builder with the like of DBol and Anadrol. Many of us are not looking to put on tons of size via water weight along with hash sides as with M1T. Some of us are looking for options with low side effects, lean mass with low water retention and more retainable gains. You need to use the right tool (or in this case PH/PS) for the job. M4OHN is also good for stacking and/or cycling with other PH/PS to help with either bulking or cutting, similar to how many of the milder AAS out there (like Deca, Winny, and Anavar) are used. M1T can not safely be stacked with most PH/PS and should only really be used for 2 weeks at a time while M4OHN can be used with many of the non-methyls. Many people are stacking the oral M4OHN along with a transdermal or injectable combination like 1-test/4AD with very positive results. M4OHN can also be used in higher doses by itself for cutting cycles as well.
Researching before buying will save you alot of money in the future and will provide you with results closer to what you are looking for.
Originally Posted by Ironchef
06-29-2004, 03:40 PM
Just looking for general opinions, so far its exspensive, For 100 bucks I can run fina for six weeks and gain 15 pounds solid(granted its illegal). Why should I buy this stuff. M1t did not really give me any problems as far as sides. So with that in mind two weeks rendered me 13 pounds greater some water, after pct I was 9 pounds solid and still making gains. And two weeks worth of hp cost me like five bucks. If its not a great mass or strength builder whats the point really?? I can get lean buy diet and cardio and keep my muscle. People dont need to get so defensive I just think we are getting played a little bit buy spending all this $$ on two or three diffrent Items to stack. When you do(a ph stack) 100 bucks is spent easy along with pct anacileries. And yes things take time I know It took me years to be 5' 11 201pds, I just keep on lifting. But comparing to Anavar please there is none, maybe on paper but really come on.
06-29-2004, 03:53 PM
As has been said, If you just want mass /strength, then M4OHN is not for you. Go for the fina, m1t, etc.
Compounds like M4OHN & anavar or for those who just want to gain a little, & look hard & lean. Read TBigs' post again. It's perfect for me to run in the summer, because I don't need any more mass right now. I am already 220 & pretty lean, I don't want to gain 15lbs now & hold water. I'll do that in the winter. If you use M4OHN with similar goals, you'll love it. If you are looking for an m1t alternative, keep looking.
06-29-2004, 04:16 PM
I think the main benefits of M4OHN are that you get decent lean gains or weight loss with
virtually no sides and it's legal and cheaper than Var. You can also stack it with a lot of things. If people realized this before their cycle then they would have more realistic expectations for the results.
At the same time, I see why your disappointed Ironchef. With so many posts talking about it,
it's easy to expect amazing things.
06-29-2004, 04:25 PM
Another thing to look at when evaluating compounds is how you feel when you're on.
For example, when on Test I absolutely felt great....I enjoyed the hardness, the mental feelings, the pumps, the vascualrity, etc..
The effects when on is what I mainly look into when deciding a cycle. IMO, thats the best part other than the actual gains you keep when finished.
06-29-2004, 06:37 PM
06-29-2004, 09:17 PM
Posts like this always remind me what a breakthrough M1T wasOriginally Posted by Longdog
In my case, for my first cycle I don't want 15 lbs of gains......since its taken so freaking long to lose 180+ lbs
So I'm looking for something that will replace 2-3 lbs of fat with 4-5 lbs of lean dry muscle so M4OHN is the ticket.
06-29-2004, 10:07 PM
I'm almost in my third week of m4ohn and haven't really seen any significant results. I may have gained 2-3 lbs but that can be as much to any changes in my diet but I have remained at about 8% bf. My gf noticed that my chest seems bigger and she's usually pretty observant about any body comp changes with me.Originally Posted by Jergo
I have had no noticeable sides and do feel great on it. Libido is definitely amped as well. I began at 8mg for the first 10 days and then actually reduced it to 6mg and back to 8mg. For the last 5 days I may even increase it to 12mg.
06-29-2004, 10:29 PM
Ironchef, the reason for the overhype on this is the expectation. People just don't know how to use this compound, underdose it, and get dissappointed. The starting point is 25-30mg, 40 to be safe. Then I bet you would see the mass result you seek. Below this dose, it's just a cutter. Be patient, sldg has hinted that he has some new stuff around the corner and I suspect one of these will be a bulker.
06-29-2004, 10:45 PM
It's a mild compound, but it has its advantages - no DHT sides and exceptionally quick recovery time. As my experience taught me:
- you can't get too aggressive cutting with it. At least not before a 2 week front loading period.
- you may experience "DHT-esque" sides if you go over 20mg
my opinion is:
combine M4OHN with 1test to cut (otherwise you will probably lose muscle if you are below maintance).
it can be used alone to bulk.
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06-29-2004, 11:52 PM
agree with op
i agree that the product (m40hn) is totally overhyped. at first i thought i was getting some gains, then i realized it was probably just the placebo effect. i just finished my 6 week cycle, used hm gear's m4ohn at 40 mg/day for the first 3 weeks and the designer supps stuff since, continuing at 40 mg. i weigh 205 at about 10% bf. this was the highest dose i've heard of anyone using, and i may be insane, but i wanted to test its efficacy. gained probably 2 lbs, but that can be attributed to a calorie surplus of ~300-500/day.
i'm on day 3 of recovery with 6-oxo and nolva, and i'm having no symptoms whatsover of post-cycle lethargy, depression, etc like i would after an m1t cycle (that one was a pain in the ass) or a std. test/deca stack. in fact i rubbed one out twice today before boning my gf earlier. my point is, recovery off any prohormone/steroid is NEVER this easy
IMO, m1t is the one methylated substance that works beyond a shadow of a doubt. i think the sides are overrated; i've had great success running it at 20mg/day for 2 weeks with proper nolva recovery. i will be stocking up on it before the ban and it should serve me well for the next few years. great ****!
06-30-2004, 12:24 AM
im in the middle of my third week with MOHN 24mg ED........im not feeling anythin yet. Im keeping my diet at maitinance. im planning to run my cycle for 6 weeks, i will wait till the end of the forth week and see. if nothing happened then i will stop my cycle then.
06-30-2004, 12:28 AM
I think far to many people are using these products at to low a dosage. Think about anadrol, winstrol, and anavar; these are all used at about the 50mg dosage if not higher. Now this does not correlate exactly; my point is that substances are taken in higher dosages to achieve results but when lower dosages are used gains are not nearly as evident. Safety is the main reason for the low recommended dosages, and some many even respond well to a low dose. Hwoever, the reality is that most will not respond on a low dose.
06-30-2004, 08:02 AM
Too Low of a dose is definitely an issue. I decided to do a clean bulk on this stuff.
I started lifting at 18years old. Gained and average of 10 lbs a year naturally (except one try on paradeca years ago) until I was 27years old. Started at 150 and got to 240 with a steady clean bulk diet but definitely not as lean. I learned the value of rest, and proper nutrition. My avatar was when I was 22 at 190lbs. Muscles were cold and I didn’t have a lot of mass but I’ll probably never be that lean again so I kinda like it.
At 27, I took a little over a year off and lost a ton of weight. I got down to about 175. I used to eat about 4500 calories a day before I stopped and dropped to about 2000 when I quite. Lost all my fat, but obviously a ton of muscle. I got back into lifting about 1 year ago and using everything I've learned over the years to get back to 200 lbs lean with the strength I had at 215 lbs years back.
I hit a plateau for the last few months and I knew from experience that I couldn’t expect much more at 200lbs so I would have to gain weight if I wanted to get stronger. I wanted to gain more muscle like before but without having to eat tons and gain the fat I gained before.
I figured I’d try the m4ohn and add in some more calories hoping most would become Muscle.
Well it worked. I have gained 20lbs already and not much is fat at all. I thought I was gaining more fat but it must have been mostly water from all the carbs, because I’ll take in some coffee or ephedrine from time to time and look much better.
Now I guess you could say the fact that I had more muscle at one time, allowed me to just take advantage of muscle memory. But gaining 20lbs and an inch on my arms in just under 6 weeks seems good to me. These weight gains didn’t start for almost a few weeks too. I started at 10mg, then 20, 30 and now 40 for the last few days, and the difference between 40 and 20 is night and day. I am now stronger than I was at 240 at many excercises, but much leaner.
Anyway, I just wanted to give more info about my past because this weight gain seems ridiculous considering I thought I might gain like 5-10 lbs. many may dismiss it as muscle memory from 2.5 years ago but I really do think if you take enough of this stuff and eat more, you will like what you see. I didn’t want to stack it because of potential increase in sides.
06-30-2004, 09:38 AM
Nice bro...would there be any way that you could get some tests run now and again post cycle in order to help us see if such a high dose is safe?Originally Posted by swany
06-30-2004, 09:57 AM
I know that M4OHN is touted as having few noticeable side effects, so many are saying up the dosage to get more results. However, I also thought methyls are hard on the liver, so even if the noticeable sides ("symptoms") are low with high doses, the liver may be overloaded, right??????
06-30-2004, 10:00 AM
I was going to but then I thought I read that Bobo said enzyme tests were worthless during a cycle... I will soon though. I did make sure my urine never changed from being clear and would have stopped if it did.. but i know that's probably a false sense of security. I do take a gram of R-ala, 1 gram of NAC, and 1 gram of active milk thistle every day... maybe thats why I needed so muchOriginally Posted by Jergo
06-30-2004, 01:20 PM
People are failing to realize one thing. M1T works better than almost any AAS out there. It has the most side effects as well. So you take something that we all know is less potent, and you expect mind blowing gains. It doesn't work that way, M1T is stronger than winny and many other AAS profiles. That being said, don't expect a goat to give you cows milk if you know what I mean.
06-30-2004, 01:51 PM
Originally Posted by AXE
Yep, M1T is indeed some powerful ****...
06-30-2004, 02:57 PM
I would say in general Im not comparing the two, yes I made some comparisons m1t m4ohn. Like I said just looking for everyones general opinion, seems to me most of us taking the recomended doses were disapointed, to the credit of some of the other posts being that we were underdosing. But dam, 40mgs per day thats ten pills!! 90ct of ds a nine day supply is 35-45$$. So for a six week cycle 163$$ at the low end of the spectrum 4 bottles, seems crazy to me but hey thats just mo. I was hoping to get results with two.
06-30-2004, 03:16 PM
It is still very cheap. This is the most similar product to Anavar out there. Do you know what that cost? up to one dollar a milligram. I have never tried anavar but those who have agree you need a lot more than 1/10th the amount of m4ohn as anavar to get comparable results. The 10x as anavar number came from studies with rats, not humans. Maybe you even need the same amount.Originally Posted by Ironchef
so you feel you need to take 40mgs day? (which most people may not need anything close to) Thats 10 pills/day @ under $4/day if you buy his special. Tell me, what does a sandwich cost at Subway? yeah, m1t may be cheap, but I'll never touch that stuff.
Ironchef: sorry,didn't mean to attack your post, I just think for what m4ohn can do, the tabs are worth it.
Last edited by swany; 06-30-2004 at 04:50 PM.
06-30-2004, 03:21 PM
Originally Posted by swany
Dude, I know you're only giving your point of view, but var doesn't cost a dollar/mg. It's still expensive though, no doubt. Usually around 300 tops for a 5-6 week cycle at high dosing.
Anyways, I have spoken to guys that have ran both var and OHN. They say that it's no where near the same. Although, they were running the OHN at a much lower dose, so the jury is still out on that one.
I can't stand M1T either though. The sides just kick my ass all day...
06-30-2004, 06:19 PM
m4ohn/anavar no comparison, at least when I pay the high price for anavar (the most exspensive aas out there) I know im getting good results, seems to me the verdict is still out on m4ohn.
06-30-2004, 06:43 PM
Have you ever used var? If so, did it work for you and @ what dose? I tell you what, I have never exceeded 20mg, but that didn't do ****! Var is overhyped IMO, the m4ohn is probably at least 1.5x as anabolic on paper maybe 2x but not 10x, I don't know where that # came fromOriginally Posted by Jergo
06-30-2004, 06:51 PM
from what I've read so far I would't even consider trying M4OHN for the cost. If it came down maybe, but until then there are so many other anabolics to play with for a better cost/benefit ratio IMHO. I haven't tried it yet, but even the best reports I've read do not convince me to spend the coin....then again most new methyl's don't except M1T and maybe M1,4. JMO
06-30-2004, 06:58 PM
Originally Posted by DR.D
Yeah I hear you bro. I dunno where that number came from either besides the vida tables. I always hear that var is overhyped as well. But most of the people don't understand that ALL drugs don't and won't make you gain 20lbs. in 5 weeks..LOL..
For it's purposes though, I'd still like to give it a try sometime. I was actually thinking of doing that this winter. Or rather right before spring when I go on vacation. So no, I've never tried it. That sucks though that you spent all that cash on it and didn't get results. Most people that I know will run it a 40mg/day at the minimum. So maybe your dose was just too low.
06-30-2004, 07:11 PM
The 10x figure came from another website selling something similar. Also Sledge said 8mg gave him some effect and he said he needed ~70-80mg anavar for some similar feel.
The earliest feedback from beta testers were all very good, all getting good results at <10mg. Sifu ran his at 5mg at 200lb.
Its a diff situation now.
06-30-2004, 09:10 PM
50 mgs (var), yes seems high stacked with (prov), got rock hard and extremly vascular wich I still have to this day, it was $$ but I burned lots of body fat, and came out with a lean ripped look. People at the gym still look at me like I am a freak When I pumped up beaacuse all my veins pop out all over. I should post some pics, its on my to do list but need to take my camera to the gym. Right now im in the middle of a large move so it may take a couple of months. But the m4ohn in a limited trial did nothing for me, it may be a premature judgement but hey it was worth a shot.
06-30-2004, 09:31 PM
feedback on M4OHN seems inconsistent even at the highest dosages. at 40mg/day, jimmyvalmar gained 2 pounds and swany gained a whopping 20pounds after 6weeks. anybody else?
06-30-2004, 10:33 PM
i've been taking 20mg for the last 3 weeks and for the next 2 i will up the dose to 30 mg,,,i didnt notice much in means of strength and size but muscles feel alot tighter and look and feel dense...its a good product,,,,but nothing like m1t,,,but i havent noticed **** for sides
06-30-2004, 11:24 PM
Originally Posted by DR.D
I have used anavar many times and you are correct that 20mg is not enough for a male. Anavar is my favorite outside of testosterone, however it is expensive and a dosage of 40+mg is needed.
06-30-2004, 11:29 PM
What is it about var that makes it your favorite, like effects/lack of sides, if it's not the price. That's really what kept my doses low is that I just couldn't affort 40mg/day! What does it stack w/ and how sup. is it on its own?Originally Posted by size
07-01-2004, 07:41 AM
well my weight increase isn't all dry gains though...I substantially increased my carbs so I have to assume muscle glycogen stores are quite high. I would have gained decent weight without the m4ohn, but not as much and defenitely not with such a favorable muscle/fat ratio.Originally Posted by lancelot
07-01-2004, 10:59 AM
Mohn & blood pressure
Anyone had any trouble with high blood presssure while taking MOHN?? I've heard methyls can raise bp but how much? I've been on MOHN 8-12 mgs & am in week 3 and bp is averaging 160/105-110 which is way high. I've also had some killer headaches for a week. The only difference to my diet is the MOHN. No other supps being used.
I was going to add in my M5aa for cutting this week but I dont wanna have stroke y'know?? Anyone else had this problem??
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