Anyone else used Fina W/ 1-T and 4AD trans?

[macattack]

When is the best time to run the fina, i have heard the last 2 weeks of the cycle.

 

[pogue]

Bad idea, fina will shut you down hard and will make getting your test levels back up almost impossible. You want to run fina w/ 4ad and not 1test and you want to run it for an entire cycle. Just hold off on it till you finish this cycle and use it next time.

 

[macattack]

Damn i am reading the opposite of what your saying to me all over the place dude, even the Got Fina board..

 

[pjorstad]

Bad idea. Save the fina or 1-test to break each others plateau. What i mean is 1-test and fina both can lose their efficeincy over multiple cycles however when you switch over to the fina or 1-test gains go back to optimum again. This is what patrick arnold has said and based on my 3rd cycle im gonna have to probably agree. Then again i guess since your putting in 4-AD that might not apply but i still think it might apply.

 

[WYD02]

Why would you run fina for only two weeks?

 

 

[macattack]

I found this on another board, does this sound correct?
I would like to run it as long as i can without taking the risk of getting Gyno, and i need to run clomid or Nolvadex with it or have it handy incase gyno appears, stuff must be very potent....




If using gel to apply Fina, good results can be had with as little as 40 mgs per day when stacked with at least 250 mgs/week of testosterone. I would always stack Fina with test whenever possible. When using Fina only, the dose needs to be bumped up to 80-160 mgs per day in two or three equal applications. It should be applied to a clean, hairless part of the body. Inside of forearms and upper chest work well. The PLO gel forms sort of a depot in the skin that provides sustained release of the drug.

 

[pogue]

That sounds correct. Fina can cause progesterone and prolactin release as well, which nolvadex will not help. I personally recommend running a fina/4ad cycle, but fina only would be okay. Ideally you want to get 75-100mg daily, and you probably would want to run it for about 4-6 weeks. And as already stated, don't run it with 1-test.

 

[macattack]

Ok help me please, the Fina is going to shut down natural test nearly completely correct? that leaves the fina which converts into trenoboline? its androgenic ratio is 2/3 thats 2 times more anabolic the test and 3 times more androgenic.

Sooooo we are saying is were not relying on TEST were relying soley on the Trenobline for the growth factor here, that being the steroid?

I am definetly lame here, thanks for the help and patients pogue

 

[macattack]

Damn heres something more i found


1. ALWAYS use a base of test.
2. Stack one other item on the test.
3. Best results for MOST people will be with another androgen like tren or d-ball.
4. Have arimdex on hand and use if needed while on to keep est related sides at bay.
5. No one can tell you what you will gain or what the sides will be, you need to find out for yourself.
6. Longer cycles tend to allow one to keep more muscle when you come off.
7. ALWAYS use clomid post cycle.
8. Modify your training post cycle to ensure you retain as much gains as possible.
9. If your diet and supp intake isn't optimized FORGET ALL OF IT!

 

[Bean]

Ok help me please, the Fina is going to shut down natural test nearly completely correct? that leaves the fina which converts into trenoboline? its androgenic ratio is 2/3 thats 2 times more anabolic the test and 3 times more androgenic.

Sooooo we are saying is were not relying on TEST were relying soley on the Trenobline for the growth factor here, that being the steroid?

I am definetly lame here, thanks for the help and patients pogue

Yes of course, all AAS and PHs when used in sufficient (ie. useful) amounts will shut down your natural test production
fina does not convert into anything; fina IS trenbelone

no you're relying on test for growth factor as well; thats one of the reasons its stacked... test IS a type of steroid

Damn heres something more i found


1. ALWAYS use a base of test.
2. Stack one other item on the test.
3. Best results for MOST people will be with another androgen like tren or d-ball.
4. Have arimdex on hand and use if needed while on to keep est related sides at bay.
5. No one can tell you what you will gain or what the sides will be, you need to find out for yourself.
6. Longer cycles tend to allow one to keep more muscle when you come off.
7. ALWAYS use clomid post cycle.
8. Modify your training post cycle to ensure you retain as much gains as possible.
9. If your diet and supp intake isn't optimized FORGET ALL OF IT!

1)yes i feel the same way; you can make great gains off of test alone and it keeps your sex drive up among other things
2)again you don't have to run something else to make good gains
3)yes this is true
4)half true; depends on what you're taking
5)yes they can partly... all AAS have some associated side effects and they differ from person to person; but GENERALLY the sides describes will happen on average
6)generally this is true unless the substances shut you down HARD for a LONG time... even using anti-e's if you crash too hard from too long you won't be keeping the gains
7)yes always use clomid and/or another anti-e... i would stack anti-e's... i plan on running 6-oxo with clomid after my cycle
8)yes this is also true; if you modify your normal routine to include higher volume (a good idea), then you need to back it back down to normal (working out harder will not help at all)
9)half true, you still can make gains eating a shitty diet and shitty supps... but gains are MUCH better and easier to keep when you do it right...

you can get by with just a protein supp, a weight gainer supp, and maybe some vitamin supps like livertabs or vit c/a, etc... other supps IMO aren't really necessary for bulking... course there are all kinds of things; but i feel this is all i need

 

[pogue]

My suggestion is to just do a bunch of reading, all you can. You still need to do a lot of research before you start to do steroids. Read through the posts about fina, there are many on this board. Gotfina.com and bb.com's steroid section are also good places to read. Just read a lot and learn as much as you can.

Those items you listed are basically opinions, but I agree with most of them. Just keep looking around, and you'll find what you're searching for

 

[macattack]

Now were getting somewhere i think, there are misconceptions out here and different opinions i am just trying to rattle them all together and see what i get, i dont want to hurt myself any more then i have in the past is all and i am walking a thin line as it is.

I use all the same supps as you bean except for bulking type supps i have layed off them i am 280 right now and have cut out most of the fat in my diet keeping carbs and HIGH protein, with GVT workouts during the cycle.

Thanks for the input...

 

[macattack]

Pogue i am bouncing back and fourth between all 3 sites , i have threads going at all 3 right now on this, i wont to know the truth and am also doing research on other medical sites, even those having to do with COWS

 

[Bean]

well cutting out the fats won't do much for you man

carbs are what i think you need to cut out if you think you got too much fat...

fats give you energy... if i eat a low-fat diet i feel lethargic, slow, etc

 

[macattack]

Man i have a choice here CARBS or FAT, i chose fat because my biggest hurtle is BURGERS hence the Macattack name, i get plenty ofenergyfrom carbs i think, i haven't cut fats out completely still doing some red meat but Lean, just no more drive thrus Bro

 

[Bean]

there's more carbs than fat in the big mac dude just checked it out today when i purchased one for a quick fix (along with a protein drink)

can't remember where i saw the total numbers; but i think a double whopper meal with super sized everything equaled out to like 1500-2000 calories in one sitting... the MAJORITY of which was carbs (especially from the fries)

i try to stay away from the drive thrus unless its chik-fil-a or chinese/japanese takeout or something... or BBQ

yeah lean meats are where its at... the rest of my family is trying to lose weight; and for some stupid reason they've cut out beef a lot; no more good lean hamburgers

 

[macattack]

I know this much 1 meal for me at Jack in the Box is equal to 2-1/2 days worth of food on a friends Weight Watchers diet, thats when i really got the picture of what i was doing here and 2 weeks ago i hit my all time high of 290 so that was wake up hour.


I had a burger tonight, lean, no bread, no fries and a salad that was good enough, plus doing 4 protein shakes a day (low card) stuff with small meals hope to get a handle on this.

thanks for all your help one and all.....

 

[pjorstad]

Test does not need to be a base of any cycle that has tren in it. I disagree with that. That is merely for libido reasons. In fact having test will HURT you. Thats right it will HURT you. Fina has special properites that only exist with fina that allows it to suppress fat storage that will be killed if you add test in with no antiestrogen, so you should lean out automatically while packing on muscle, your probably mostly likely gonna lose fat while gaining muscle steadily without even an effort i would imagine unless your eating double the calories you normally eat or something I guess you can avoid the fat storage dillema by running an anti-E the whole cycle if you use testosterone BUT then your displacing fina from the receptor anyways by having testosterone in the mix and your running ANti-E's so what the hell is the point of having test other then libido??? If your cycle is 4 weeks or less you don't need test regardless because finadick doesn't come in until week 5 for almost EVERYONE. Besides your gonna have to deal with it postcycle anyways so whats the big deal, just keep fina to 4 weeks anyways because it shuts you down harder then test There truly is no drug like fina, ask around

 

[macattack]

thanks Pjorstad, taking as much of this in as i can, just goingto have to do it and find out, cant wait

 

[pjorstad]

Hey im a learner about fina too but based on my research when doing fina most of the reason for having the testosterone is for libido, problem is it will increase chance of gyno with fina which is hard to fix since its progesterone gyno and also makes recovery harder with estrogen floating around postcycle. And as said before the libido usually isn't killed till week 4 or 5 so if oyu keep the cycle short its not a problem. Anyways i could go on and on but i already did in the prevous post. If your gonna run test with it run an anti-estrogen the whole cycle so you don't let the estrogen foul everything up. Again i feel its not necessary for the first 3 or 4 weeks from all the readings of people around boards.

Shoot me a pm in about 2 weeks and ill let you know how things are going with fina only for my cows ok?

 

[macattack]

OK cool i'll do that then, 2 weeks geta moveon LOL

Just keep reading the 6-8 is best on this tren cycle?

I think i am just going to run out this cycle doing test and 4Ad right now then next cycle will be little more serious, this has been a good year so far i dont want to screw up and make a mistake along the way so i need more time studying and weighing.

Still even with 4 weeks i hope you have clomid Just in case, your dealing with some serious glandular **** here ya know
I hope it goes well for you Bro....

 

[Bean]

test hurt you? uhhh NO...

go tell that to the TONS of people that run fina/test...

test does not give all water bloat dude; and it doesn't give you FAT gain; jesus christ quit giving out false info...

EVERY thread I have EVER read; I mean EVERY ONE of them that dealt with the question of fina being stacked said to run it with test... now your telling me that some bullshit you read in that no one else has ever seen is more true than real-world results given by TONS of bbers on various forums? i think not...

macattack; for more info and the BEST info on fina; check out gotfina.com... can't ask you to trust me anymore than PJ; but go check it out with people who have actually USED REAL test...

test DOES give muscle gain; and it depends on what kind of test you run to what kind of water bloat you get along with other sides; i'll prove it to you on my next cycle

PJ, did you know if you run an anti-estrogen while ON cycle it WILL hurt your gains? and that test does pack on muscle and its not all water weight? go read up man; i know you like to help but this is misinformation... go read the thread YJ posted about test response... think they packed on fat instead of muscle?

i'm PRETTY damn sure but test and fina DO NOT compete for the same receptors

 

[pjorstad]

test hurt you? uhhh NO...

go tell that to the TONS of people that run fina/test...

test does not give all water bloat dude; and it doesn't give you FAT gain; jesus christ quit giving out false info...

EVERY thread I have EVER read; I mean EVERY ONE of them that dealt with the question of fina being stacked said to run it with test... now your telling me that some bullshit you read in that no one else has ever seen is more true than real-world results given by TONS of bbers on various forums? i think not...

macattack; for more info and the BEST info on fina; check out gotfina.com... can't ask you to trust me anymore than PJ; but go check it out with people who have actually USED REAL test...

test DOES give muscle gain; and it depends on what kind of test you run to what kind of water bloat you get along with other sides; i'll prove it to you on my next cycle

PJ, did you know if you run an anti-estrogen while ON cycle it WILL hurt your gains? and that test does pack on muscle and its not all water weight? go read up man; i know you like to help but this is misinformation... go read the thread YJ posted about test response... think they packed on fat instead of muscle?

i'm PRETTY damn sure but test and fina DO NOT compete for the same receptors

Ok the problem is a lot of all this is based on opinion. So with that said i don't give a crap what they say at gotfina because i think they are wrong and i wont change my mind for anything.





And for that the rest of your post is gone. If you continue to post complete BS, you won't be able to post at all. Takea hint and research before you post.

 

[macattack]

AHEM

LOL you guys know alot more then i do on this least it sounds like it to me so i wont interfere, i cant choose who's right and who's wrong because i dont know enough YET, i am still researching all of this. Probablyhave 20 hours or more socked into it already. Its a good question when it makes for this kind of debate.

I gained at least 10 pounds on my last cycle of Test yeah alot was water 2 gallons of it a day body is bound to saturate a lot of it, also put some fat on but my strength to this day is way up even after being off it for 6weeks, now back on another but with 4AD and starting to bulge in the guy already after a week now.

Personal experience is what i look for also, i wont do this cycle like the last one, i want leaner gains so i am knocking down some things i used the last time, high fat for one, yes taking in fat just not as much i dont want FAT gain, less carbs also and more protein, and see how i develope this time, now some guys will argue me there, but i am going on what my last cycle was like so tweaking it just a bit.

I am 41 years old, when i was in my 20's 300 pound bench was nothing, i think i hit 385 back then but i havent done that sort of weight in years, Saturday i hit 300 again like it was 220 so things are looking up, things really slow down when you start getting up here in age, but i feel better today then i did then.....

And always try to agree to disagree, that way we remain friends

Peace out