Why Do Bodybuilders Use Insulin?
- 10-23-2010, 05:10 PM
Why Do Bodybuilders Use Insulin?
I apologize for bringing up the subject of insulin for the 50th time on these boards, but after reading practically every post on insulin on this site, I am still in the dark as to why (relatively) healthy bodybuilders inject themselves with insulin.
Yes, insulin shifts substrate utilization towards CHO and is thus protein sparring in the muscle, yes it is anti-catabolic and if anabolism stays the same and catabolism goes down, net protein synthesis will go up and all the other stuff that has been discussed.
BUT, a non-diabetic's body can manufacture sufficient insulin to even dispose of 10,000 kcal a day without any problems (am I wrong here?). The truth is, bodybuilders do not consume 10,000 calories -and the vast vast majority are not diabetics, at least yet. Even without shooting exogenous insulin, they can utilize the glucose in their bloods. Why, then do they inject themselves with insulin? Would doing so not simply lead the pancreas to down-regulate insulin output and exogenous insulin simply replace endogenous insulin? If such is not the case and you do end up with more insulin in the blood over a 24 hour period by using exogenous administration, would you not end up with more insulin than needed to handle the calories you consume? What would be the advantage of this?
And, just to clarify what i am talking about; ALL PRO BODYBUILDERS USE EXOGENOUS INSULIN. You can ask how I know this and, sure I have not spoken to all of them, but if you talk to anyone who has been around bodybuilders, it is common knowledge that these guys walk around with a slin pen at all times. There is (almost) no exception to this rule. And these guys grow far larger with insulin, in again, practically every single case... Why? How?
- 10-23-2010, 05:59 PM
its crazy to me, your body produces enough insulin to cope with whatever you eat otherwise ppl would regularly end up in comas or hypoglycemic after drinking cokeacola.
IGF-1 would be a far better choice to spend £$ on...
10-23-2010, 06:19 PM
10-23-2010, 06:22 PM
yeah thats playing with fire in my book. i dont think i could ever pick up a protocol good enough to make me take the plunge....
AAS - its NOTHIN! but insulin? no thank you i will leave that to those willing to risk it
NTBM Line @ NUTRAPLANET
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Need2slin... NOM NOM NOM :yup:
10-23-2010, 06:41 PM
I am not asking if you think it is a good idea to use insulin.
I would never use it myself anyways...
I am trying to understand why and how it helps the pro bodybuilders get so much bigger...
10-23-2010, 07:01 PM
There is a low-dose protocol I tried once more for recomp purposes, interesting science behind it. Not mine to share. I don't think it's that wildly popular anymore. You seem to understand it's anabolic properties, and basal insulin levels won't be as high as you can achieve with an injection.
10-24-2010, 01:44 PM
10-24-2010, 01:56 PM
10-24-2010, 02:12 PM
10-24-2010, 05:02 PM
As you know it has its anabolic properties. Many pre-workout and intra-workout products have "insulin mimickers". Maybe if you emailed one of those companies and asked why they include that in their product, they could shed some light. A majority of those products have the explanation right on the bottle actually, but im pretty sure they put it somewhat like "a spike in insulin shuttles nutrients into muscle cells much faster then normal"
10-24-2010, 05:11 PM
The reason that bodybuilders are interested in insulin lies in it's ability to cause the storage of greater amounts of carbohydrates and amino acids inside muscle cells. Insulin is both anabolic and anti-catabolic in nature, and can produce dramatic and rapid increases in the size and fullness of the muscles when used "correctly.
For many, insulin may seem like the perfect bodybuilding drug. It's legal, cheap, effective, and easy to obtain. However, the decision to use insulin is not one that can be made lightly. At worst, the misuse or abuse of anabolic steroids will probably result in no more than elevated liver enzymes and a host of undesirable cosmetic side effects. Improper use of insulin will result in much more serious consequences, including death. Bodybuilders must first ask themselves if they possess the necessary maturity and intelligence to responsibly use this hormone. Look before you leap my friends.
10-24-2010, 05:21 PM
Google several key terms:
"Insulin-regulated PI3K signaling pathway," "serine/threonine kinase Akt," and "insulin-mediated gene transcription and translation"
Insulin's effects extend far past preferential substrate utilization.
10-24-2010, 08:46 PM
in simple terms because it works very very well .below is a read that should answer your question on why bb use it.though as a few here have stated its very dangerous and deadly if you don't know what the hell your doing.There use to be a great read over at the other forum but its long gone now but this read below is pretty good.If you thinking of using it get help from someone who has used it before and do alot of research and also check your family history for issues that may make using this out of the question.
what is insulin?
Insulin is a hormone secreted by the beta cells of the pancreas that controls the metabolism and cellular uptake of sugars, proteins, and fats. As a drug, it is used principally to control diabetes. Insulin is not a steroid.
What type of insulin should I use for bodybuilding?
Humulin R and Humulog are the only insulins I recommend because they act fast and are out of the body fastest(this makes them the safest). I have never used Humalog but understand that aside from quicker onset and half-life it is essentially the same.
Why do I want to use insulin?
Insulin has been called "Anabolicus Maximus" by some gurus of the bodybuilding world. Insulin can give you greater gains than you have ever had using anabolics alone. Insulin, in combination with androgens and resistance exercise, may trigger maturation of satellite muscle cells (small, more or less useless cells that are held in reserve, which do not contribute to muscular strength) into mature muscle cells that do contribute to muscular size and strength. How freakin cool is that. Hyperinsulinemia has been shown to stimulate protein synthesis in isolated limb infusion experiments , these anabolic properties seem to be the result of insulin binding to IGF-1 receptors.
If insulin is so great why aren't all diabetics huge?
Diabetics have a disease and use insulin to replace endogenous insulin that they cannot produce. Bodybuilders use insulin in a totally different way. Some diabetic bodybuilders manipulate their insulin use to use insulin for muscle growth and get good results but changing dosages and times of injection of insulin for diabetics can be dangerous.
Isn't taking insulin dangerous?
ummm YES! Before deciding to take insulin here is what you have to do to be safe.
1. Do not use slin alone have a training partner or girlfriend who's not using slin hang around with you from the time you take the slin to about 2.5/4 hrs after.
2. Tell you're partner to look for anything out of the norm for your personality and have a list of questions like your ssn or address etc that they can ask you. Don't joke around, and answer them without ****, because if you cant answer or refuse to answer it could be a sign of hypoglycemia(low blood sugar). Symptoms of hypoglycemia include disorientation, headache, drowsiness, weakness, dizziness, fast heartbeat, sweating, tremor, and nausea.
3. If you cant/wont answer or are feeling the symptoms of hypoglycemia they should be prepared to feed you carbs like pancake syrup, coke, sugary stuff. I bought glucose tablets at walmart. kinda like candy but gets in the blood faster and dissolve quickly. these are for diabetics ask at the pharmacy.
4. Have your partner know that if they suspect low blood sugar and cant convince or force you to consume carbs until your better. CALL 911 and ask for an ambulance and tell the truth to the operator... that they suspect you are in insulin shock and explain when they get there(the ambulance guys not the cops) that you are not diabetic but using insulin for anabolic purposes. Have the type of slin, the dosage and carbs consumed recorded to give the paramedic. They will save your life. Then you refuse transport to the hospital and eat. It might be a good idea to make sure your house is "clean" before every workout just in case the bad thing happens and the cops ask a lot of questions.
5. Why so much preparation for the possible problem?? insulin can kill you in minutes if you go down!!
6. Take the carbs and protein together immediately after injecting the slin(dont take chances trying to time out 15 min after injection). Take the protein with the carbs because the protein is pushed into the muscles with the slin also(creatine too).
7. Before an hour passes you should eat a normal balanced meal(high protein low fat with carbs).
8. Consume another small high protein medium carb low fat meal at 2.5 hours after the injection. Congrats you lived.(keep some gatoraid on hand just to make sure because your not gonna have a lifeline)
9. YAWN... Don't go to sleep within 4/6 hours of using insulin since you can develop hypoglycemia while asleep and not have warning signs.
Ok I'm not scared I still want to use insulin...
Where do i get it?
Humulin R is over the counter (OTC) just about everywhere. Humulog is new and is still a prescription drug is some places. BUT... Insulin is NOT a controlled substance and will not be confiscated by customs or postal inspectors so order it online if you cant get it locally. Its legal.
Where do I keep it? (STORAGE)
The FDA requires that all preparations of insulin contain instructions to keep in a cold place and to avoid freezing. The refrigerator is a good spot. Unrefrigerated insulin can be kept of 28 days as long as it stays in a cool and dark place.
Where/how do I inject insulin?
The best sites for insulin injection are in the subcutaneous tissue of the abdomen(avoid the area close to bellybutton) .Usually, you should not inject within 1 inch of the same site within 1 month. The arms and legs can also be used, but insulin uptake from these sites is less uniform. Insulin should be injected subcutaneously only with a U-100 insulin syringe. "B-D ultra-fine" insulin syringes are good. Insulin syringes are available without a prescription in many states. If you cant purchase the syringes at a pharmacy, you can mail order them. Using a syringe other than a specific insulin syringe is dangerous since it will be difficult to measure out the correct dosage.
How much insulin should I take?
I recommend never using over 10IU. 10IU is enough to make you grow. In general Dosages used are usually 1 IU per 20 pounds of lean bodyweight. So a 220lb bodybuilder with 9% body-fat would use 10iu of insulin(aprox200lb lean mass/20 = 10iu). But even experienced insulin users shouldn't use max dosage at the beginning of an insulin cycle. First-time users should start at a low dosage and gradually work up. For example, first begin with 2 IU and then increase the dosage by 1 IU every consecutive workout until you reach your calculated dose or determine a maximum personal dose(some people are more sensitive to insulin sides like hypoglycemia). This will allow the athlete to determine a dosage he can safely use. Insulin dosages can vary significantly among athletes and are dependent upon insulin sensitivity and the use of other drugs. Athletes using growth hormone and thyroid might have higher insulin requirements.
When do I take insulin?
It is my opinion that you should only take insulin after a work out, never before or when not working out, because before a work out you could crash and die during the workout and when your not working out it makes you fat. Some people disagree with this. IF you want, get some info from them and try it. But remember I told ya so.
When do i eat after using insulin?
Immediately!!! DO NOT TRY TO TIME YOUR CONSUMPTION OF CARBS!! You should immediately take a carbohydrate AND protein drink after taking you're insulin. I've stated this twice because it is very important. Even experienced insulin users can get a surprise now and then. Eat a meal at about an hour after using insulin. Consume another small high protein medium carb low fat meal at 2.5 hours after the injection. keep some gatoraid on hand just to make sure. Remember that insulin can still work much later so be careful and eat if you feel hypoglycemia symptoms.
What do I eat after using insulin?
Some people recommend a zero fat intake for 4 hours after taking insulin. I do not disagree with this. But if your bulking you can be a little relaxed on this. But high fat intake after taking insulin can lead to high body fat. The carb/protein drink taken after the insulin shot should contain AT LEAST 10 grams of carbs and 5 grams of quality protein per IU of insulin injected with little or no fat(creatine taken in this drink is optional but works great). Before an hour passes you should eat a normal balanced meal(high protein low fat with carbs). At 2.5 hours after the injection you should Consume a small meal. keep some gatoraid on hand just to make sure. Remember that insulin can still work much later so be careful and eat if you feel hypoglycemia symptoms. Once again i've stated this twice because it is important.
***Some insulin users recommend far less carbs than I have stated above. This is a personal decision you will have to make since it could be very dangerous...Even deadly! My opinion is to take the carbs and learn to diet after bulking if you gain too much fat.***
How long should/can I take insulin?
Short cycles please because you could have side effects. It is suspected that you could become an insulin dependant diabetic but I have never seen proof, but is it worth the risk? I would only use it a few times a week(maximum 4 on 3 off) for no more than 3/4 weeks.
What should I avoid while using insulin?
Do not use alcohol. It lowers blood sugar, and you may experience dangerously low blood sugar levels.
Do not change your workout in the middle of a cycle of insulin. Changes in how much you exercise can change the amount of insulin you can tolerate and maintain blood sugar levels.
Do not take any recreational drugs at the same time as insulin since they could mask symptoms of hypoglycemia.
Do not change the brand of insulin or syringe that you are using without first talking to a doctor or pharmacist. Some brands of insulin and syringes are interchangeable, while others are not.
Do not use insulin if you are sick with a cold, flu, or fever. These illnesses may change your insulin requirements..
Do not use any insulin that is discolored, looks thick, has particles in it, or looks different from the way it looked when you bought it.
Do not use OTC drugs that will cause drowsiness within 6 hours of using insulin.
Do not go to sleep within 4/6 hours of using insulin since you can develop hypoglycemia while asleep and not have warning signs.
What are the possible side effects of insulin besides hypoglycemia?
Rarely, people have allergic reactions to insulin. Seek emergency medical attention if you experience an allergic reaction (difficulty breathing; closing of your throat; swelling of your lips, tongue, or face; or hives).
Hypothetically, one could become an insulin dependent diabetic if insulin is used too long.
not to use slin for more than 4 weeks at a maximum of 4 days on 3days off per week then...
anabolicdiabetic and other experts contend that like steroids insulin on time should be followed by an equal insulin off time. Humilin R should be injected subcutaneously only with a U-100 insulin syringe. Insulin syringes are available without a prescription in many states. If the athlete can not purchase the syringes at a pharmacy, he can mail order them or buy them on the black market. Using a syringe other than a U-100 is dangerous since it will be difficult to measure out the correct dosage. Subcutaneous insulin injections are usually given by pinching a fold of skin in the abdomen area. To speed up the effect of the insulin, many athletes will inject their dose into the thigh or triceps.
Most athletes will bring their insulin with them to the gym. Insulin should be refrigerated, but it is all right to keep it in a gym bag as long as it is kept away from excessive heat. Immediately after a workout, the athlete will inject his dosage of insulin. Within the next fifteen minutes, he should have a carbohydrate drink such as Ultra Fuel by Twinlab. The athlete should consume at least 10 grams of carbohydrates for every 1 IU of insulin injected. Most athletes will also take creatine monohydrate with their carbohydrate drink since the insulin will help to force the creatine into the muscles. An hour or so after injecting insulin, most athletes will eat a meal or consume a protein shake. The carbohydrate drink and meal/protein shake are necessary. Without them, blood sugar levels will drop dangerously low and the athlete will most likely go into a state of hypoglycemia.
Many athletes will get sleepy after injecting insulin. This may be a symptom of hypoglycemia, and an athlete should probably consume more carbohydrates. Avoid the temptation to go to bed since the insulin may take its peak effect during sleep and significantly drop glucose levels. Being unaware of the warning signs during his slumber, the athlete is at a high risk of going into a state of severe hypoglycemia without anyone realizing it. Humulin R usually remains active for only 4 hours with a peak at about two hours after injecting. An athlete would be wise to stay up for the 4 hours after injecting.
Rather than waiting to the end of a workout, many athletes prefer to inject their insulin dosage 30 minutes before their training session is over and then consume a carbohydrate drink immediately following the workout. This will make the insulin more efficient at bringing glycogen to the muscles, but it will also increase the danger of hypoglycemia. Some athletes will even inject a few IUs before lifting to improve their pump. This practice is extremely risky and best left to athletes with experience using insulin. Finally, some athletes like to inject insulin upon waking in the morning. After the injection, they will consume a carbohydrate drink and then have breakfast within the next hour. Some athletes find this application of insulin very beneficial for putting on mass, while others will tend to put on excess fat using insulin in this way.
Insulin use can not be detected during a drug test. For this reason, along with the fact that it is cheap and readily available, insulin has become a popular drug among the competitive athlete. However, before an athlete attempts to use insulin, he should educate himself and make himself aware of the consequences.
post credit for this info goes to Anasci.org
11-02-2010, 05:52 PM
12-18-2011, 06:56 PM
Is it ok to take insulin in two dosages.
Is it ok to take insulin in two dosages? Half of the dosage in the morning and the second half after the workout..
03-30-2014, 05:37 PM
03-30-2014, 06:08 PM
The short/simple version of this would be that many bodybuilders will do anything to get an edge. I personally don't think ALL pros use slin, but of course many do and that's why.
I would say if you are still getting good gains off of steroids without slin then there is no reason to use it. Too high risk to warrant use if you don't absolutely need it to progress.
"Lifting and Game of Thrones share the same calendar, there's only two seasons: cutting and bulking. And guess what? Winter's comin' so it's time to bulk up!"
03-30-2014, 06:29 PM
Good post, one of the better ones IVe seen this far this year!
Great write up provides as well. Lots if good info in one spot
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03-30-2014, 09:30 PM
They use insulin to win. People who use it who aren't competing are sad pathetic souls. Risking death for vanity. Now there's some funny shyt
03-31-2014, 07:48 PM
Everyone that hasnt used it talks of its dangers. Everyone who has used it talks of its greatness.
Perhaps the pros deliberately scared off the general public to this hormone to have it all for themselves.
I dunno, I think of my daily intake of carbs and how I put down twice as much as the average man...and with that thought insulin doesnt scare me. Still researching though but like anything, dont get stupid and greedy about it. Education is key though.
There is a disconnect between the general lifting public and the insulin users. Seems the truth lies somewhere in between.
04-01-2014, 08:28 AM
This drug should NOT be feared. However, this drug should be used with an immense amount of respect. You truly would have to pull a stupid move in order to put yourself into a danger zone. It is definitely not meant for everyone, but for those who are bringing their physiques to levels steroids won achieve, insulin wil take you there. It is the definition of a true anabolic hormone.
I wouldn't so much worry as to killing yourself with it. I would worry about te potential to turn yourself into a diabetic one day. It is inevitable. Essentially your body will start to build an insulin tolerance and resistance leading to type 2 diabetes.
To kill yourself you would stupidly jump into taking it without being in tune with your body, tKe a very large amount, and NOT consume any carbohydrates. Many factors would have to occur in order to "kill" yourself on it.
Like I said, it shouldn't be fear...at all. I have many clients administering insulin on a daily basis to keep their pets blood sugar in check. Insulin should be respected. Majorly respected.
In the medical field we perform an "insulin curve" what this achieves is it monitors the glucose levels throughout the day to see how well or how poor the insulin is working. I will post it up for those who want to play wit insulin. It could be used to gauge the blood sugar levels so you can see how your body responds.
Tools: blood sugar monitor, insulin, a meal that would be eaten pre insulin, paper to chart the values. It's very very simple....
This curve takes roughly 8 hkurs....
Take a base blood sugar
1) Eat your large meal
Take another base blood sugar
2) take your amount of insulin the appropriate time after your meal.
3) every 2 hours draw blood for blood sugar readings
4) chart your results.
5) you hours notice a u shaped curve on a graph if the insulin works appropriately. For example it should start at let's say 120, then after your meal it should go up to maybe 250, then after insulin it should slowly decline down to no lower than 90. Then as the insulin wears off, it should climb back up to around 120ish.
If your blood sugar hits 60, your in a danger zone an you need to start eating simple sugars fast! This chart should help gauge what a specific amount of glucose is doing to your body.
My muscles are pharmaceutically enhanced.
04-01-2014, 10:11 AM
The good thing is, most of us wouldnt need insulin but for 4-6 weeks per year anyways during a blast. Heck, I'm spitting distance away from pro-size bodybuilding without insulin..
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