Gyno from M1t...

[TonyB]

Hey everyone,

I've been reading on this board for a long time and have done lots of research, but this is my first post.... I decided to do a cycle of M1t, and had some bad sides almost immediately after the third day, I noticed a rash developing on my back??? It was definetly acne, but not like I have had before, I thought it was weird and it covered my entire back. But then tonight (day 4) my nipples looked a little puffy, so I said screw this, and immediately started Nolva at 30mg/ day.. I think I will stay at this dose for the next week then drop to 20 mg/ day for a week... I know it has been debated as to whether the Nolva helps progesterone induced gyno (which is what M1t may cause), but it's worth a shot. It's not bad, and I have always had a slight amount of chest fat. But, this was a definite change in the appearance of the nipples, and scared the **** out of me.. I can't believe how quick this stuff gave me these sides.. I'm done with M1t, and I would advise anyone who is considering it to be very careful. This is serious ****...

 

[strangebrew]

hmm, I get puffy nips whenever I'm holding a lot of water...usually while bulking. It's not gyno though because it gradually goes down as I'm cutting.

Just a thought.

 

[Longdog]

While it is reare to get gyno from M1t, it can happen. Your case sounds like a gyno scare, you probably gained a few pounds of subcutaneous water in the 4 days which caused the puffiness. Gyno doesnt form overnight, if there is no lump or serious irritation, it's probably nothing. It's common for nipples to get a little puffy when bulking.

 

[Brodus]

How much M1T were you using?

Yeah, prolly just a scare, but better safe than sorry.

I'm intersted in the other side, the rash, because I also got a strange rash on M1T, but attributed it to a transdermal I was using at the same time. Or did it turn out to be just weird acne?

On a sidenote, I also must posit a theory to the lower back pain/cramps people experience-->do you think this could be your LIVER actually swelling/hurting?

 

[RVEXLER]

I had a friend that got a head to toe rash from 1-t. Swollen face too (inflammation??). Maybe the reaction of your body to the 1t could also include the swelling in the nips? If that's the case, then it should go down as the rash does. My friend had to use prednisone for the rash, but otc benadryl might also be effective.

 

[TonyB]

I was taking 10mg per day...

The rash that I have is definetly some form of acne that I have never experienced before. It's hard to describe, but it is basically clusters of small acne blemishes deep in the pores (I'm talking dozens of them)... It starts at my shoulders and goes down to the middle of my back. Not painful but not very attractive. At least it's not all over my face, though.

I'm going to continue taking the Nolva, and I'll let everyone know how that works but my nipples are still puffy as hell...

 

[Cogar]

Look here.

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12910

 

[Longdog]

On a sidenote, I also must posit a theory to the lower back pain/cramps people experience-->do you think this could be your LIVER actually swelling/hurting?

That's ludicrous. I highly doubt you could feel an internal organ swell. I am prone to the M1t back pain, it is a severe tightening of the muscles in the low back, nothing more. It makes it difficult to squat, dead, even stand sometimes. I'm not sure exactly what about M1t causes it, but I know isnt liver swelling .

 

[AcuDoc]

After having just settled down from an embarassing freak-out (see my posts under anti-progestin) myself, I can relate to what you are going through.

Sledge @ Designer Supplements gave me some great advice through e-mails and posts which is starting to do the trick. Nolva or M5AA will both block any estrogen to progestin problems. BTW Sledge even overnighted some M5AA to me!!

Since M1T doesn't aromatize then if its not water swelling it's a progestin problem.

I freaked out because I read progestin is much harder to control i.e. Fina (I think thats the steroid) and so images of large breasts attached to my chest went swimming through my head.

This whole experience has given me 2 things - 1. my undying gratitude to Sledge for his help. 2. I am a born again natural BB-the most refined thing going into my body will be liver tabs

 

[Brodus]

I highly doubt you could feel an internal organ swell.

Well, I disagree, b/c you can feel pressure from within pressing against the musculature that holds your organs tightly packed (Have you ever been bloated?), and also your organs do have pain sensitivity (Ever been punched in the kidney or had a stomach ache?).

I do agree that the swelling thing is highly unlikely, though. I've had the back cramps, and they are muscular in nature. But I also had bloating and pressure around the waist, and a rash.

I brought up this theory b/c the bloating and toxicity sides are similar to conditions borught on by alcohol consumption, and the first "stage" side effects include a swollen/enlarged liver. It seems more than conicidental, at least to me, then, that the "cramps" side-effect would target this area so frequently.

The fact is, there could be a lot of weird stuff going on, and we wouldn't know, b/c no one has studied M1T in an academic setting.

 

[TonyB]

AcuDoc,

How are you doing now? Has the Nolva helped at all?

I hope it did, because that's what I am using.

 

[AcuDoc]

AcuDoc,

How are you doing now? Has the Nolva helped at all?

I hope it did, because that's what I am using.

The soreness now only comes and goes. Usually in early AM and early PM. I guess that's when the estrogen peaks. The intensity of the soreness is a little better, but like I said, still there at times.

I have added some 6-oxo, 600-800mg/day, M5AA, 30mg/day and vitex, 2000mg/day.

Here is a QUOTE from Bobo about the progestin/estrogen gyno debate:
"As Nandi put it:

"So for those people worried about the (IMO non-existent) prolactin induced gyno, tamoxifen looks like it would be an effective treatment. Another reason to forget the foolish use of bromocriptine to treat gyno and just stick with the tried and true Nolvadex."

Hope this helps to calm.

 

[azgymrat]

How much M1T were you using?

Yeah, prolly just a scare, but better safe than sorry.

I'm intersted in the other side, the rash, because I also got a strange rash on M1T, but attributed it to a transdermal I was using at the same time. Or did it turn out to be just weird acne?

On a sidenote, I also must posit a theory to the lower back pain/cramps people experience-->do you think this could be your LIVER actually swelling/hurting?

Could be wrong but your liver is in the front near the rib cage your kidneys are in back. I have seen people report things like pissing brown or really dark, that would be kidneys, I also wound up with a kidney infection while on M1t but may very well be just bad luck and timing.

 

[julius kelp]

i have had discomfort in the lower right region of my back with each use of methyls. it felt pretty interior to be a muscle cramp. i just drank tons of water & did the usual supps like minerals, taurine, milk thistle etc. this last time mega doses of cranberry extract "seemed" to help. it clears after awhile. i would love to know what the problem was. i have more testing to do!

 

[Reem]

Just wanted to say that I also got sore, itchy nipples while on my second week of M1T. I started with Nolva and it went away. I read that the bitch tit symptoms you can get while on M1T are probably progesterone related, but seems like Nolva blocks the progesterone working too.

 

[raylewis]

Just wanted to say that I also got sore, itchy nipples while on my second week of M1T. I started with Nolva and it went away. I read that the bitch tit symptoms you can get while on M1T are probably progesterone related, but seems like Nolva blocks the progesterone working too.

Did you continue your M1T cycle while using the Nolva to finish your cycle, take a break and then resumed it after the symtoms went away or simply stop using M1T after begining Nolva prematurely?