Sustanon Taper to Trenbolone Question

[Majazulu]

Age: 43
Gender: Male
Height: 5'8"
Weight: 185
Experience: 25+ years lifting; all natural up to about 2 years ago
Education: BS Biology; NASM Certified Personal Trainer
Cycle Experience: Currently 3rd cycle (In last 2 year period, proper PCT, etc.)
Goal: Lean muscle mass & strength

First post here, and have tried to show respect by doing my "homework" before opening my mouth. Thanks for your patience.

Okay, so I have had some sucess with Sustanon 250 in previous 2 cycles. My first "cycle" was using something called Tren Extreme orals, which were over the counter at the time, but now banned, and I had no idea that they were more than a supplement, so who knows if that even counts. I stacked with D-Bol last time, but bailed because the sides with D-Bol (skin!) were brutal for me.

I am currently in week 6 of a Sustanon 250 cycle, and want to add Tren 150 to the mix before completely tapering off by week 14. I front-loaded the Sustanon following the plan laid out by SquatDemon (online Google search). This basically was to hit the Sust ED at 0.5CC/125MG to 1.0CC/250MG (multi-injection sites) for the first 3 weeks, and then let the esters do their thing and time release to a taper, which I figure will be completely finished in the next 2 weeks.

I had severe back pump issues during this loading phase, hence the "backing off" to 0.5CC for a few consecutive days until clear. I am experiencing acne now, but nothing that I can't deal with (I think) until I come off.

FINALLY THE QUESTION: If I inject 0.5CC/75MG of Tren every 3rd day while also taking 20mg of Nolvadex daily, WILL THIS BE A GOOD TEST TAPER TO TRENBOLONE FINISH, OR A BAD IDEA? Remember, I am 43, and am not ever going to compete or anywhere near it - just want some lean muscle which is hard to come by at my age. I have plenty of Clomid and Nolva on hand for a PCT, am working on Letrozole in case the Nolva can't handle potential gyno, and am prepared to ditch the Tren at the first sign of trouble.

Again, thank you for your help.


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[unc21]

Bad idea.

With tren, you always want to be running test along side of it. IMO, nothing should ever be ran without test. It should be the base of every and any cycle.

Now with that, I dont believe in tapering either. Dont see the point.

Also, tren should be injected ED and definitely not E3D, in order to keep blood levels consistent.

There's so much in here that makes me think you didnt do your homework, sorry to be a d1ck, but its true from your post. A lot of help needed here. Case in point.............you said you were running the sust between 125-250mg/day for 3 weeks. Thats between 875mg-175mgs per week!!!! 875mg/wk is already high enough for someone with very little cycle experience, and 1750mg is just downright crazy, although your dosage fell somewhere between this..........which for your experience is definitely not necessary.

So my advice, dont even think about tren until you are able to run a dialed in cycle, and you understand what, how much and why you are running it. And dont just take some cycle you find and google and decide to run it.

 

[Majazulu]

unc21

No, you are not being a ****. You are right. I am not going to do the Tren until I have put the time in with a proper PCT, done more research, and can properly run the cycle.

I guess I knew what you have said, but fell into the trap of not wanting to admit the mistake and salvage the cycle. Bottom line: I jumped in and have since learned (a little the hard way) that I was ill prepared.

Since you have been helpful, I'll ask one last question. Along with the proper Test/Tren combo, what AI or SERM would you suggest as being the "best" for that mix? I am reading that Nolva is no real guarantee (best for PCT), and that Letrozole might be the most potent to protect against gyno.

I made a bad newbie mistake, won't happen again, and I THANK YOU for being blunt.

Any other resources, links, or advice that come to mind would be welcome. Sometimes it seems like a sea of contradiction.

All the best.

 

[EasyEJL]

My first "cycle" was using something called Tren Extreme orals, which were over the counter at the time, but now banned, and I had no idea that they were more than a supplement, so who knows if that even counts.

Ok seriously, because you didn't know it was a steroid it somehow wasn't a steroid? Gimme a break. And I guess that means no PCT afterwards?

As far as letro + nolva goes, that would only help with gyno from the test, not the tren.

Bad idea.

With tren, you always want to be running test along side of it. IMO, nothing should ever be ran without test. It should be the base of every and any cycle.

Now with that, I dont believe in tapering either. Dont see the point.

Also, tren should be injected ED and definitely not E3D, in order to keep blood levels consistent.

There's so much in here that makes me think you didnt do your homework, sorry to be a d1ck, but its true from your post. A lot of help needed here. Case in point.............you said you were running the sust between 125-250mg/day for 3 weeks. Thats between 875mg-175mgs per week!!!! 875mg/wk is already high enough for someone with very little cycle experience, and 1750mg is just downright crazy, although your dosage fell somewhere between this..........which for your experience is definitely not necessary.

I'll give that its better to run test with tren, but its not necessary for short spans. And given that its Tren 150 I'm pretty sure its not acetate, but enanthate instead so every 3 day is fine.

That sust dose also is reasonable for a short cycle. Sometime look at the Building The Better Beast: Chemical Enhancement by Author L Rea. The whole point is high dose short time to hit receptors hard, and have easy recovery because you were only suppressed for 2 weeks. But this was just a strong frontload.

Still I would have only done it that way with straight long estered test, with sustanon i'd well crap honestly i'd just never waste my time with sust. Either do a long ester or do a short ester, the blend adds nothing magical to it, it all becomes just plain old testosterone once the ester is stripped.

 

[Majazulu]

easyejl,

No, no, the Tren Xtreme quote just meant that it did not count toward any kind of experience, since I never approached it as a steroid. Yes, it definitely had the biological/metabolic effect on me, but never even knew what a PCT was at the time, since I wasn't taking anything other than a recommended supplement that was supposed to "boost natural testosterone production". Stupid when I look back, I know.

The Sustanon was something a friend of a friend had on hand, and of course recommended, so I went with it. Spaced it out, made some gains, PCT with Nolva and Clomid. The gains or feeling were nowhere what I had experienced with the Tren Xtreme, so I guess I set myself up for making two mistakes:

Not enough time or research between cycles.
Listening to only one source online because it told me what I wanted to hear.

I have to add that it is difficult to determine between two different sets of advice, especially when many seem very confident that there information is correct. Your advice is telling me something that contradicts what UNC21 told me just before. No problem, I THANK YOU BOTH FOR HELPING ME OUT, but it can definitely get very confusing, very quickly.

So, with that said, I see that you feel that Nolva and Letro help only with Test during a cycle, not Trenbolone. What is your opinion on what to run during a Test (ideally a short ester, no more Sustanon)/Tren (E, you are right) cycle?

HCG/Clomid/Nolvadex as PCT seems to get a majority vote.

Sincere thanks

 

[EasyEJL]

HCG as an on cycle adjunct after week 3 or 4 for a long cycle is nice(250iu 2x a week), I wouldn't use it in PCT.

Really a tren e / test e combo is easy as you would just do it 2x a week together. Probably exemestane as an ai if you have some estrogen problems, otherwise I wouldn't use anything on cycle. If gyno were to start on a test/tren cycle, the best bet would be a combination of letro/nolva + cabergoline (if tablets) or pramipexole

 

[Majazulu]

Thanks again. I appreciate the advice. Have a good one.

 

[mewannagetbig]

help

Maj- I like you read squatdemons article and i am on my 3rd day of 250mg Sustanon a day. I have nolva/clomid on hand.

i also have 10ml bottles of Test E around too.

what should I do for this cycle???? help!!