Dione better than Diol?!?!

[u4ik_rage]

It goes against everything I've read in the last 2-3 years involving PHs, but maybe it's possible. Bill L. sites a study comparing 4-Dione and 4-Diol and Pat Arnold attempts to refute it. Gets pretty ugly...

http://www.mindandmuscle.net/avantfo...=ST&f=1&t=2019

[YellowJacket]

Imagine that

[u4ik_rage]

Oh yeah, for those who don't know, "PA System" is Pat Arnold.

[pogue]

I don't trust either of these guys, they're both in it for the money. They're both smart, but they act like children.

[DarCSA]

I take it with a grain of salt but I would want to see more research on it than besides these two guys.

[drfly]

actually most people will defend the dione version of 1,4 as opposed to the diol, correct me if im wrong, but i think it has a higher bioavailability than its diol counterpart. for a definitive answer talk to BDC, curt, or yj, they should be able to help u out.

[pogue]

I think the 1,4diol vs 1,4dione is up in the air. Their discussion has to do with 4diol vs andro though.

[wojo]

well if p.a is still saying that the diones r not more bioavail..why doesnt someone ask why he releasde 1-adione first

[u4ik_rage]

Originally posted by wojo
well if p.a is still saying that the diones r not more bioavail..why doesnt someone ask why he releasde 1-adione first

Actually, PA is siding with the Diol of course since 4-Diol was his patented product. I think that he's since lost the patent.

In the study it shows the 4-Androdione produced more test than the 4-Diol. Of course, you also have much more estrogen conversion from the Dione.

It's just one study and doesn't prove anything to me, but it's very interesting, none the less, because it goes against what most people on these boards have accepted as a given.

[u4ik_rage]

Originally posted by u4ik_rage


It's just one study and doesn't prove anything to me, but it's very interesting, none the less, because it goes against what most people on these boards have accepted as a given.

How's that for a run-on sentence?

[pjorstad]

who gives a **** which one converts better. Have you ever thought that the diol's have inherent activity???? That makes them NOT prohormones but steroids. 4-AD is not a prohormone. 4 -dione im sure wouldn'thave inherenent activity(as far as i know).

[u4ik_rage]

Originally posted by pjorstad
who gives a **** which one converts better. Have you ever thought that the diol's have inherent activity???? That makes them NOT prohormones but steroids. 4-AD is not a prohormone. 4 -dione im sure wouldn'thave inherenent activity(as far as i know).

I was just summarizing. If you don't care, you could always hit the back button on your browser.

[YellowJacket]

Originally posted by u4ik_rage


I was just summarizing. If you don't care, you could always hit the back button on your browser.

Very true.

[drfly]

Originally posted by pjorstad
<B>who gives a **** which one converts better. Have you ever thought that the diol's have inherent activity???? That makes them NOT prohormones but steroids. 4-AD is not a prohormone. 4 -dione im sure wouldn'thave inherenent activity(as far as i know). </B>

actually, 4-ad is not a steroid, it is in fact, a prohormone. just because it has anabolic properties, does not make it a steroidal hormone. its a precursor to one, therefore, its a prohormone.

[YellowJacket]

Originally posted by pjorstad



Actually why don't you keep your input out until you know what your talking about. Testosterone has "anabolic" propertires but guess what! Its a prohormone because it converts to dht and estrogen!

Like i said 4-AD is an anabolic steroid.

Please delete this before people read it.....

[u4ik_rage]

heh

[sage]

you need to think about what you say pjorstad. its without a doubt ok to lay out your views and opinons, but comments like that aint necessary and you should know that. Sage

[YellowJacket]

Originally posted by sage
you need to think about what you say pjorstad. its without a doubt ok to lay out your views and opinons, but comments like that aint necessary and you should know that. Sage

Dont worry about it, this comes from the same guy who wants to know if you can smoke fina.....

[drfly]

oh my god pjorstad, i cannot believe what u just said, that has to be one of the single most ignorant things i have ever heard someone say on this forum. im not gonna screw up this thread because it actually has a valid point, so after this, our little argument is over, but there r a few things i have to clear up for u, and i'm gonna do it in terms u can understand. first off, do u even know what a steroid is? its a hormone, so there for testosterone is a steroid. second, 4-ad is not a hormone, so therefore it is not a steroid, and last, lets say u were correct, then how do u explain 4-diol being a steroid, but 4-dione not? christ, i thought this was gonna be a forum without bull****, for more educated people. its one thing to be a newbie and ask questions, but to blatently state false info, then lash out at people who try to correct u, thats just stupid.

[ManBeast]

Well said.

ManBeast