So... Realistically, what can I expect? :)

austin82388

New member
Awards
0
Stats-
21 y.o
4 yrs lifting
5 foot 9 ish
175 lbs
maybe 10% bf, havent ever really tried to cut, but i plan on focusing on it a bit more this cycle

prev cycles-
2x solo mdrol (didnt seem to respond to either, compared to epi anyway)
1x solo epistane
1x epistane/hdrol (favorite so far)

i plan on doing epistane/tren
RSS makes a product called Alpha E
36mg epi per dose
120mg tren per dose
^^ for 4 wks and MAYBE some Hdrol after for 2 weeks if i feel like extending cycle.

i train basically every day.. except sundays.. different body parts ofc.
im lookin to bump up to 185 lbs, and decrase bodyfat by 1-3%

what do you think my cals/protein/etc should be throughout the day to achieve my goals?

also getting my damn bench to finally pass 300 would be great, 5 pounds off right now >.< (max)
 

gymbo123

New member
Awards
0
21 years old and already on your 5th cycle?! Not bashing you or anything but you should really have your diet down by now..
 
UnrealMachine

UnrealMachine

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • RockStar
so hard to say... what do you mean you didn't respond to Mdrol? Superdrol is intense, how much did you gain? How did you do all those cycles if you're 175?

Anyway it's simple... don't try to bulk up 10 pounds in a 4 week cycle while cutting up to 3% bf, that's never going to happen, 10lbs is beyond the amount of LBM that you can realistically gain, and that's with every variable 100% maximized, obviously this entails calories in sufficient excess to actually get fatter, so no way you'll gain 10 pounds while dropping 1-3% bodyfat, not in 4 weeks.

I think this is simple... Focus on one thing, bulking. You want your bench to go up, bulk up.

Also you are better off extending this cycle by stretching your cycle out another week or two... 36mg Epi + 120mg of Tren is totally excessive if you're 175 pounds, you can do 2/3 that dose and make good gains and instead run the cycle longer, and bump up the dose towards the end.

Running Halodrol for 2 weeks at the end of the cycle is a very bad idea, don't do it, it takes way too long to kick in for you to employ it in that fashion.
 
n8te

n8te

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
^^thats good advice.

Also, you should really already have an idea of what you're diet would need to be. That's what is gonna make most of the difference. I think you should def. bulk though, like already said thats A Lot to expect from a 4 weeker.
 

Libertarian

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
Sounds like you've become dependent on gear to make gains. I'm the same height, but I was bigger than you are now after 4 cycles before I ran my first cycle and even then I admit I started much earlier than I needed to. Not bragging, it's not that I think it is the least bit impressive, I'm just trying to put things into perspective. I'm not one of those guys that will say that you should reach your genetic potential before touching steroids, but it honestly sounds like you need to get either your diet or training in check ASAP.

To reach the weight you want while reducing your body fat 1-3% means packing on about 11-15 pounds of lean mass in 4 weeks running only orals. Very unlikely.
 

Liftingstud

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
It's called eating... That stuff called food is very anabolic!!!

Second u have no idea what ur doing!

Epi tren then maybe 2 wks of hdrol?!?!? If takes hdrol 2 wks really to even kick in!

It is obvious u have much much more to learn.

Do yourself a favor... Get on a good solid bulking diet of 6-7 meals a day and learn to make natural gains. Cause after 4 cycle u should be much bigger. AAS help but you still have to feed your body to grow.
 
UnrealMachine

UnrealMachine

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • RockStar
It's called eating... That stuff called food is very anabolic!!!

Second u have no idea what ur doing!

Epi tren then maybe 2 wks of hdrol?!?!? If takes hdrol 2 wks really to even kick in!

It is obvious u have much much more to learn.

Do yourself a favor... Get on a good solid bulking diet of 6-7 meals a day and learn to make natural gains. Cause after 4 cycle u should be much bigger. AAS help but you still have to feed your body to grow.
i feel like i could write that in half the threads here
 

Liftingstud

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
i feel like i could write that in half the threads here
Seriously!!! It's like everyone want to ne ripped to shreds but put on 15lbs... Don't happen that way. Can't be afriad of food and gaining some fat. Once you get other that it game on.
 
UnrealMachine

UnrealMachine

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • RockStar
I know... everybody is trying to do both at once and there's a massive efficiency hit when you do that... Doing both at once is called recomping and people don't understand that it takes a perfect diet and a ton of cardio to do properly.

I think the reason I made progress so quickly is because I recognized the efficiency hit, and focused myself on plain bulking, for a while I was gaining 2 pounds a week consistently and naturally. Sure BF increased slowly but I kept making natural gains... Most of my muscle was all attained naturally during a long bulk where my bodyfat got up to 18%. Then I cut the fat off and ended up around 217 / 12%. That was 2 years ago... The whole process took just a little over a year.

I tell people, bulk way past your goal, then cut the fat off. 2 step process. It's the fastest way to get where you want to be. You keep doing cycles where you're trying to bulk up 10-15 pounds while cutting bodyfat and it's not going to happen... As soon as you see fat gains you'll do something stupid like decrease calories. In short it'll take forever to make progress if you only try to bulk while losing fat, that's just not how bulking works.
 

Libertarian

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
I know... everybody is trying to do both at once and there's a massive efficiency hit when you do that... Doing both at once is called recomping and people don't understand that it takes a perfect diet and a ton of cardio to do properly.

I think the reason I made progress so quickly is because I recognized the efficiency hit, and focused myself on plain bulking, for a while I was gaining 2 pounds a week consistently and naturally. Sure BF increased slowly but I kept making natural gains... Most of my muscle was all attained naturally during a long bulk where my bodyfat got up to 18%. Then I cut the fat off and ended up around 217 / 12%. That was 2 years ago... The whole process took just a little over a year.

I tell people, bulk way past your goal, then cut the fat off. 2 step process. It's the fastest way to get where you want to be. You keep doing cycles where you're trying to bulk up 10-15 pounds while cutting bodyfat and it's not going to happen... As soon as you see fat gains you'll do something stupid like decrease calories. In short it'll take forever to make progress if you only try to bulk while losing fat, that's just not how bulking works.
True words, I agree. A lot of people I talk to give me blank stares when I try to explain the concept of bulking and cutting phases and why it's important to focus on one at a time.

That said, I think it is MUCH easier for beginners to achieve the "recomp" effect. I don't know why exactly, I have my own speculations, but I have seen many people who are just starting off quickly drop pounds of fat while simultaneously packing on muscle while being (in my opinion) pretty half-ass about their diet and training. Even my GF was making much faster and better progress than me when she first began taking her diet and training seriously (of course I was well past my "beginner" period). As a man, it can be a little demoralizing to be making slower progress than a woman, haha. But it's just a fact that as time goes on, progress becomes slower and harder.

Of course, if you're using steroids, you should already be at a point where it becomes extremely difficult if not impossible to achieve a successful "recomp" naturally.
 

neverstop

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
I would say take 6 months and dial in your diet and try some of the awesome natural supplements out there, just set yourself a goal of "I won't do another cycle till I get to 185"

that is EASILY done naturally bro, i'm surr you could put on 6-7lbs or muscle in 6 months natty and maybe add 1-2% bf, that is only ~1 lb a month basically. I'm sure you won't say that is not possible.

during that time you could try some different diets and training and see how they feel/work.

100% agreed on the bulk then cut thing too, I just finished a "recomp" cycle and I won't try to do this again, from now on it's either bulk or cut, otherwise too many trade offs. Only reason I tried the "recomp" was for vacation anyway and my gains would have been better had I just picked bulk or cut.
 

austin82388

New member
Awards
0
I would say take 6 months and dial in your diet and try some of the awesome natural supplements out there, just set yourself a goal of "I won't do another cycle till I get to 185"

that is EASILY done naturally bro, i'm surr you could put on 6-7lbs or muscle in 6 months natty and maybe add 1-2% bf, that is only ~1 lb a month basically. I'm sure you won't say that is not possible.

during that time you could try some different diets and training and see how they feel/work.

100% agreed on the bulk then cut thing too, I just finished a "recomp" cycle and I won't try to do this again, from now on it's either bulk or cut, otherwise too many trade offs. Only reason I tried the "recomp" was for vacation anyway and my gains would have been better had I just picked bulk or cut.
ive actually though about what unrealmachine has been saying, and ive realized that my diet has NEVER been good or at least what it "should" be while i was on cycle. I SHOULD be 185+ right now at LEAST since i've done the cycles described in my original post. My first two mdrol cycles i did when i lived in an apartment with my room mates, all we did is eat ****ty food and i'd be lucky if i even remembered to take my protein shakes, etc. Drinking on cycle however stupid it may seem was also def a problem since I had just turned 21. I've matured since then and gotten past all that crap, but anyways I was definately NOT running how i should have been, though i did at least have PCT set up and all that stuff. My last cycle i did add about 6 pounds when all was said and done, (epi/hdrol), and my strength DID go up on all exercises. BUT i think i could have done much better if i was eating 3.2k+cals/day and just clean bulking like unreal talked about. I decided im going to give mdrol another try, and actually eat properly this time around and not be afraid to put on some temporary fat. My work ethic in the gym is most definately NOT the issue lol, I bust my ass in there no problem. It's 100% definately the diet. I'll post a log when my stuff comes in and I hope you guys follow it and leave me some feedback along the way, i think i'll listen to the more experienced people this time around :)
(diet wise anyway lol
 

neverstop

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
nice man, honest self evaluation is key to progress.

I know what you mean, I did a few cycles that ended up with basically 0 gains after PCT when I was younger too before I knew better. The stuff I did then makes me shudder now just imagining how Fcuked up my body must have been getting :(

Without a dialed in diet, doesn't matter how much steroids you take you won't make real gains. I'd make sure to spend at least a few months dialing it in while you train natural though. Otherwise it's impossible to know what is helping you: food or roids?

be sure to read up and preload all your support supps. i eat so much it's absurd when I'm bulking, like 4k+ a day easy. given your weight/height, if you are on mdrol I would say if you are avoiding candy and junk foods, it should be very difficult for you to put on much fat unless you have a bottom less stomach. adding 2 cytogainer shakes, one upon waking, one after working out and then a cassein shake at night does wonders for getting the calories and protein up too. I now take a slow release protein shake before bed every night all the time for years. made a noticeable difference.
 
jbryand101b

jbryand101b

Banned
Awards
3
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
bla bla bla, too early, too many cycles (your mdrol was prolly a bunk batch)
you dont know what your doing, you know nothing about diet, micro/macro nutrient intake.
bla bla bla.
just kidding, what they said was all right and true.


anyways, to answer you question about how many kcals you need to take in, protein, ect. i'll give you the free version (numbers estimated, not calculated with a calculator, that takes time, time cost $$$$)

going by your weight and hight, in general you should be taking in around 3000 kcals each day to maintain your weight.
to increase your weight (naturally) by about a lb per week, increase kcals to 2,000kcals above normal. this will be roughly about 5,000kcals each day.

and alot. a whole lot, and why I am only 180 @ 5'9. I choose not to eat that much, it really makes me sick to think about it.
sorry, adhd. back on track.

so aside from genetic pre disposition, ect. the type of kcals you intake will have alot to do with the type of weight you put on.

this is where micro/maco nutrient intake will come into play.

so for protein intake for athletes there is not set number. experts on this subject honestly dont know.

but it can be generalized to around 1.5-3 grams per lb of body weight.
so just generalize it into 2g per lb and it will = 350 grams each day.

so if your going to use anabolics, and want to put on less fat, make sure you get most of your calories from protien and complex carbs.

so you can research on how many cals are in a gram of protein/carb/fat.

and this is a simple version you can use to put on mass. it gets more complicated if you want to cut while gaining.

whew, thats alot.
okay, so you need to use 5,000kcals each day.
350grams of protien.
i cant remember amount of carbs off the top of my head, and am not going to go look in my notes. but you can google it.
so hope this helps.
if you follow this, you will gain weight. and so you know, it aint all gonna be muscle. sorry. thats reality.
 
sethroberts

sethroberts

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
What these guys said is all good advice - especially unreal and libertarian. AAS are not magic, but if after four cycles you have not realized any gains then like everyone said, your diet is probably dialed in -- as you have admitted to yourself. If that is the case, then your cycles were probably not well thought out either and while some young guys have a great mind body connection, most that I see have no idea how to train either. When I look back I realize that my workouts are much more efficeint and effective now than they were 15 years ago because like one of the guys said, at one point I stopped grinding through the workouts and starting making honest self evaluations. If something isn't working then you hav to be analytical about it and change it up -- don't be afraid to ask people who know and be humble enough to take their advice.
 

Similar threads


Top