super dee duper

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    super dee duper


    hey all ive got a few questions that can hopefully be answered!! first of all i am on mass tabs and lovin em! found out they were superdrol tho..ouch
    here are my questions....its not that I havent already researched this, but I just trust the answers I get here the most.

    1. If mass tabs are superdrol then why are people reporting lower sides than m-drol or super? mass tabs are now discontinued so i stocked up.

    2.I want to buy beastdrol before it goes..but i am confused. Some say I should buy beast because it is more pure superdrol than m-drol and that m-drol is weaker. M-drol is cheaper so some say beast is a waste of money...???
    does m-drol work as well as beast???...and also has m-drol recently been dicontinued. If m-drol isnt discontinued and i will still be able to get it then ill get the beast because its gonna be gone soon.

    3. has anyone used katanadrol or dieselbolan? I know diesel has p-plex and one other roid in it. I read that phera-plex tends to give wet gains resulting in a poofy bloated look(which I actually kind of want).

    4. Ive also read that trenlike products such as katanadrol,19 tren, diesel can cause a different kind of gyno(progestin,prolactin?) that nolva cant stop...what should one use as PCT for these??

    I need to make these decisions asap so any light that can be shed on these four questons would be greatly appreciated......THANKS!!

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    1. It may well be superdrol but that makes no sense why it would have less sides than any other SD clone unless its a purer powder they use, or may be mebolazine(dymethazine) which is in I-forces Dymethazine apparently, which has similar gains as SD but less sides.

    2.Apparently m-drol is hit and miss. This could be down to people responding to the compound differently or different batches being purer than others. I-force's Methadrol is regarded as the best SD clone out there in many peoples eyes.

    3.Pheraflex aromatizes into estrogen, estrogen causes water retention which gives the "bloated" look.

    4.Serms eg Nolva and Clomid are sufficient but a Dopamine Agonist would be handy just incase you got prolactin issues.
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    i appreciate the quick answer...if m-drol is hit or miss do you think I should stick with beastdrol because it is tested to be 99.99% pure.

    as far as serms you think nolva will work ok for phera...and if not i should have a dopamine agonist. Im not quite sure what a dopamine agonist is....arimidex, letro? somethin like that? thanks!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by brockles View Post
    1. It may well be superdrol but that makes no sense why it would have less sides than any other SD clone unless its a purer powder they use, or may be mebolazine(dymethazine) which is in I-forces Dymethazine apparently, which has similar gains as SD but less sides.

    2.Apparently m-drol is hit and miss. This could be down to people responding to the compound differently or different batches being purer than others. I-force's Methadrol is regarded as the best SD clone out there in many peoples eyes.

    3.Pheraflex aromatizes into estrogen, estrogen causes water retention which gives the "bloated" look.

    4.Serms eg Nolva and Clomid are sufficient but a Dopamine Agonist would be handy just incase you got prolactin issues.
    phera doesnt aromatize
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    I have no knowledge of beastdrol and have heard no reviews on it but if you know people who have run it or if you have read reviews on it and they're all/most positive on it then it seems its pretty legit.

    Yea nolva would be fine for a cycle of phera, the general protocol for PCT is run 20/20/10/10. Thats 20mg everyday for two weeks and then 10mg everyday for the last two weeks. A dopamine agonist supresses prolactin production in the pituitary gland, well thats the part that you would take it for but the chances of raised prolactin levels to where you needed to take one are quite unlikely, but its always very handy to have it on hand just incase the problem arises. Cabergoline is a pharma dopamine agonist but theres a few OTC/herbal ones out there, powerfull by usplabs? is one i think.

    Ok it may not aromatise but it is a compound that makes you reatin water, for what reason i dont know, care to explain?
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    it inhibits 11b-hydroxylase, this is the same pathway that causes water retention from superdrol and anadrol
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    Superdrol shouldnt cause retention of water if its pure. Also isnt SD a DHT derivative so surely it doesnt convert via the enzyme 11b-hydroxylase as this is a process that happens to progesterones?
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    it truly does...it is just an intra-cellular reaction and doesnt present itself as subcutaneous edema. You can put on 10lbs in 10 days with superdrol...its mostly water and glycogen. It's still bloat, just not the kind we usually consider to be "bloat".
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    Quote Originally Posted by brockles View Post
    Superdrol shouldnt cause retention of water if its pure. Also isnt SD a DHT derivative so surely it doesnt convert via the enzyme 11b-hydroxylase as this is a process that happens to progesterones?
    in response to your edit:
    yes, superdrol is a dht derivative and has an rba of 0 at the progesterone receptor. Conversely, inhibition of 11b-hdroxylase is not something only found in progestational compounds. For instance...m1-t is another steroid with no pr affinity and still inhibits 11b-hydroxylase.
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    so i shouldnt worry about a dopamine agonist for phera...just stick with the nolva..

    I also have noticed that a lot of supplement sites have discontinued methadrol and m-drol(they still have some in stock but no longer producing it) does this mean that due to the latest crackdown on PH/DS they will no longer be available. will we be able to get these SD clones in the future or is it stock up now or forever hold your peace??!!
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    Both CEL and I-force have ceased production and alot of webbased retailers have stopped selling them. They will be in circulation in classifieds for the next few years but if these PH/DS do get banned then possession will be the same as the already illegal AAS and then comes the question which theres better compounds out there to be run, but buying a few SD clones is worth it for the future imo.

    The only compound i can think of off the top of my head that may produce unwanted prolactin sides is tren( 19nor/estra 4) compounds.
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    Quote Originally Posted by getswole3332 View Post
    so i shouldnt worry about a dopamine agonist for phera...just stick with the nolva..

    I also have noticed that a lot of supplement sites have discontinued methadrol and m-drol(they still have some in stock but no longer producing it) does this mean that due to the latest crackdown on PH/DS they will no longer be available. will we be able to get these SD clones in the future or is it stock up now or forever hold your peace??!!
    on the contarary....i would definately have a prolactin/dopamine antagonist on hand...its only smart. But if you ran a low dose of nolva, say 5-10mgs a day during your cycle it should alleviate any prolactin/estrogen problems.
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    so nobody know if beastdrol is worth the extra $$...it seems to be but i just wish i knew for sure.....does anyone know how these two would compare:

    superdrol......or superdrol/tren stack...

    will the tren just add more vascularity and cuts....or will it take away from the size gains of the super because it is a cutter?
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    tren ran from 60-90mgs and super from 10-20mgs would be a super dee duper stack
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    ok so if you are saying phera doesnt aromatize then why would i need a dopamine/prolactin antagonist. My friend told me that nolva or liquidex would be fine for phera or super...and that prolactin issues only occur when using tren or tren-like products...so are you saying that phera is a tren-like product??
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    Quote Originally Posted by getswole3332 View Post
    ok so if you are saying phera doesnt aromatize then why would i need a dopamine/prolactin antagonist. My friend told me that nolva or liquidex would be fine for phera or super...and that prolactin issues only occur when using tren or tren-like products...so are you saying that phera is a tren-like product??
    phera does not aromatize. it, like tren, acts on the progesterone receptor. And like tren, in a high estrogen enviroment, can cause prolactin problems. So like i said earlier, using 5-10mgs a day of nolva while on cycle can stave off any prolactin or estrogen problems. Your friend is correct but not for the reasons he thinks he is. If you were to have a rise in prolactin the only thing that would really help would be the caber or the prami...ie...dopamine/prolactin antagonists. This is why i recomended having one on hand, to be safe.
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    so if i were to stack super and phera what would you suggest as a good PCT combo...maybe 5mgs a day of nolva to combat the phera sides then just use more nolva for pct?

    also I still dont really understand why mass tabs dont give people side effects like other sd clones...it doesnt make sense and its drivin me crazy....isnt there anyone out there who has done superdrol and mass tabs to compare??!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by getswole3332 View Post
    so if i were to stack super and phera what would you suggest as a good PCT combo...maybe 5mgs a day of nolva to combat the phera sides then just use more nolva for pct?

    also I still dont really understand why mass tabs dont give people side effects like other sd clones...it doesnt make sense and its drivin me crazy....isnt there anyone out there who has done superdrol and mass tabs to compare??!!
    What sides do you want to combat? I cant think of anything that nolva will do for you while on cycle other than stop gyno. As for PCT you will want to run nolva at 20/20/10/10 minimum.
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    Hey Mooch what about Primordial Performance PCT stack as they try to demonize Nolva and Clomid ?
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    Quote Originally Posted by brockles View Post
    What sides do you want to combat? I cant think of anything that nolva will do for you while on cycle other than stop gyno. As for PCT you will want to run nolva at 20/20/10/10 minimum.
    the nolva during the cycle is used solely to combat gyno. A low dose can keep estro under control, hence not allowing prolactin to get out of control.


    Quote Originally Posted by samva777 View Post
    Hey Mooch what about Primordial Performance PCT stack as they try to demonize Nolva and Clomid ?
    in my humble opinion its cheaper and more effective to use serms. PP has to make nova and clomid sound like its going to kill you or people wouldnt pay triple the price for their pct stack. Ask someone like seth roberts who has more knowledge than all of us put together, but isnt reppin a product line, which he prefers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by getswole3332 View Post
    so if i were to stack super and phera what would you suggest as a good PCT combo...maybe 5mgs a day of nolva to combat the phera sides then just use more nolva for pct?

    also I still dont really understand why mass tabs dont give people side effects like other sd clones...it doesnt make sense and its drivin me crazy....isnt there anyone out there who has done superdrol and mass tabs to compare??!!
    why do you think mass tabs has no side effects?
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    why do you think mass tabs has no side effects?
    i have no idea thats why im askin.

    Im at the end of week three on mass tabs and im noticing a tiny bit of puffiness and sensitivity in my nipples...but only a tiny tiny bit and you cant see it at all....should i end my cycle early or should i keep it goin? if I keep goin should i add some nolva to the rest of the cycle.

    ive been feelin so good on these that i want to extend my cycle to 5 weeks. the craziest gains have come towards the end of the third week and i just wanna keep goin what do you guys think?
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    Add in nolva but if it doesnt clear it up after 3 or 4 days end the cycle early.
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    Quote Originally Posted by getswole3332 View Post
    i have no idea thats why im askin.

    Im at the end of week three on mass tabs and im noticing a tiny bit of puffiness and sensitivity in my nipples...but only a tiny tiny bit and you cant see it at all....should i end my cycle early or should i keep it goin? if I keep goin should i add some nolva to the rest of the cycle.

    ive been feelin so good on these that i want to extend my cycle to 5 weeks. the craziest gains have come towards the end of the third week and i just wanna keep goin what do you guys think?

    The new ones or the old ones? The new ones blow in comparison, and I'll swear by that statement.
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    its only a very tiny bit of sensitivity and the puffiness is very slight. you can only feel the puffiness a little bit and you cant see it at all. i should add nolva during the rest of the cycle? what dose?...and also what about extending the cycle for a fifth week since im feelin so good on these. Does the fact that im noticing some minor puffiness after being on for 3 1/2 weeks mean im prone to gyno?? sorry for so many question!!! you guys are very very helpful
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    I'm running a Phera-plex/Mega-TRN cycle right now. I can understand the logic behind running a low dose of Nolva while on cycle but I don't do this normally for the simple reason that it adds to the amount of stress placed on the liver. SERMs like Nolva and Clomid are liver toxic on their own albeit not as much as methylated compounds such as Phera and SD.

    I regularly check to ensure there is no "leakage" from my nips that would indicate an issue with elevated prolactin levels. I've run this same cycle in the past and used PowerFULL from USPLabs post cycle to ensure prolactin didn't become an issue. Also, I think Vitex and P-5-P would also be beneficial in risk managing this potential side effect.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ninjo View Post
    I'm running a Phera-plex/Mega-TRN cycle right now. I can understand the logic behind running a low dose of Nolva while on cycle but I don't do this normally for the simple reason that it adds to the amount of stress placed on the liver. SERMs like Nolva and Clomid are liver toxic on their own albeit not as much as methylated compounds such as Phera and SD.

    I regularly check to ensure there is no "leakage" from my nips that would indicate an issue with elevated prolactin levels. I've run this same cycle in the past and used PowerFULL from USPLabs post cycle to ensure prolactin didn't become an issue. Also, I think Vitex and P-5-P would also be beneficial in risk managing this potential side effect.
    prolactin can only become an issue in a high estrogen environment...control estrogen and you control prolactin. The added stress from such a low dose of nolva will be minimal. But with your wait and see method you are advocating not "fixin it till its broken". Imo this haphazard way of doing things will lead you to have to take higher doses of nolva and then adding in caber,(dont even get me started on its sides) when a real problem arises.
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    oh and one last thing, did you know that squeazing your nipples to check for leakage can actualy cause gyno?
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    oh and one last thing, did you know that squeazing your nipples to check for leakage can actualy cause gyno?
    Seriously?!
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    oh and one last thing, did you know that squeazing your nipples to check for leakage can actualy cause gyno?
    Are u serious I used to do this aaalot
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    dude good advice and good point ...you def know ure s***.....so ill add in 5 mgs ed of nolva and i will be extending my cycle by 10 days unless yall think i shoudnt. my friend says that i react very well to superdrol so extending my cycle 10 days wont be a problem...gains have been almost stupidly good in the last week so i wanna keep goin for a lil longer
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ninjo View Post
    Seriously?!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jasen View Post
    Are u serious I used to do this aaalot
    yes its true...their have been a couple studies done on this. If you search through seth roberts posts you should be able to find one. Im just too lazy to do it myself this sunday morning, just getting my first cuppa joe now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by getswole3332 View Post
    dude good advice and good point ...you def know ure s***.....so ill add in 5 mgs ed of nolva and i will be extending my cycle by 10 days unless yall think i shoudnt. my friend says that i react very well to superdrol so extending my cycle 10 days wont be a problem...gains have been almost stupidly good in the last week so i wanna keep goin for a lil longer
    honestly most guys regret going longer than three weeks....it seems the gains taper off quite a bit and the sides kick in hard core. But some guys like unrealmachine thrive on super. Its you cycle and its your body, only you can know whats right for you.
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    i did gain quite a bit of weight right away but my gains in my arms have been outstanding in the past week...it just sux that right when im really feelin swole i have to cycle off....ifeel fine now but i dont want any delayed effects...just dont know what i should do?
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    Quote Originally Posted by muller View Post
    The new ones or the old ones? The new ones blow in comparison, and I'll swear by that statement.
    the new ones are the same as the old ones you may be thinkin of mass caps?...a monster at my gym said that he LOVED the old mass tabs and that the new formula worked exactly the same as the old one and he has been lifting for 23 years so I trust him.
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