Can short term 1-test use cause lasting damage to the heart?

[BigVrunga]

Hello,
Ive read that prolonged steroid use can cause symptoms similar to Hypertrophic cardiomyopathy. (thickening of the heart's walls). And in supersoilder's awesome thread concerning M1T and blood tests, he had voiced some concerns about his heart. (although he was 99% sure he was fine...)
My questions are - has anyone experienced any heart-related problems from cycling 1-test related hormones? Is there a limit to how many cycles a person should do over a given time period, before any risks to the circulatory system become permanent? If someone with heart disease used a hormone like 1-test (even though it wouldnt be a good idea) - could it/would it worsen their condition? Could even short term usage of an androgen like 1-test cause the onset of heart disease in someone who is at risk because of genetic factors?

Just curious...Ive done a lot of searching but it dosent look like any studies have been done concerning 1-test and the heart.

BigV

[comrade]

the answer is yes.

I rest my case.

[BigVrunga]

Then what is the sense of using it?

[maggmaster]

Dont listen to him he has no evidence of that, do a search on pub-med regarding aas and the heart and you will find conflicting studies. Some say that androgens increase heart health while others say that androgens cause damage to the heart. I believe due to the recent increase in HRT prescriptions(31% growth from last year) that new evidence has emerged within the medical community that makes the older studies obsolete. I have never seen an actual statement to this affect but Ill bet someone around here has.

[Matthew D]

Comrade.. I hate to explain something about this forum.. if you can back it up... don't say it.. NOW produce the info or edit the statement..

[BigVrunga]

Maggmaster,
I did a pubmed search before I started this thread and I did read a lot of conflicting studies. One was trying to find a link between testosterone and heart disease. Others citing that inhaled steroid use could lead to heart problems. Either way - it would seem that lasting heart damage (if any) would be caused from prolonged elevated androgen levels.
However, I can't find any studies on short term 1-test use and the heart. Since that is what most people on this board use - I was wondering if anyone else had any solid info.

Thanks,
BigV

[Matthew D]

I don't think there would be any hard evidence either way at this point.. 1-test is relatively new. Dang, they are still figure out how real test impacts the body

[size]

My opinion:

Using AAS and other supplements is NOT the healthiest way to live. The stress that a bber or serious weightlifter forces upon ones body certainly is going to be damaging. Consequently, I have accepted this fact and have decided to live with it.

[comrade]

I don't think there would be any hard evidence either way at this point.. 1-test is relatively new. Dang, they are still figure out how real test impacts the body

That was my point exactly, I was being facetious.
Unfortunetly you can't pick up sarcasm over a computer.
I had a feeling at least one person would take it seriously.
probably should have expliclty stated I was being sarcastic.

You can only speculate that because 1-test elevates blood pressure and probably cholesterol as well that it is unfriendly to the heart.
Heart damage is a different issue. I don't think a doctor is going to examine your heart a find obvious cardiac lessions.
So unless we are talking about a scar or deformation that can be detected as obvious damage we are talking about something more subjectively measured, that shouldn't even be refered to as heart damage, more like an impairment of cardiac health.

Like Mat D. said even with the research done of test, how supraphysiological levels of test effect cardiac health is very contraversal.

I'd like to see what would happen if someone was monitoring thier blood sugar while using a few different products.

[bioman]

It's a good question and something to consider. IMO if you have some forms of heart conditions that cause thickening of the heart walls or enlarged heart then AAS might excellerate it. I have acute mytral valve prolapse (so did Arnold) which is known to enlarge the heart. Basically the heart has to work harder due to faulty, leaky valves and over time it may enlarge. My concern is that androgens may hasten this process but I'll cross that bridge when I come to it. Please note I have ZERO PROOF to support my concerns at this point.

Arnold's still kickin although he had valve replacement surgery.

Other types of heart disease linked to cholesterol levels are going to behave totally different to androgen use.

Blood sugar levels in diabetics who are prescribed steroid pulses run the risk of severe hyperglycemic conditions...so says my friend who is a Dr..but it makes sense.

[Cogar]

Dont listen to him he has no evidence of that, do a search on pub-med regarding aas and the heart and you will find conflicting studies. Some say that androgens increase heart health while others say that androgens cause damage to the heart. I believe due to the recent increase in HRT prescriptions(31% growth from last year) that new evidence has emerged within the medical community that makes the older studies obsolete. I have never seen an actual statement to this affect but Ill bet someone around here has.

Good point. Based on the studies I have read, it appears that those people who use HRT to establish the hormone levels of a healthy 20-year-old will benefit. Those who use higher doses may have problems.

[Cogar]

The latest (Feb. 2004) edition of Life Extension Magazine has an interesting cover story: "Should Aging Men take Testosterone? The New Controversy"

Their site also has a very comprehensive article entitled "Male Hormone Modulation Therapy" located here (link).

[Iron Warrior]

My opinion:

Using AAS and other supplements is NOT the healthiest way to live. The stress that a bber or serious weightlifter forces upon ones body certainly is going to be damaging. Consequently, I have accepted this fact and have decided to live with it.

I agree with you on this one, we just have to take some accountability for possible consequences. I accept the risks associated with 1-Test cause I don't wanna live past 75. Many relatives of mine have lived in their 90's and I wouldn't wanna go through what they did anyway, seemed like living was a burden for my grandma and grandpa after 70.

[comrade]

Blood sugar levels in diabetics who are prescribed steroid pulses run the risk of severe hyperglycemic conditions...so says my friend who is a Dr..but it makes sense.

you sure he wasn't talking about corticosteriods?
I bet he probably was, considering how rare aas prescriptions are.

[comrade]

I agree with you on this one, we just have to take some accountability for possible consequences. I accept the risks associated with 1-Test cause I don't wanna live past 75. Many relatives of mine have lived in their 90's and I wouldn't wanna go through what they did anyway, seemed like living was a burden for my grandma and grandpa after 70.

many pro bb's die young, though that is no means to conclude aas is the sole cause of this,
as for Arnold S. and his heart condition, supposedly it was a genetic defect.

[BigVrunga]

Arnold's still kickin although he had valve replacement surgery.

And doing quite well, it seems...

Ive read a lot about MVP - I thought that I had it a few months ago when I went in for a checkup (first time in 10 years) and found out I had a heart murmur. I had thought that I might have MVP, and went in for an echocardiogram. The doc said I'm fine, but I started thinking a lot about cardio-vascular health after the whole experience.

I dont know if androgens could accelarate MVP, but then againt no-one really knows what causes it (in most cases it is genetic, some say its an imbalance in the body where it can't properly gauge fluid levels or something like that)

I would think steroids would cause more damage by increasing levels of LDL cholesterol and raising blood pressure. Both are known sides of steroid use and both are known to make the heart work harder than it has to. Considering it takes quite a while (a few months post-cycle) for the body to completely return to normal - multiple repeated cycles without proper downtime could seemingly aggrevate a genetic heart condition.

But, like bioman said ZERO PROOF. Just conclusive evidence.

But,then again, being generally over-stressed can make your heart work harder.

I guess the best way to keep the mind at ease if youre going to use androgenic substances is to use them like you would any other chemical with potential hazards - in moderation and with a solid knowledge of their affects on your body.