superdrol vs anadrol in sides/toxicity

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    Let me be the first to say Mooch nice AVI...

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    you are the first...i changed it like 30 seconds ago...literally!
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    you are the first...i changed it like 30 seconds ago...literally!
    this new avatar needs a little work start him off on an anadrol superdrol stack..
    •   
       

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    but what if he bloats? and loses his hair?
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    i thought you were going to go somewhere else with this....now your just being annoying....you THINK dbol sides are more like anadrol....whatever, this whole discussion is opinion and rhetorical....your saying because you bloat from dbol its like anadrol....well i gotta tell ya....read some logs...lots of guys bloat from super too.....look at unreal...he kickstarted a test cycle with super and lost like 10-15 lbs after he finished the super but was on test! if thats not water and glycogen(ie.. bloat) then what is it?
    Definitely a fair amount of bloat when i was on the Superdrol, well i was up 25 pounds on it. Glycogen, a TON of water weight, and surely this was also caused by my diet.

    As for why it came off so quickly... the 600-900mg of test wasn't doing ****, that was part of it. Certainly lost strength as soon as I was off it so glycogen was coming down. I've run SD before where I was a little less excessive with my calories and i didnt' bloat as badly.

    My overall opinion on bloating is that steroids like SD & PP will make you *susceptible* to bloating if you eat enough carbs and drink enough water, cuz you just tend to soak up more of it.
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    IME Super is harsher by far mg for mg. For me 20mg of SD felt as bad (not sick, but you just know things aren't right inside)as 300mg of A50. A50 will make you (look) bigger and will make you much stronger. No comparison for me.

    That said, one is legal and one is not. I would never touch A50s while on US soil.

    Also, 20mg of SD is all anyone should ever need.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erekose View Post
    IME Super is harsher by far mg for mg. For me 20mg of SD felt as bad (not sick, but you just know things aren't right inside)as 300mg of A50. A50 will make you (look) bigger and will make you much stronger. No comparison for me.

    That said, one is legal and one is not. I would never touch A50s while on US soil.

    Also, 20mg of SD is all anyone should ever need.
    I agree 100%
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    Super killed me from the start, blood pressure blew up in the first few days and lethargy hit soon as well. My buddy said anadrol gave him a bunch of energy and made him feel very good.

    i think most PH's are going to be harder on the body just because the "good stuff" was all regulated back in the day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnubs View Post
    Super killed me from the start, blood pressure blew up in the first few days and lethargy hit soon as well. My buddy said anadrol gave him a bunch of energy and made him feel very good.

    i think most PH's are going to be harder on the body just because the "good stuff" was all regulated back in the day.
    i agree. its sad though most people think the opposite. especially the younger crowd.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnubs View Post
    Super killed me from the start, blood pressure blew up in the first few days and lethargy hit soon as well. My buddy said anadrol gave him a bunch of energy and made him feel very good.

    i think most PH's are going to be harder on the body just because the "good stuff" was all regulated back in the day.
    Yes that's what I was saying the side effects are very different.Most would agree.
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    Quote Originally Posted by vidapreta View Post
    Yes that's what I was saying the side effects are very different.Most would agree.
    "From personal experience, however, I can tell you that gains from Anadrol are quite dramatic for the first 3 weeks, and then quickly level off. Unfortunately, I find that the side effects experienced from Anadrol (which include a headache, bloating, elevated blood pressure, and a general "unwell" feeling for me) "

    this is a quote from the anadrol write-up on steroid.com....i can do this all day bro..."most"....is a strong word....maybe "you" agree would have been better....im not the only one who felt lethargy from anadrol or bloated from superdrol....you can stop trying to belittle me because its not working....you just agreed with a guy (no offense tnubs) who by his own admission has never actually run anadrol....
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    Let's settle this, someone give me some Drol and i'll compare it to Super
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    yeah if anyone is giving it away i wouldnt mind doing some more "research" myself!!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnubs View Post
    Super killed me from the start, blood pressure blew up in the first few days and lethargy hit soon as well. My buddy said anadrol gave him a bunch of energy and made him feel very good.

    i think most PH's are going to be harder on the body just because the "good stuff" was all regulated back in the day.
    x2 exactly the same for me. I felt much better on Anadrol but looked much better on superdrol(that ripped look).
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    "From personal experience, however, I can tell you that gains from Anadrol are quite dramatic for the first 3 weeks, and then quickly level off. Unfortunately, I find that the side effects experienced from Anadrol (which include a headache, bloating, elevated blood pressure, and a general "unwell" feeling for me) "

    this is a quote from the anadrol write-up on steroid.com....i can do this all day bro..."most"....is a strong word....maybe "you" agree would have been better....im not the only one who felt lethargy from anadrol or bloated from superdrol....you can stop trying to belittle me because its not working....you just agreed with a guy (no offense tnubs) who by his own admission has never actually run anadrol....
    I think your wrong. IMHO
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    Quote Originally Posted by jiggero View Post
    I think your wrong. IMHO
    who the hell are you? ive given plenty of supporting evidence in this thread that many people get lethargic from a-bombs and bloat from super...i dont care that you think im wrong...the evidence is out there....
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    who the hell are you? ive given plenty of supporting evidence in this thread that many people get lethargic from a-bombs and bloat from super...i dont care that you think im wrong...the evidence is out there....
    I hAVE personal experience and know fellow lifters who have used the original AX Superdrol and Anadrol and the difference in side effects is pretty much what vidapreta is saying.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erekose View Post
    IME Super is harsher by far mg for mg. For me 20mg of SD felt as bad (not sick, but you just know things aren't right inside)as 300mg of A50. A50 will make you (look) bigger and will make you much stronger. No comparison for me.

    That said, one is legal and one is not. I would never touch A50s while on US soil.

    Also, 20mg of SD is all anyone should ever need.
    Anadrol50 will make you look bigger,but I think the gain from superdrol are of a better quality.
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    ive just given examples of people...myself included who bloated off superdrol....are you calling me and unreal liars? Because thats basically what im getting from this...WELCOME TO AM....read some logs....many people get a bloated effect from super....if you didnt...thats awesome!!! good for you....and again as far as lethargy or an "unwell" feeing from a bombs i experienced this too...and so did the author of steroid.com....one of the best referance sites in the steroid world....just because you didnt get these effects that makes teh rest of us wrong and liars???? hmmmm....i also just noticed you said you know people you have taken these compounds and are going off their results....please dont comment on things you havent run yourself.....
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    ive just given examples of people...myself included who bloated off superdrol....are you calling me and unreal liars? Because thats basically what im getting from this...WELCOME TO AM....read some logs....many people get a bloated effect from super....if you didnt...thats awesome!!! good for you....and again as far as lethargy or an "unwell" feeing from a bombs i experienced this too...and so did the author of steroid.com....one of the best referance sites in the steroid world....just because you didnt get these effects that makes teh rest of us wrong and liars???? hmmmm....i also just noticed you said you know people you have taken these compounds and are going off their results....please dont comment on things you havent run yourself.....
    Are you calling myself and my friends liars?? You just got angry saying I called you and unreal liars and then you go and do the same thing, a bit hipocritical wouldn't you say
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    ive just given examples of people...myself included who bloated off superdrol....are you calling me and unreal liars? Because thats basically what im getting from this...WELCOME TO AM....read some logs....many people get a bloated effect from super....if you didnt...thats awesome!!! good for you....and again as far as lethargy or an "unwell" feeing from a bombs i experienced this too...and so did the author of steroid.com....one of the best referance sites in the steroid world....just because you didnt get these effects that makes teh rest of us wrong and liars???? hmmmm....i also just noticed you said you know people you have taken these compounds and are going off their results....please dont comment on things you havent run yourself.....

    Generally
    speaking superdrol will not give you bloat because of its diuretic properties. . . Nor have I heard or seen anyone experiencing bloat from superdrol while working at a supp store(Everyone reacts different to these compounds though). A very high percentage of people will have that lethargic feeling with orals reguardless of the type A BOMBs being one of those orals.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jiggero View Post
    Are you calling myself and my friends liars?? You just got angry saying I called you and unreal liars and then you go and do the same thing, a bit hipocritical wouldn't you say
    have you read this thread at all or did you just jump in at the end....never once did i say that others shouldnt have different effects than what i had...im only giving examples of the sides that myself and many others have had....
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    idk if i said this but super was very dry for me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Link24 View Post

    Generally
    speaking superdrol will not give you bloat because of its diuretic properties. . . Nor have I heard or seen anyone experiencing bloat from superdrol while working at a supp store(Everyone reacts different to these compounds though). A very high percentage of people will have that lethargic feeling with orals reguardless of the type A BOMBs being one of those orals.
    bingo....i just found this....

    first off superdrol is not a diuretic.....its a potent inhibitor of 11-beta hydroxylase which results in water retention....this is the same pathway that causes anadrols water retention....
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    bingo....i just found this....

    first off superdrol is not a diuretic.....its a potent inhibitor of 11-beta hydroxylase which results in water retention....this is the same pathway that causes anadrols water retention....
    Mooch, do you have a link to this? Typically 11b-hydroxylase inhibition results in the opposite of water retention from lowering cortisol & aldosterone. Many androgens are 11b-hydroxylase inhibitors and are without excess water retention except for those that aromatize, in which the bloat is estrogen mediated.

    Most of the testers of the original Designer Supplements Superdrol along with DS' original write-up claim SD as a diuretic. My only experiences with SD were w/the first run of DS' Superdrol and it was a dry experience. My total weight only went up a couple of pounds, and I added 1/2" to my arms, 1"+ to my chest, lowered BF%, etc. What version of methasteron did you use? I wonder if your & Unreal's experiences were do to differences in the products?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mass_69 View Post
    Mooch, do you have a link to this? Typically 11b-hydroxylase inhibition results in the opposite of water retention from lowering cortisol & aldosterone. Many androgens are 11b-hydroxylase inhibitors and are without excess water retention except for those that aromatize, in which the bloat is estrogen mediated.

    Most of the testers of the original Designer Supplements Superdrol along with DS' original write-up claim SD as a diuretic. My only experiences with SD were w/the first run of DS' Superdrol and it was a dry experience. My total weight only went up a couple of pounds, and I added 1/2" to my arms, 1"+ to my chest, lowered BF%, etc. What version of methasteron did you use? I wonder if your & Unreal's experiences were do to differences in the products?
    according to seth roberts book "anabolic pharmacology" the inhibition of 11-beta hydroxylase results in water retention....whether it is in the form of subcutaneus edema like anadrol or some sort of intra-muscular/intra-cellular retention seems to depend on other factors....any more questions on this should be directed to him as its getting pretty over my head...


    edit: i used granite x from rockhard formulations
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    mass...i just pm'ed seth....hopefully he will chime in here eventually....
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    mass...i just pm'ed seth....hopefully he will chime in here eventually....
    Cool.

    I've wanted to read that but haven't had the chance to pick it up.
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    its completely changing my thoughts on many things in our world....so much of what we see on here is just broscience....but its presented in a way that it sounds legit....seths book has been much better for me than any other steroid book ive read...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mass_69 View Post
    Mooch, do you have a link to this? Typically 11b-hydroxylase inhibition results in the opposite of water retention from lowering cortisol & aldosterone. Many androgens are 11b-hydroxylase inhibitors and are without excess water retention except for those that aromatize, in which the bloat is estrogen mediated.
    Most of the testers of the original Designer Supplements Superdrol along with DS' original write-up claim SD as a diuretic. My only experiences with SD were w/the first run of DS' Superdrol and it was a dry experience. My total weight only went up a couple of pounds, and I added 1/2" to my arms, 1"+ to my chest, lowered BF%, etc. What version of methasteron did you use? I wonder if your & Unreal's experiences were do to differences in the products?
    seth credits this pathway for the water retention from super, anadrol and phera.....im sure their are others but those are the only ones ive seen so far...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mass_69 View Post
    Mooch, do you have a link to this? Typically 11b-hydroxylase inhibition results in the opposite of water retention from lowering cortisol & aldosterone. Many androgens are 11b-hydroxylase inhibitors and are without excess water retention except for those that aromatize, in which the bloat is estrogen mediated.

    Most of the testers of the original Designer Supplements Superdrol along with DS' original write-up claim SD as a diuretic. My only experiences with SD were w/the first run of DS' Superdrol and it was a dry experience. My total weight only went up a couple of pounds, and I added 1/2" to my arms, 1"+ to my chest, lowered BF%, etc. What version of methasteron did you use? I wonder if your & Unreal's experiences were do to differences in the products?
    You need to make the distinction between water retention and subcutaneous edema (bloat). They are two different things entirely. Most androgens tend to cause water retention -- many through the inhibiton of 11-beta hydroxylase which results in decreased cortisol and increased deoxycorticosterone, a potent mineralocorticoid and water retainer. Bloating, or subcutaneous edema is exacerbated by estrogens and results from the extravasation of plasma from the intracellularspace (or from capillaries) into the extracellular, subcutaneous space. You can have water retention without bloating and you can have bloating without water retention.
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    You are correct that in my statement I probably should have been more specific in regards to "water retention" vs. "bloat." Since the topic of conversation was "bloat," I was not referring to muscular-intracellular water retention.

    With that being said, SD's water-retention is similar to the water rentention that happens 24-48 hours after a weight training session, resulting in a muscle-fullness look, and not bloat. It's no secret that Superdrol loads the muscle with glycogen & water along with building some new muscle, but Anadrol is known for producing a puffy, bloated look - aka subcutaneous edema.

    Seth, I do not have a copy of your book *wink-wink*, so I do not know the exact context of what Mooch paraphrased here:
    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321
    seth credits this pathway for the water retention from super, anadrol and phera.....im sure their are others but those are the only ones ive seen so far...
    Are your referring to water-retention or bloat when discussing these?
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    I know what i had was Superdrol, the clone i had was from 2006 and totally legit, when the pills ran out i switched to another clone that had the same effects. Bloat definitely occurred, i was up 25 pounds, when i saw the scale going up i just kept eating because that's what i'm trained to do, with the pics i saw the magnitude of the bloat brought on. I think that perceiving SD as a carb monster was a part of why I was eating so much carbs, which really just translated into flabby gains.
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    [QUOTE=Mass_69;2010985]You are correct that in my statement I probably should have been more specific in regards to "water retention" vs. "bloat." Since the topic of conversation was "bloat," I was not referring to muscular-intracellular water retention.

    With that being said, SD's water-retention is similar to the water rentention that happens 24-48 hours after a weight training session, resulting in a muscle-fullness look, and not bloat. It's no secret that Superdrol loads the muscle with glycogen & water along with building some new muscle, but Anadrol is known for producing a puffy, bloated look - aka subcutaneous edema.

    Seth, I do not have a copy of your book *wink-wink*, so I do not know the exact context of what Mooch paraphrased here:

    Are your referring to water-retention or bloat when discussing these?[/QUOT

    Bloat.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Link24 View Post

    Generally
    speaking superdrol will not give you bloat because of its diuretic properties. . . Nor have I heard or seen anyone experiencing bloat from superdrol while working at a supp store(Everyone reacts different to these compounds though). A very high percentage of people will have that lethargic feeling with orals reguardless of the type A BOMBs being one of those orals.
    But A Bombs will give you bloat.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    have you read this thread at all or did you just jump in at the end....never once did i say that others shouldnt have different effects than what i had...im only giving examples of the sides that myself and many others have had....
    No you said the sides of superdrol and anadrol were pretty similar and i said they are not.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mass_69 View Post
    You are correct that in my statement I probably should have been more specific in regards to "water retention" vs. "bloat." Since the topic of conversation was "bloat," I was not referring to muscular-intracellular water retention.

    With that being said, SD's water-retention is similar to the water rentention that happens 24-48 hours after a weight training session, resulting in a muscle-fullness look, and not bloat. It's no secret that Superdrol loads the muscle with glycogen & water along with building some new muscle, but Anadrol is known for producing a puffy, bloated look - aka subcutaneous edema.

    Seth, I do not have a copy of your book *wink-wink*, so I do not know the exact context of what Mooch paraphrased here:

    Are your referring to water-retention or bloat when discussing these?
    Vidapreta answered for me -- too bad he answered incorrectly. I was referring to water retention. Superdrol causes significant water retention, but in most people, little to no bloat or subcutaneous edema. That is not to say this is true for everyone though. Some people have more propensity for bloating, probably due to their own unique estrogen milieu and the leakiness of their capillary beds. Diet - particularly sodium (of course) can enhance water retention and may promote bloating. I have seen time and time again where people with low sodium intake do not gain as much weight or bloat as much on AAS. This is due to the minarolocorticoid-like effect of many AAS - mostly through the increase in deoxycorticosterone.

    I think some people here may be splitting hairs. If you have increased acne, increased hair loss, increased blood pressure, a grapefruit sized prostate, decreased HDL, large increases in water retention from two compounds but one bloats for most people and one bloats for some people are the side effects more similar or more different. That being said, the side effects from any two compounds are probably more similar than different. In any case, as other people have said many times before, each AAS is unique and you really can't say "oh this compound is just like anavar" because unless it is anavar, it is not just like anavar. It may "feel" like anavar but "feel" means jack ****.
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    Quote Originally Posted by sethroberts View Post
    I think some people here may be splitting hairs.
    Agreed. I was lurking and refraining from commenting in this thread until I saw Mooch's post about the means of water retention for SD and A-bombs, and my curiosity got the best of me.

    I think the bottom line here is that mg-for-mg, SD is more toxic, but, with each taken at their respective typical dosages, toxicity and side effects are similar. At the typical dosages used, some differences in the 2 include:

    - anadrol "bloat" tends to be absent with superdrol
    - hair loss tends to be less with superdrol than anadrol
    - superdrol may be a little more harsh on HDL than anadrol, but both will lower it

    I'm sure I left something out.

    Quote Originally Posted by sethroberts
    That being said, the side effects from any two compounds are probably more similar than different. In any case, as other people have said many times before, each AAS is unique and you really can't say "oh this compound is just like anavar" because unless it is anavar, it is not just like anavar. It may "feel" like anavar but "feel" means jack ****.
    Mmmm... M4OHN... wait, still not anavar. Screw it, may still have to bust it out this Summer
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