Please Review My First Cycle! The Result Of Weeks Of Research
04-15-2009 09:50 AM
Please Review My First Cycle! Hope I'm Ready After Weeks Of Research
I'm about to run my first cycle. It will be four weeks of Havoc. I'm 37yo 5'9" 167lb and approx 10% BF. Been lifting over 15 years. My primary goal is to cut which Havoc is good for. Of course bulking is inevitable and will be good, but I favor leaning over the bulking at the moment.
This is what I'm planning:
Weeks 1-4 Havoc 20/30/30/40
Weeks 1-4 Taurine (continued into weeks 5-8 if pumps are an issue)
Weeks 1-4 cissus (continued into weeks 5-8 if joints are an issue)
Weeks 1-8 Liver support - AI Life Support (pill form of AI Cycle Support)
Weeks 1-8 PP Toco-8
Weeks 5-8 Creatine
Weeks 5-8 Anti crotisone: PP EndoAmp Max
Weeks 5-8 Test booster: PP Sustain Alpha
Weeks 5-8 Test booster/Trans-resveratrol: AI Post Cycle Support
Weeks 5-8 SERM: Toremifene 40 ED or Nolva 10 ED (I may skip SERM if I don't feel like I need it)
To minimize hair loss I'll be using 2% Nizoral and Rogaine throughout.
Other supps I normally take that I'll be using throughtout:
Green tea powder
How does this look? It's the result of many weeks and many hours of research but I still may have something wrong. Am I covered for gyno prevention and test recovery?
Two things I'm uncertain about:
1) Eric (who has been very helpful) from PP wrote an article advising against the use of AIs so I'm not planning to have Novedex, Formex, Reservitol, Arimidex or anything like that. I won't have it on hand even if decide not to use the SERM. Is that a mistake?
2) The one area I'm not sure I'm fully covered on is the test boster, even though I have two supps that fall into that category. Would anyone add Activate Xtreme, T-Bol, Blue Up, Mass FX... ?
I know some people start their cycle support 1-2 weeks pre-cycle. Is this necessary for Havoc?
Am I missing anything? Do I need CoQ10? ZMA? B6? I3c? DHEA? Tribulus? These are all things people have recommended for PCT but I don't know that they're necessary for Havoc.
Thank you in advance for whatever help or advice you can throw my way!!!
P.S. Not sure if I'm allowed to ask here but if anyone has a reliable serm source (especially for torem), a PM would be VERY much appreciated.
04-15-2009 09:59 AM
looks good man. looks like youve done some good research.
I ran epi at 20/30/40/40 and had some decent results. I gained about 5-6 lbs and lost some bf after a bulk. I didnt experience any hairloss but im not prone to it either.
I dont think your missing anything for something like Havoc. For PCT I ran Torem at 120/90/60mgs and I recovered just fine. I also tapered in AI Stoked/PCS and dropped it after a few weeks. Torem should bring you back just fine from havoc
04-15-2009 10:00 AM
just pre load the Cycle support for a week and its go time
04-15-2009 05:51 PM
Anyone else have an opinion?
Am I going to be OK without an AI if I decide not to use a serm?
If I start Cycle Support a week early I'll have to stop it after three weeks of PCT instead of four weeks. Is that a good trade off? I'd rather not have to buy another jar just for the extra week.
Originally Posted by nsmoney1
Or maybe the pre-load week I could take half doses and then in the last week of PCT take half doses.
Is pre-loading really important? Delaying my cycle by a week gets me into a sticky situation with a planned vacation that will make it hard to keep things on track.
Also, this is my dosing schedule for the Havoc, is this too aggressive for the first week?
Wk 1 - 10 10 20 20 30 30 30
Wk 2 - 30 30 30 30 30 30 30
Wk 3 - 30 30 30 30 30 30 30
Wk 4 - 40 40 40 40 40 40 40
Thanks again to any help I get. I'm really trying to do this right.
04-15-2009 05:55 PM
you really have a lot of support sups for an epi cycle....this is gonna be expensive....but go for it if it puts your mind at ease....as far as the dosing...i wouldnt even worry about the 10mg days....
04-15-2009 06:06 PM
dont over think things bro. You did a lot of good research, just stick w/ it.
I was supposed to preload my cyc support for a week but I just said f it and started the epi after preloading for 5 days. Id just start with 20 mgs the first wk and see how you feel. No need to do 10 mgs for more than 1 day.
run your cycle support, 2 scoops/day. throughout and into PCT. Run your Serm for PCT for like 3-4 wks and your good. JUST MY OPINOIN though.. im no pro.. Ive just run a few ph cycs
04-15-2009 06:18 PM
Other than the supps I'm taking anyway, what would you cut out?
Originally Posted by mooch2321
I know the taurine and cissus are not necessary but I understand they are effective at combating back pumps and dry joints which are fairly common with epi.
Cycle Support and Post Cycle Support are PCT staples. Would you cut either of those out?
The other three (Toco, Sustain Alpha, Endoamp) are part of the PP Testosterone Recovery Stack. I don't think the Toco is necessary but helps combat hair loss which I suspect I'll be prone to so I'd like to use it.
That leaves Endoamp Max and/or SA. Would you cut either of these?
If I start the Havoc at 20 then I won't be able to go up to 30 in the first week because I won't have enough caps. So is it better to do 20 all week in the first week, or start at 10 and ramp up to 30? I've seen people do it both ways but not sure if it makes much difference.
04-15-2009 11:05 PM
i think your good with all of that bro. Everything seems to serve its purpose. Personally, I just like to keep it simple and stick to the compound, cycle support, a SERM and an AI. I also use taurine on the side too sometimes and fish oil. but then again, i havent had blood work done. I plan on gettin that taken care of after i finish my my pplex cycle
good research though man, your ready to go
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