This Is Your Liver...

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  1. Also I ran a BNP to see if that outrageously high CK could be my heart, and it was 6.2 pg/ml (normal 0-100), so looks like I'm in the clear.


  2. supersoldier.................. ..comparing m1t and t1-pro lab tests what is more test suppressive?
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  3. On M1T I had total shutdown after 3 days. On T1-Pro my testosterone was usually in the low normal range, like 240ish, but I'm that was from the 4AD in the T1-Pro I'm sure, because my LH was still less than 1. For about my first two weeks post T1-Pro cycle my LH was 0.00-0.03. I'd say that M1T suppresses you harder, faster, but suppression is suppression no matter how you look at it. The time to suppress you will be faster with a fast acting, powerful oral like M1T, than it will be for a transdermal or even a long ester IM, because the levels of exogenous hormone need to build up over time. I'd also venture a guess that LH and endogenous test will recover faster coming off an oral only cycle, because the steroid will be out of your system that much faster, even if your on for a decent amount of time.
    Quote Originally Posted by mass_builder
    supersoldier.................. ..comparing m1t and t1-pro lab tests what is more test suppressive?

  4. Seems like your liver is taking a hit. (?)

  5. Do you know if PC1 is charting this on the Excell spreadsheet he mentioned? If he's not, I will. It is kind of difficult to keep up with all these values between posts. Just shoot me PM & I'll get to work.
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  6. Here is an Excell spreadsheet showing the trends. Key:
    Lt blue line = Average of values
    Dk blue line = Trend
    UPL = Upper limmit of Normal
    LPL = Lower limmit of normal

    Supersoldier, I didn't graph everything you tested for. If you'd like to see something else graphed let me know & I'll change it. Also, you'll need Excell before you can open this spreadsheet.

  7. thats weird, ast and alt actually dropped a little after a night of drinking? thats weird...

  8. Can anyone experienced with AAS comment on the test suppression of t1-pro/m-1-t? Total or near total suppression after a 4 week cycle seems terribly severe seeing that typical AAS cycles last 8-12 weeks.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by candle25
    Here is an Excell spreadsheet showing the trends. Key:
    Lt blue line = Average of values
    Dk blue line = Trend
    UPL = Upper limmit of Normal
    LPL = Lower limmit of normal

    Supersoldier, I didn't graph everything you tested for. If you'd like to see something else graphed let me know & I'll change it. Also, you'll need Excell before you can open this spreadsheet.
    Nice work Candle.

  10. i do have excel but how do look at the graph, im not familiar with excel?

  11. Just click on the tabs at the bottom of the worksheet to see the trends for the items I graphed.

  12. Quote Originally Posted by supersoldier
    Also I ran a BNP to see if that outrageously high CK could be my heart, and it was 6.2 pg/ml (normal 0-100), so looks like I'm in the clear.
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't BNP used to look for CHF. Troponin is probably a better indicator.

  13. Quote Originally Posted by andro69
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't BNP used to look for CHF. Troponin is probably a better indicator.
    Troponin would be better, I'll run that tonight, though I'm 99% sure my heart is fine.

  14. Quote Originally Posted by MarcusG
    Can anyone experienced with AAS comment on the test suppression of t1-pro/m-1-t? Total or near total suppression after a 4 week cycle seems terribly severe seeing that typical AAS cycles last 8-12 weeks.
    You can have severe suppression within days. SWALE says he's seen LH levels bottom out on only 100mg of test per week. All hormones suppress but there are many factors that can be involved (how strongly is binds to receptors, aromatization, etc..). Generally the longer you suppress, the longer it takes for the the testes to repsond to LH. Thats seems to be the key to recovery. This is also why HCG use can be very beneficial because it increases the testes response to LH (even though its synthetic) making it easier for the testes to repsond to real LH pulses, making recovery faster.

    Remember 1-test has always be perceived to shut you down prety hard. This seems to lend to that theory.
    For answers to board issues, read the Suggestion and News forum at the bottom of the main page.

  15. Day 13, approx 1hr 30min after dosing. Went out and got pretty tore up on my 21st birthday (Saturday night), drank some gin, and then about 7 beers, a mere warmup for a night of drinking for me 4 months ago. Anyway, AST 102, ALT 139, LD 300, GGT 10, ALP 51, TBIL 0.7, DBIL 0.1, ALB 3.7, cholesterol 66, triglycerides 24. Now for the only thing I've seen so far that concerns me: HDL 5.3(normal 29.0-85.0). From the SOP for the machine that ran the test "HDL cholesterol is inversely related to the risk of developing coronary artery disease. A low HDL/LDL cholesterol ratio is directly related to the risk of developing coronary artery disease. A high HDL cholesterol is associated with the "longevity" syndrome." WTF It goes on to talk about how if your cholesterol is over 150, over 180, over 200, ect, and your HDL is less than >75, 70, 65, 60, ect., than you're at such risk for CHD. It doesn't say **** about if your cholesterol is very low and your HDL is low as ****. I guess they don't take into account the people on steroids ? Troponin is 0.00, testosterone 0.00 (first time I've ever seen it at 0), Estradiol 16.33, FSH 0.17, LH 0.00, PSA 0.41, Prolactin 7.54, Progesterone 0.64.
    I'm gonna do some more research on this absurdly low HDL. If anybody knows anything about it, please post.

  16. Testosterone 0. ummmm......curious, how's the sex drive right now.

  17. Quote Originally Posted by andro69
    Testosterone 0. ummmm......curious, how's the sex drive right now.
    I'd say as high as before I started or higher, I'm getting a better pump in other places besides the gym. I have a decent sex drive while on some ephedrine, or at least a decent amount of caffeine. Other wise I feel like total ****. Sleep sucks too. Without some sort of stimulant I basically feel like I just came off a long ass cycle with no PCT And I felt fine all day without taking anything before I started this cycle.
  18. PC1
    PC1's Avatar

    I didn't catch how long you plan to run this cycle for?

    Also, do you think you would feel better while "on" if you added some 4 diol to your dosing? Or do you just want to see the results from your M1T Only?

    This is really interesting info, thanks for posting it.

    But for we "lay" people, could you post a quickie to explain the test acronyms? AST ALD LD GGT, etc. ?

    Thanks

  19. Quote Originally Posted by PC1
    I didn't catch how long you plan to run this cycle for?

    Also, do you think you would feel better while "on" if you added some 4 diol to your dosing? Or do you just want to see the results from your M1T Only?

    This is really interesting info, thanks for posting it.

    But for we "lay" people, could you post a quickie to explain the test acronyms? AST ALD LD GGT, etc. ?

    Thanks
    I plan on running it for a couple more weeks, I think. That might change. 4AD would definitely help me out, but I'm trying to get a feel for the M1T and not have any other factors affecting my liver, ect. so I can continue to post my values for everybody and not add more variables to the equation. I'm aboout to leave work now, so I'll post more info on the tests tonight. There's a link to a T-mag article I posted on the first page of this thread that explains some of the tests.

  20. Here is the updated Excell spreadsheet showing the trends.
    Key:
    Lt blue line = Average of values
    Dk blue line = Trend
    UPL = Upper limmit of Normal
    LPL = Lower limmit of normal

    Damn bro, It looks like you're shut down hard.

  21. Super you ever post on Chad Nicholl's site on musclemayhem? You oughta post your results on there and you'll get some pretty responses from well educated Pro's and other national level competitors.

  22. Quote Originally Posted by supersoldier
    Now for the only thing I've seen so far that concerns me: HDL 5.3(normal 29.0-85.0). From the SOP for the machine that ran the test "HDL cholesterol is inversely related to the risk of developing coronary artery disease. A low HDL/LDL cholesterol ratio is directly related to the risk of developing coronary artery disease. A high HDL cholesterol is associated with the "longevity" syndrome." WTF It goes on to talk about how if your cholesterol is over 150, over 180, over 200, ect, and your HDL is less than >75, 70, 65, 60, ect., than you're at such risk for CHD. It doesn't say **** about if your cholesterol is very low and your HDL is low as ****. I guess they don't take into account the people on steroids ? Troponin is 0.00, testosterone 0.00 (first time I've ever seen it at 0), Estradiol 16.33, FSH 0.17, LH 0.00, PSA 0.41, Prolactin 7.54, Progesterone 0.64.
    I'm gonna do some more research on this absurdly low HDL. If anybody knows anything about it, please post.
    overall total cholesterol that is low <100 is related to high mortality much like those with overall high cholesterol >200. if you look at a graph of cholesterol levels vs mortality, it looks like a U or horse shoe shaped graph with mortality on the Y-axis and cholesterol on the X-axis.

    And just as important to total cholesterol is it's breakdown. HDL is one of the most important indicators of CHD regardless of overall cholesterol levels. i would be very worried seeing your HDL at 5.3. i've never seen that low level before. hopefully it is just temporary, but you better do blood test after your cycle for your HDL levels. a healthy young male usually has an HDL level of about 50. what is your pre-cycle HDL level? well, good luck with your cycle. hope this helped you some. be safe and take care.

  23. You also might want to include milk thistle, hawthorne berry, and some CoQ10 would do the trick.

  24. I'm not sure what my pre cycle HDL is, but I'll dig through all my printouts and try to find it. Also, I'm not gonna take any liver protectants on this cycle because I'm specifically trying to see what M1T does to me without protectants. And I don't think the toxicity is that great anyway. Maybe next cycle. Bumped to 30mg yesterday, next test will be tomorrow.

  25. Super you oughta post your results on the musclemayhem website bro. Here's the link:

    http://www.musclemayhem.com/forum/cg...1;&#entry96723

  26. An EXTREMELY low HDL seems to be common with oral steroid use. I've seen lab results with a HDL less than 1 many times. It might take months to recover to normal levels after a cycle. The length of the cycle propably affects HDL recovery also.

  27. Very imformative thread. I would also closely watch the HDL levels.

  28. I wonder if mega dosing EFA's would help or hurt?

  29. Quote Originally Posted by bioman
    I wonder if mega dosing EFA's would help or hurt?
    I've been taking in anywhere from 6-12 tbsp of flax oil a day since before I started this cycle through now.

  30. Day 17. Now this is strange. Since bumping to 30mg for 3 days (1tab/3X/day) my liver enzymes have dropped. 7hrs after dosing: AST 60, ALT 87, LD 230, GGT 5, ALP 52, ALB 3.6, TBIL 0.8, DBIL 0.2, Cholesterol 82, Triglycerides 20, HDL 6.4, PSA 0.39, Prolactin 13.91, Progesterone 0.78, Testosterone 27.29, LH 0.00, FSH 0.00, CK 712

    Levels could have fallen off because I took this is my second day off from training in a row, the first two day break since I started. Also CK is way down, makes sense. I've been eating a ton of eggs, cheese, bacon, ect. to try to get my cholesterol up. I even ate pepperoni pizza for the first time in probably 2 years. Day 1 of this cycle my HDL was 47.1 and my cholesterol was 105.
    Nose bleeds have become a problem since Day 13. The first time was when I was bending over stretching my hamstrings with my head between my legs. Ever since it just bleeds whenever. I've been using saline nasal drops and putting Neosporin up each nostril with a cotton swab, especially preworkout.
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