7a OHN Do we have a winner here?
- 12-08-2003, 06:34 PM
- 12-08-2003, 06:56 PM
Its one of the other new Methyls I got a sample of and have been working on. Bruce Kneller wanted some info for it, so I posted it. Its insane (on paper anyway) it will be like the baby cousin of methyltrienolone. I have had my chem house working overtime so that i can get some of these within the next few weeks.
personally i think that the M4OHN, used in smaller amounts will stack great with M5AA for precontest. By using small amounts of it, with no water retention from either compound, no chance of estrogen or proegsterone, you may actually be able to add 2-3lbs of muscle while deiting and not loosing your strength or your mind while on low cals.
For the 4-OHT bridge which is a great idea, you could add small amounts of gh or igf1 and between5-10iu insulin postworkout days only.
And the Vida is good for some rough numbers, although there are better books for steroid structures, but there are definite differences between real world and paper. But as long as we have all those great lab rats out there we can always test them and see what truly is great.
- 12-08-2003, 07:24 PM
- 5'6" 165 lbs.
- Join Date
- Aug 2003
- Rep Power
- Lv. Percent
When you say bridging do you mean using these supps between cycles?
12-08-2003, 07:27 PM
wow soo much information lol.. im trying to soak it up .. thanks for the infor designer supps!
12-08-2003, 08:06 PM
It's a controversial topic but one that needs to be explored and researched by experienced users. Up until now there really hasn't been a suitable compound for experimentation but the latest compounds may make that a reality.Originally posted by yelis300
When you say bridging do you mean using these supps between cycles?
12-08-2003, 10:55 PM
...Can these compounds be used by itself for lean bulking? Perhaps stacked with 4ad?
12-08-2003, 11:01 PM
listen everyone, i just bought 7a-ohn so thats the best! i paid a lot so thats the best. i'm excited so thats the best. lets all forget about these other compounds okay
12-08-2003, 11:06 PM
I definetly think they can be stacked with 4 ad for bulking. It also depends on what you consider bulking. Most understand that there will be some water retention, but lately everyone seems to be freaking out over water retention or some estrogen. Sometimes there are certain situations where it is a good idea to have a little water and we need estrogen for gh to igf1 conversion.
12-08-2003, 11:34 PM
Extra estrogen to an extent is quite anabolic
12-09-2003, 12:17 AM
"7aa-Methyl-4OHN" is the title of the thread on bb which there is some debate over the side effects of 7aa-4OHN especially its progesterone sides.
12-28-2003, 04:23 PM
Originally Posted by 2gcorey
Any updates yet bro?
12-28-2003, 05:26 PM
I just visited http://www.designersupps.com
I only found this ?
We Thank You for joining the iPowerWeb community.
In order to view your website, please remove this file
"index.html" and replace it with your own index.html file.
whats wrong with website ?
12-28-2003, 05:54 PM
He said its not fully up yet.
12-28-2003, 06:10 PM
lets see, If instynct sells 1 kilo of 7a-OHN he grosses what, 300,000? I would be shocked of a kilo costs him over 10k. He is raping everyone without lube on this one.
12-28-2003, 07:55 PM
Originally Posted by theprolangtum
Tell me about it. The price is just plain ridiculous. My conscience alone wouldn't let me charge that high of a price. But, bump again for 2gcorey....
12-28-2003, 08:03 PM
well, if he's rapin everyone that bad, someone else will come out with a similar product soon and he'll lose his arse in businessOriginally Posted by Jergo
12-29-2003, 09:37 AM
If anyone cares, and I'm sure some do, I will have 17a-4OHN in a liquid solution, which is being done by Black Star Labs, in stock in 2-3 weeks. I will also have 20mg caps of 17a-5aa and Tiratricol caps at 2mg in the same time period. I already have M1T at 10mg caps, really cheap, along with usnic acid and some other goodies. The site should be up in like 2 days. Hopefully Chemo and I can work out some agreement to posting/advertising banner in here....
12-29-2003, 09:45 AM
Supply and demand. Do you think that 5lbs of whey really costs $20? NO! But we pay it.
12-29-2003, 10:12 AM
From PDRhealth.com:Originally Posted by custom
Tiratricol is an orphan drug for use in combination with levothyroxine to suppress thyroid stimulating hormone in patients with well-differentiated thyroid cancer who are intolerant to adequate doses of levothyroxine alone. Tiratricol is a metabolite of the thyroid hormone triiodothyronine (T3) and has thyroid hormone activity.
Tiratricol is also marketed as a dietary supplement for weight-loss purposes. In November, 1999, the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) warned against consuming products containing tiratricol. This was based on reports of individuals using tiratricol developing side effects, such as fatigue, lethargy, profound weight loss and severe diarrhea. They were also found to have abnormal thyroid function tests. Further action by the FDA is being considered.
Tiratricol is also known as triiododothyroacetic acid, TRIAC, 3,5,3' -triiodothyroacetic acid and [4-(4-hydroxy-3-iodophenoxy)-3,5-di-iodophenyl]acetic acid. Its molecular formula is C14H9I3O4, and its molecular weight is 621.9 daltons.
ACTIONS AND PHARMACOLOGY
Tiratricol has thyroid hormone activity, including various metabolic effects. It also inhibits the secretion of thyroid-stimulating hormone (TSH) by the pituitary gland.
MECHANISM OF ACTION
The mechanism by which thyroid hormones exert their various actions has not been completely elucidated. Tiratricol is known to act as a feedback inhibitor of TSH secretion by the pituitary gland.
Much is unknown about the pharmacokinetics of tiratricol in humans. The pharmacokinetics of tiratricol appear to be similar to those of thyroxine and triiodothyronine. Tiratricol is absorbed from the small intestine following ingestion. Distribution of tiratricol in the body has not been fully elucidated. Most of this substance appears to be bound to serum proteins, including thyroxine-binding protein and albumin. It appears to be less firmly bound to serum proteins than are T4 and T3. The liver appears to be the major site of degradation of tiratricol. Tiratricol appears to be conjugated with glucuronic acid and sulfuric acid and excreted in the bile. Mainly because it is less tightly bound to serum proteins, tiratricol has a shorter half-life than T4 or T3.
INDICATIONS AND USAGE
The FDA has warned consumers not to purchase tiratricol-containing products due to risk of serious health consequences, including heart attacks and strokes. Tiratricol should be used only under a physician's supervision. Tiratricol is currently used by some as a supplement to burn fat. The doses required to achieve this effect pose significant health risks.
Tiratricol is an orphan drug. The FDA has determined that it should not be used as a nutritional supplement due to serious potential health risks including heart attack and stroke.
CONTRAINDICATIONS, PRECAUTIONS, ADVERSE REACTIONS
Tiratricol is contraindicated in those with untreated thyrotoxicosis of any etiology and in those with uncorrected adrenal insufficiency. Thyroid hormones increase tissue demands for adrenocortical hormones and may thereby precipitate acute adrenal crisis. Tiratricol is also contraindicated in those who are hypersensitive to any component of a tiratricol-containing product.
Tiratricol should only be used for specific approved indications and only under strict medical supervision. Tiratricol should not be used as a treatment for obesity. Tiratricol should be used with extreme caution in those with cardiovascular disorders (including angina, coronary artery disease and hypertension) and in the elderly who have a greater likelihood of occult cardiac disease. Concomitant use of tiratricol and sympathomimetic agents in those with coronary artery disease may increase the risk of coronary insufficiency.
Use of tiratricol in those with concomitant diabetes mellitus, diabetes insipidus or adrenal cortical insufficiency may aggravate the intensity of their symptoms.
Reported adverse reactions include fatigue, lethargy, profound weight loss and severe diarrhea. Tiratricol has also been reported to cause abnormal thyroid function tests.
Anticoagulants (oral). The hypoprothrombinemic effect of anticoagulants, such as warfarin, may be potentiated.
Sympathomimetic agents. There is a possible increased risk of coronary insufficiency in those with coronary artery disease.
Thyroid drugs (levothyroxine, triiodothyronine, thyroid). Concomitant use of tiratricol with these thyroid drugs is likely to produce additive effects.
Tiratricol is likely to alter thyroid function tests, including TSH, T4 and T3.
There have been no reports of overdosage with tiratricol. Excessive doses of tiratricol theoretically may result in a hypermetabolic state indistinguishable from thyrotoxicosis.
DOSAGE AND ADMINISTRATION
Tiratricol is not recommended for use as a dietary supplement.
Anon. FDA warns against consuming dietary supplements containing tiratricol. FDA Talk Paper. Nov 21, 2000.
Bracco D, Morin O, Schutz Y, et al. Comparison of the metabolic effects of 3,5,3'-triiodothyroacetic acid and thyroxine. J Clin Endocrin Met. 1993; 77:221-228.
Radetti G, Persani L, Molinaro G, et al. Clinical and hormonal outcome after two years of triiodothyroacetic acid treatment in a child with thyroid hormone resistance. Thyroid. 1997; 7:775-778.
Takeda T, Suzuki S, Liu RT, DeGroot LJ. Triiodothyroacetic acid has unique potential for therapy of resistance to thyroid hormone. J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 1995; 80:2033-2040.
12-29-2003, 12:16 PM
That's the stuff. But I also heard it will kill you by simply looking at it...
12-29-2003, 12:51 PM
whats the name of your website ?
and how much your selling 17 aa ohn , and do u have 17 aa oht ?
I know about 5 websites that will have it soon , but they are all expensive !
12-29-2003, 02:48 PM
With respcet to the board, I do not want to advertise outright without persmission first, so I will withhold posting my url.
I have not decided on prices yet, but I'm thinking in the range of 1/3 of instynct's for 17a-OHN. As for 17-OHT, I will not have it for the forseeable future, as I have invested all of my available money elsewhere, and I am looking into other things.
12-29-2003, 04:19 PM
Why would instynct sell his product for less if people buy it at the price he sells it for? It would make no sense on his part to decrease price unless sales dropped off.
Please remember this, no one is offering these products b/c they are nice guys. These products are being processed and marketed in an attempt to make a profit and nothing more.
12-29-2003, 04:19 PM
so it's gonna be aroung 30-40 per gram ? sounds reasonable
are you going to have it as capsules , or powder in soluotion ?
12-29-2003, 05:27 PM
I am aware of this, and am quite fluent in pricing strategy. That being said, one, such as myself, breaking into an industry, can only help himself by having one more advantage over competition. If I was more established and well known, then I would sell any given compound for more money; I am not doing this to make friends either.Originally Posted by size
The whole debacle with M1T pricing has been a tremendous blow to my start-up venture. IMO, never should this have been done witha compound in such demand. It can virtually ruin a market. Think about it; 1AD is 1/5 the cost of M1T from the manufacturer, yet costs about 5 times as much retail. That's what we get when people who have no idea determing price for an intire industry do so.
12-29-2003, 06:00 PM
Custom, I wouldn't let it have much of a blow on your venture. Really, I ordered my m1t (4 bottles) recently- but before the recent debacle you're talking about. I'm not upset though. Neither should anyone be. Size is exactly right, let the market determine the price- if you bring your product to market at a price below your competition (any distributor, any product) and can still turn a fair and reasonable profit, more power to you. Don't think Sam Walton missed many nights of sleep as Wal Mart put higher priced business after business down. It might not make everyone happy, me included, but that's the real market. There should be a thread on economics because I predict Bobo and Chemo are gonna get pissed about these valid topics turning into "how to run a business" talks. More power to you custom, I think you got a PM from me. For that matter, more power to all the pioneers on this board, I know I'd be totally in the dark without your contributions. Thanks again.
12-29-2003, 06:25 PM
Originally Posted by custom
You are correct. Invisible ceiling and floor prices will exist in most markets and most prices will lie somewhere in between.
Good luck with your venture. Being friendly and having good service has equal weight when it comes to price in my opinion.
12-29-2003, 09:12 PM
I know I will be much cheaper, selling powder in raw form definelty allows for a cheaper price. It will definetly cost more then 10k per kilo, but it isnt going to be that much higher.
12-29-2003, 09:24 PM
how much are you selling the gram ?50 bucks
if you buy it for 10 k , then1 gram should be at most 50 bucks , thats 40 dollar profit on only one gram . thats 40 thousands of profit ?
if you sell like 10 kilos thats 400 thosands !
dude at least i knew of more than 500 people that are going to buy it to stock up !
12-29-2003, 09:29 PM
He could sell it at whatever he pleases. He is the one taking the chance, and it shouldn't matter what he makes off it. He gives great service and great products. Not to mention great prices.
12-29-2003, 09:32 PM
Another price debate??
1 gram should give 50-100 doses. That is 50 cents - $1 per dose. Stop bitching about price and pay for what works.
12-29-2003, 09:32 PM
It will be less then $50 per gram, that is for sure. But until I know the exact dosing, and get the rest of my lab info done I wont release prices. Other then I am hoping to have it ready by the end of jan. I am working on two other compounds as well at the moment and hope to have them done first.
12-29-2003, 09:33 PM
Exactly. Some people are never happy Chemo.
12-29-2003, 10:18 PM
I messed up my math and deleted my earlier post. Anyway Mikes m-1-t is 3.3cent per mg. If the new stuff which I'm assuming is 17aaOHN is sold for $10/g then its 1 red cent per mg - can't complain about the price there. I know its raw powder vs tabs or capsules so the end consumer will have more worries about storage and dosing but its still ok if the compound works as advertised.
I'll wait for Mike or PN to tab this
12-29-2003, 10:28 PM
YO!! 2GCOREY!! Any updates yet brother???
12-29-2003, 10:30 PM
All I can comment about is what I will be doing, I have no idea who will be doing what or what they will charge. Chemo gave me some good buisness advice, so I just want to say thank you to him. And of course as I get more info I will post it here first.
12-29-2003, 10:32 PM
12-29-2003, 11:09 PM
i emailed instyct about the product and the price competition, i don't want to say what he told me because it was private, but i'm not at all upset about paying his price! i guess he could be telling me a tall tale, but from his rep, i'm assuming its legit. i can't wait for my "17a-ohn" from him
12-29-2003, 11:17 PM
his is 7A, not 17A. just so you know.
12-29-2003, 11:24 PM
i don't know the details, i'm not a chemist i leave that to chemo and you guys, he just said its different and did some explaining. from what i gathered id on't regret the price at all. i'm sure i'll buy some from you and others though. i'm a college student who who has enough supplements in his room one day they will call the fda or someone on me if they ever see my pharmacy i support the sponsors here and everyone else so far everyone form this forum has been great and great customer service with everyone. my only complaint is that the ups and fedex people who deliver my products aren't single hot females, if one company could fix that i'd send them a tip
i should have the product from him in a week or so, its in route to him from the sounds of things.
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