similar question was asked to bryan haycock and i'll post it below , i think will answer this thread the best .
Question: Hi Bryan, Bill Roberts was saying that steroids and other anabolic
drugs can not take a person to any arbitrary level of LBM. He was comparing the
normal genetic physique to Dorian Yates' physique. So what factors would cause
Dorian to become bigger even if the same drugs & dosage/diet/training were used?
It obviously has to be genetics. but what specific aspects that give him that
advantage? Is it because he was born with a lot more muscle fibers and myonuclei
and also has a higher natural testosterone level? Thanks, Tim
Answer: Hi Tim,
Well, genetics are "part" of it. There is a known allele (i.e. variation) of the
myostatin gene that some people have. This apparently affords them faster growth
from resistance training. This could play a role, however, as with other
professional sports, by the time they are professionals, the non-genetically
gifted group ahs already been weeded out. So, admittedly, genetics may be
playing a role in how fast a person grows, particularly when it comes to
Myostatin. But even in people with normal myostatin genes, myostatin is reduced
by upwards of 35% just from resistance training alone. (S. M. Roth, G. F.
Martel, R. E. Ferrell, E. J. Metter, B. F. Hurley, and M. A. Rogers Myostatin
Gene Expression Is Reduced in Humans with Heavy-Resistance Strength Training: A
Brief Communication
Experimental Biology and Medicine, June 1, 2003; 228(6): 706 - 709.) But, I
still feel it is an over simplification to label every variation among
bodybuilders as "genetics".
When trying to figure out what is making the difference between bodybuilders you
should start with those things that are most different between individuals. Keep
in mind that the genetics that are involved in muscle tissue regeneration and
hypertrophy are more identical between individuals that any other variable.
So the most probable factors involved in producing the differences in overall
body mass you see in various professional bodybuilders are diet, training, drugs
dosages and combinations, and the duration of treatment. I’ll discuss each
briefly.
An appropriate diet is absolutely critical for muscle growth. Insufficient
calories inhibit growth by increasing catabolic activity and by directly
decreasing IGF-1 whether you're using testosterone or not (Karila T, Koistinen
H, Seppala M, Koistinen R, Seppala T. Growth hormone induced increase in serum
IGFBP-3 level is reversed by anabolic steroids in substance abusing power
athletes. Clin Endocrinol (Oxf). 1998 Oct;49(4):459-63.). I don't think its
too difficult for someone to understand that a guy who is always trying to stay
lean by keeping his calories/carbs really low, isn't going to have much
success putting on new body mass. And like I said just a second ago,
testosterone isn't going to make a person impervious to the ravages of
dieting. Even guys on multi grams dosages lose lean mass when they cut their
calories too low.
Training is probably one of the most misunderstood factors when steroids are
involved. This especially becomes a problem with veteran bodybuilders. They have
been training the same way and using steroids for so long they are completely
stalled out. Sure, they're big, but they don't grow from month to month or
even year to year. What allowed them to grow when they were rookies, and still
increasing the dosages, simply doesn't do the trick anymore. This is mostly
because their training was inefficient to begin with, and the level of androgens
their maintaining isn't sufficient to support more mass anyway.
About the amount of drugs used, there comes a point where, all things being
equal, the higher the level of testosterone use, the more overall body mass one
can maintain. The anabolic properties of androgens are dose dependant. (See
Bhasin S, Woodhouse L, Casaburi R, Singh AB, Bhasin D, Berman N, Chen X,
Yarasheski KE, Magliano L, Dzekov C, Dzekov J, Bross R, Phillips J, Sinha-Hikim
I, Shen R, Storer TW. Testosterone dose-response relationships in healthy young
men. Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab. 2001 Dec;281(6):E1172-81.; and Woodhouse LJ,
Reisz-Porszasz S, Javanbakht M, Storer TW, Lee M, Zerounian H, Bhasin S.
Development of models to predict anabolic response to testosterone
administration in healthy young men. Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab. 2003
May;284(5):E1009-17.) We know for sure it is up to 600 mg/week without showing
any signs of diminishing returns so I estimate it would continue until about
1,000mg/wk, but I'm speculating on that figure. Still, from the research we
have, you get (all things being equal) about 3 pounds (1.5 kg) of fat free mass
for every 100mg of testosterone per week up to at least 600 mg/week over the
course of about 16 weeks of use. And like I said, the dose response showed no
signs of attenuation, it was linear through 600 mg/week. And this is without any
exercise or mass gaining diet! So clearly, drug dosages make a big difference.
As far as drug type and combinations go, it is well known that the testosterone
esters elicit the greatest increases in circulating GH and IGF-1 levels, where
as steroids that don't aromatize do not have any GH or IGF-1 boosting effect
and thus are inferior mass building drugs. The proper use of GH, ephedrine, and
Cytomel can also allow higher caloric intakes without concomitant fat gain.
And finally, duration of treatment. Simply put, the longer your physique is
under the influence of high androgens, and hypertrophy-specific training and
dieting practices, the bigger you will grow. We're not talking weeks or months
here. We're talking years. Granted, after using androgens for several months,
you reach a quasi steady-state, meaning, your system normalizes, although
at a higher body weight. This is when and why it is important for any top level
bodybuilder to continue to try to make his/her training as effective as
possible.
So, to make a short story long, all of these variables, not to mention age and
musculoskeletal structure, contribute most heavily to the differences you see in
today's pro bodybuilders. However, there are indeed genetic differences that
we are only now beginning to investigate. These differences involve androgen
receptors primarily, but will also involve satellite cells and of course
myostatin (GDF8).