Orals w/ Test enth

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    Orals w/ Test enth


    Looking for the opinion of some of the site vets on what would be a nice beginners injectable cycle to run for lean mass gains with little toxicity/sides. Have done several oral cycles in the past but i am looking to take it to the next level. I realize that everyone says to stcik to just test to see how your body reacts but i want to get the most out of my cycle while my receptors are fresh.
    So far for sure im running
    test enth 500mg/week
    arimidex (.5mg e3d)
    HCG
    10 week cycle
    Hook it up my brothers!!

    edit:Basically i just need a reccomendation for an oral to throw in. i was thinking drol but maybe that is just too harsh

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    please erase lab abbreviation.

    add some dbol @ 30mg for up to 6 weeks
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    Quote Originally Posted by trentime420 View Post
    Looking for the opinion of some of the site vets on what would be a nice beginners injectable cycle to run for lean mass gains with little toxicity/sides. Have done several oral cycles in the past but i am looking to take it to the next level. I realize that everyone says to stcik to just test to see how your body reacts but i want to get the most out of my cycle while my receptors are fresh.
    So far for sure im running
    GP test enth 500mg/week
    GP arimidex (.5mg e3d)
    10 week cycle
    Hook it up my brothers!!
    Well im not a vet but I am planning on doing something similar but with EQ at 450mg a week instead of test and I am planning on using the new 1-T because itís way less toxic than taking a oral. I am going to take the 1-t for the first 6 weeks of a 12 weeker but if you can get some EQ that would stack good with test and you could take a lower dose of test and not have as bad of sides with good gains
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesb2525 View Post
    Well im not a vet but I am planning on doing something similar but with EQ at 450mg a week instead of test and I am planning on using the new 1-T because itís way less toxic than taking a oral. I am going to take the 1-t for the first 6 weeks of a 12 weeker but if you can get some EQ that would stack good with test and you could take a lower dose of test and not have as bad of sides with good gains

    id bump the EQ up and run it longer. im sure Holy will chime in here.
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    gotcha nos shame on me
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    Quote Originally Posted by trentime420 View Post
    gotcha nos shame on me

    same for u Jamesb!!


    im hearing great things from that line though, supposidly the dbol is slightly overdosed
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesb2525 View Post
    Well im not a vet but I am planning on doing something similar but with EQ at 450mg a week instead of test and I am planning on using the new 1-T because itís way less toxic than taking a oral. I am going to take the 1-t for the first 6 weeks of a 12 weeker but if you can get some EQ that would stack good with test and you could take a lower dose of test and not have as bad of sides with good gains
    have you ran test before...it doesnt have bad sides...unless you consider burning fat, adding muscles and feeling like your penis is 16 again bad sides....at 500mgs a week with e or c for 12 weeks i guarantee you will love it...
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    have you ran test before...it doesnt have bad sides...unless you consider burning fat, adding muscles and feeling like your penis is 16 again bad sides....at 500mgs a week with e or c for 12 weeks i guarantee you will love it...
    This is true.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    have you ran test before...it doesnt have bad sides...unless you consider burning fat, adding muscles and feeling like your penis is 16 again bad sides....at 500mgs a week with e or c for 12 weeks i guarantee you will love it...
    No I havenít run test before but it is in my future planes. My friend gave me the EQ but I am going to get some test e soon when his friend gets back in town.
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    Quote Originally Posted by nosnmiveins View Post
    id bump the EQ up and run it longer. im sure Holy will chime in here.
    If it was an EQ only cycle would 600mg for 10-12 weeks be good in till I can get some test E
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    first comment: that line about the receptors is bull****, you don't need an oral while your receptors are "fresh"

    anyway you want something to kickstart TestE and why don't you decide, you ask around and it's the same **** everytime: the big 3 are Superdrol, Phera Plex and Epistane, with Hdrol and "Tren" getting on the list too but more for lean gains...

    You want my recommendation it's Superdrol cuz i love it. But here's a new idea, kickstart with pinning a bunch of test prop eod.

    James i hate to sound like an ass but maybe you should make your own thread.
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    Quote Originally Posted by UnrealMachine View Post
    first comment: that line about the receptors is bull****, you don't need an oral while your receptors are "fresh"

    anyway you want something to kickstart TestE and why don't you decide, you ask around and it's the same **** everytime: the big 3 are Superdrol, Phera Plex and Epistane, with Hdrol and "Tren" getting on the list too but more for lean gains...

    You want my recommendation it's Superdrol cuz i love it. But here's a new idea, kickstart with pinning a bunch of test prop eod.

    James i hate to sound like an ass but maybe you should make your own thread.
    I know man sorry everyone about that. Im still trying to figure this forum thing out. It will not happen again.
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    Quote Originally Posted by UnrealMachine View Post
    first comment: that line about the receptors is bull****, you don't need an oral while your receptors are "fresh"

    anyway you want something to kickstart TestE and why don't you decide, you ask around and it's the same **** everytime: the big 3 are Superdrol, Phera Plex and Epistane, with Hdrol and "Tren" getting on the list too but more for lean gains...
    You want my recommendation it's Superdrol cuz i love it. But here's a new idea, kickstart with pinning a bunch of test prop eod.

    James i hate to sound like an ass but maybe you should make your own thread.

    what ever happened to good old d-bol and a-bombs? or for that matter to a lesser extent t-bol
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesb2525 View Post
    If it was an EQ only cycle would 600mg for 10-12 weeks be good in till I can get some test E

    i think you will like this...run it for longer tho...very subtle but over time you will like it
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    what ever happened to good old d-bol and a-bombs? or for that matter to a lesser extent t-bol
    You are right i was thinking he meant PH/DS since that's always so goddamn popular around here.

    The reason i would use something like Superdrol over something like Anadrol is simple: Superdrol is dirt cheap and I'd trust any of the good SD clones more than i'd trust drol.

    T-Bol vs. Hdrol it's the same argument. Tbol is overpriced when you have Hdrol for 30$.
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    1st cycle you really dont need orals to kick it off, however pplex, mdrol, and dbol are all popular for the first couple of weeks depending on if you know how you respond to the compounds would help make a decisions
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    dbol is a good one to kickstart with. Seems like its the most popular choice. It blows you up quick then you have test e to solidify all the gains.

    drol is one of the harshest orals out, but you would def make great gains kickstarting with it. More gain more sides...

    You keeping it at 10 weeks so you only have to use 2 vials? A lot of people think 10 was too short in hindsight.
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    Quote Originally Posted by UnrealMachine View Post
    first comment: that line about the receptors is bull****, you don't need an oral while your receptors are "fresh"

    anyway you want something to kickstart TestE and why don't you decide, you ask around and it's the same **** everytime: the big 3 are Superdrol, Phera Plex and Epistane, with Hdrol and "Tren" getting on the list too but more for lean gains...

    You want my recommendation it's Superdrol cuz i love it. But here's a new idea, kickstart with pinning a bunch of test prop eod.

    James i hate to sound like an ass but maybe you should make your own thread.

    lets get some **** straight here unreal. first off im not saying i need an oral while my receptors are fresh im saying that i wanna take advantage of the fact that i have never run any aas before and run a real solid cycle. I done with all the ***** prohormones that you listed so ive decided im gonna kick start my cycle with anadrol.
    end of thread.
    those of you who were helpful and respectful thanks a bunch
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smiley View Post
    dbol is a good one to kickstart with. Seems like its the most popular choice. It blows you up quick then you have test e to solidify all the gains.

    drol is one of the harshest orals out, but you would def make great gains kickstarting with it. More gain more sides...

    You keeping it at 10 weeks so you only have to use 2 vials? A lot of people think 10 was too short in hindsight.
    and yes smiley that is why i'd run it at ten weeks but i might go ahead and get another so i can run 12
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    Trentime, i suggest dbol over anadrol. anadrol is pretty harsh and not suggested for a newb to AAS
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    Quote Originally Posted by trentime420 View Post
    lets get some **** straight here unreal. first off im not saying i need an oral while my receptors are fresh im saying that i wanna take advantage of the fact that i have never run any aas before and run a real solid cycle. I done with all the ***** prohormones that you listed so ive decided im gonna kick start my cycle with anadrol.
    end of thread.
    those of you who were helpful and respectful thanks a bunch
    Well just so you know even the term fresh receptor strikes controversy but that's not a debate i'll have.

    Also calling what i listed ***** prohormones shows you dont' really know what you are messing with, they're all active steroids of equal potency to oral AAS. So if you think the illegal stuff is somehow way better, you're a little off.

    You wanted something less harsh than anadrol and you decided on anadrol without listening to everyone. Yes you'll probably get some great gains. Looks like you didn't even need our help.
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    Quote Originally Posted by trentime420 View Post
    lets get some **** straight here unreal. first off im not saying i need an oral while my receptors are fresh im saying that i wanna take advantage of the fact that i have never run any aas before and run a real solid cycle. I done with all the ***** prohormones that you listed so ive decided im gonna kick start my cycle with anadrol.
    end of thread.
    those of you who were helpful and respectful thanks a bunch
    Wow.. ***** prohormones? There's an oxymoron for ya. I remember when M1T was considered a "pro-hormone", if you know anything about it you'll know different. When you post on a thread with many experienced users, expect to get advice. You may not like it, but no need t front an attitude. And as far as anadrol to kickstart your first cycle, coming from someone who has ran it before, I would suggest using something less harsh on your system. You'd be surprised what a "***** prohormone" can do when jumpstarting an inj cycle.
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    Quote Originally Posted by trentime420 View Post
    lets get some **** straight here unreal. first off im not saying i need an oral while my receptors are fresh im saying that i wanna take advantage of the fact that i have never run any aas before and run a real solid cycle. I done with all the ***** prohormones that you listed so ive decided im gonna kick start my cycle with anadrol.
    end of thread.
    those of you who were helpful and respectful thanks a bunch
    Do you have any idea what you are talking about?
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    quick somebody make a sh!tty comment about usp labs....thats the only thing thats gonna save this guy from getting flamed
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    quick somebody make a sh!tty comment about usp labs....thats the only thing thats gonna save this guy from getting flamed
    did someone say overrated?
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    quick somebody make a sh!tty comment about usp labs....thats the only thing thats gonna save this guy from getting flamed
    HAHA!!
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    dude trentime you totally owe me...good luck with your cycle bro
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    Quote Originally Posted by nosnmiveins View Post
    did someone say overrated?

    oh man nos...you just opened a can of worms...i can hear mullet and jacob calling all the ai reps now...they comin for you bro
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooch2321 View Post
    oh man nos...you just opened a can of worms...i can hear mullet and jacob calling all the ai reps now...they comin for you bro
    i have nothing against USP.....but nothing FOR them either. personally just dont like the muscletech marketing techniques.

    but then again i just really dont like OCT supps much either
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    Quote Originally Posted by nosnmiveins View Post
    i have nothing against USP.....but nothing FOR them either. personally just dont like the muscletech marketing techniques.

    but then again i just really dont like OCT supps much either

    ahhh...im just playin bro...cant believe a mod hasnt banned us tho...this is the wrong board for talk like this....I on the other hand do use anabolic pump sometimes when dieting...but right now its not very synergistic with my 10iu of slin postworkout
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    Quote Originally Posted by nosnmiveins View Post
    i have nothing against USP.....but nothing FOR them either. personally just dont like the muscletech marketing techniques.

    but then again i just really dont like OCT supps much either

    I don't like OCT supps either too close to Halloween LOL
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    sorry for ranting on yall but unreals attitude really ticked me off. i used to respect him too but i didint realize what an ass he is. anyways yeah i realize those prohormones are powerful substances but in terms of keepable gains they are rather feminine(*****).. hehe
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    Hey trentime,
    enanthate at 500mg per week is a great dose and should illicit decent gains if your nutrition, training and recovery are dialed in.
    You mention concern about toxicity so the oral should be ran for a shorter duration at a relatively low dose. Oxymetholone is harsher than many orals but very effective. I would encourage you to split the dose during the day. For example; 25mg morning and 25mg evening due to the short half life.
    I personally like d-bol better. I just plain feel better on it than Anadrol. 30mg daily is quite effective when stacked with testosterone.
    Be aware that both anadrol and d-bol will raise blood pressure and effect blood lipids negatively.
    CQ-10 is a way to mitigate blood pressure sides along with a clean diet.

    I have run cycles on and off for 21 years and my body still responds to doses like I mentioned. I believe that you can have many productive cycles in the years to come and frankly your first one will likely not be the best one. Keep good track of your progress and how your body responds to your nutrition, training and aas administration. These "diary's" are very useful for planning future cycles, nutrition adjustments and training splits.

    How are you planning on administering your HCG?


    Quote Originally Posted by trentime420 View Post
    Looking for the opinion of some of the site vets on what would be a nice beginners injectable cycle to run for lean mass gains with little toxicity/sides. Have done several oral cycles in the past but i am looking to take it to the next level. I realize that everyone says to stcik to just test to see how your body reacts but i want to get the most out of my cycle while my receptors are fresh.
    So far for sure im running
    test enth 500mg/week
    arimidex (.5mg e3d)
    HCG
    10 week cycle
    Hook it up my brothers!!

    edit:Basically i just need a reccomendation for an oral to throw in. i was thinking drol but maybe that is just too harsh
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    Quote Originally Posted by heavyiron View Post
    Hey trentime,
    enanthate at 500mg per week is a great dose and should illicit decent gains if your nutrition, training and recovery are dialed in.
    You mention concern about toxicity so the oral should be ran for a shorter duration at a relatively low dose. Oxymetholone is harsher than many orals but very effective. I would encourage you to split the dose during the day. For example; 25mg morning and 25mg evening due to the short half life.
    I personally like d-bol better. I just plain feel better on it than Anadrol. 30mg daily is quite effective when stacked with testosterone.
    Be aware that both anadrol and d-bol will raise blood pressure and effect blood lipids negatively.
    CQ-10 is a way to mitigate blood pressure sides along with a clean diet.

    I have run cycles on and off for 21 years and my body still responds to doses like I mentioned. I believe that you can have many productive cycles in the years to come and frankly your first one will likely not be the best one. Keep good track of your progress and how your body responds to your nutrition, training and aas administration. These "diary's" are very useful for planning future cycles, nutrition adjustments and training splits.

    How are you planning on administering your HCG?
    This is the kind of respones i was hoping for!!! heavy iron you are golden! What i like most about your response is that you didnt feel good on anadrol. i have done my resarch i am just looking for reccomendation based on experience. That is a good enough rason for me to stay away from it for this cycle. i want it to be enjoyable not painful. I think i will stick with dbols administered as you say.
    I am not positive exactly how i will be administering the HCG which is why i didn't say. I was thinking 2500IU once a week for the first 4 weeks and last 4 weeks of being on. what would you say is the best way to run it? does that sound ok?
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    Quote Originally Posted by trentime420 View Post
    I am not positive exactly how i will be administering the HCG which is why i didn't say. I was thinking 2500IU once a week for the first 4 weeks and last 4 weeks of being on. what would you say is the best way to run it? does that sound ok?

    HCG should be pinned 500iu E5D or 250iu twice a week....continuously, not 4 weeks then break then back on, thats just stupid.

    run it up until PCT
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    Quote Originally Posted by trentime420 View Post
    This is the kind of respones i was hoping for!!! heavy iron you are golden! What i like most about your response is that you didnt feel good on anadrol. i have done my resarch i am just looking for reccomendation based on experience. That is a good enough rason for me to stay away from it for this cycle. i want it to be enjoyable not painful. I think i will stick with dbols administered as you say.
    I am not positive exactly how i will be administering the HCG which is why i didn't say. I was thinking 2500IU once a week for the first 4 weeks and last 4 weeks of being on. what would you say is the best way to run it? does that sound ok?
    HCG can be run many ways and I have been experimenting with it for a little over 2 years now. I have run it throughout my cycles for months. I have pulsed it for a few weeks at a time on cycle and obviously used it as part of my PCT.

    The more data that is collected about HCG the more we are learning that low dose and frequent administration is the preferred method of treatment.

    Dr Crisler has done extensive research on HCG and its uses with Testosterone and he recommends 250iu-500iu subq 2 days AND 1 day before a long estered testosterone injection like Enanthate. Larger doses tend to raise estradiol and are not needed to restore testicular function.

    Recently I ran accross a clinical human trial that measured the effects of different doses of HCG while administering Testosterone. The findings support using low doses for 3 weeks to restore ITT. Here is the trial;

    Low-Dose Human Chorionic Gonadotropin Maintains Intratesticular Testosterone in Normal Men with Testosterone-Induced Gonadotropin Suppression
    Andrea D. Coviello, Alvin M. Matsumoto, William J. Bremner, Karen L. Herbst, John K. Amory, Bradley D. Anawalt, Paul R. Sutton, William W. Wright, Terry R. Brown, Xiaohua Yan, Barry R. Zirkin and Jonathan P. Jarow
    Center for Research in Reproduction and Contraception, Geriatric Research Education and Clinical Center, Veteran Affairs Puget Sound Health Care System (A.M.M.), and Department of Medicine, University of Washington School of Medicine (A.D.C., W.J.B., J.K.A., B.D.A., P.R.S.), Seattle, Washington 98195; Department of Medicine, Charles R. Drew University (K.L.H.), Los Angeles, California 90059; Department of Urology, Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine (X.Y., J.P.J.), Baltimore, Maryland 21287; and Division of Reproductive Biology, Department of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology Johns Hopkins University School of Public Health (W.W.W., T.R.B., X.Y., B.R.Z., J.P.J.), Baltimore, Maryland 21205

    Address all correspondence and requests for reprints to: Dr. Andrea D. Coviello, Feinberg School of Medicine, Northwestern University, Tarry 15-751, 303 East Chicago Avenue, Chicago,

    In previous studies of testicular biopsy tissue from healthy men, intratesticular testosterone (ITT) has been shown to be much higher than serum testosterone (T), suggesting that high ITT is needed relative to serum T for normal spermatogenesis in men. However, the quantitative relationship between ITT and spermatogenesis is not known. To begin to address this issue experimentally, we determined the dose-response relationship between human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG) and ITT to ascertain the minimum dose needed to maintain ITT in the normal range. Twenty-nine men with normal reproductive physiology were randomized to receive 200 mg T enanthate weekly in combination with either saline placebo or 125, 250, or 500 IU hCG every other day for 3 wk. ITT was assessed in testicular fluid obtained by percutaneous fine needle aspiration at baseline and at the end of treatment. Baseline serum T (14.1 nmol/liter) was 1.2% of ITT (1174 nmol/liter). LH and FSH were profoundly suppressed to 5% and 3% of baseline, respectively, and ITT was suppressed by 94% (1234 to 72 nmol/liter) in the T enanthate/placebo group. ITT increased linearly with increasing hCG dose (P < 0.001). Posttreatment ITT was 25% less than baseline in the 125 IU hCG group, 7% less than baseline in the 250 IU hCG group, and 26% greater than baseline in the 500 IU hCG group. These results demonstrate that relatively low dose hCG maintains ITT within the normal range in healthy men with gonadotropin suppression. Extensions of this study will allow determination of the ITT concentration threshold required to maintain spermatogenesis in man.


    This trial suggests that about 300iu HCG subq every other day for 3weeks will restore ITT levels to baseline in men using Testosterone.

    I am currently employing this very protocol and my Testosterone dose is 500mg per week. I will run the HCG for the entire course but pulsing HCG will work as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by trentime420 View Post
    This is the kind of respones i was hoping for!!! heavy iron you are golden! What i like most about your response is that you didnt feel good on anadrol. i have done my resarch i am just looking for reccomendation based on experience. That is a good enough rason for me to stay away from it for this cycle. i want it to be enjoyable not painful. I think i will stick with dbols administered as you say.
    I am not positive exactly how i will be administering the HCG which is why i didn't say. I was thinking 2500IU once a week for the first 4 weeks and last 4 weeks of being on. what would you say is the best way to run it? does that sound ok?

    if your gunn do it on cycle do 500iu 2-3x a week, (preferably 2 weeks, i would even continue it into the "washout period and stop before you start your clomid nolva or what have you)

    and use an AI
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