First Cycle (Dbol) need advice

[hoot33]

Ill be starting my first roid cycle ever on monday and Im looking for a little advice on a few things.

My main goal is to bulk up right now, nothing extreme.

So how should I split the intake of the dbol?

Also Im 5' 8" 178 lbs, what should my caloric intake be daily and how many carbs??

Im right down the road from my gym, should I go everyday?? or split my workout over 3 or 4 days through the week.

Should I continue my cardio or will this have adverse effects on my bulking??

Thank you very muich, lookin forward to being a faithful member to these forum s.

Hoot

 

[Jayburned]

People on here will tell you that dbol alone is worthless and that you will lose any gains you make shortly after the cycle is finished. don't believe everything you read. wait for someone with more knowledge than me to respond and in the mean time do research on your own.

 

[hoot33]

been trying to research, not to many people on here seem to be using dbol.

Some advice from an expert would be great.

 

[Jayburned]

dbol's great at the beginning of a test cycle to kickstart gains. I've used it alone in the past and got ridiculous strength gains, but they didn't last. go to the chemical faq on here, the info is there, you just need to find it. good luck

 

[nosnmiveins]

quick size? yes

quick strength gains? yes

lasting gains even with proper diet and PCT? highy unlikely


RUN DBOL WITH TEST!

 

[Jayburned]

word

 

[Pavlovs Vodka]

I was told the same thing 2 years ago about d-bol... I still did it, and I loved being on it. But I lost all my gains (With a good PCT). It's pointless.

Save your d-bol for once you get some Test. Go get a PH. Epi would be a great place to start. You will get gains that you can keep with proper PCT.

 

[hoot33]

I was told the same thing 2 years ago about d-bol... I still did it, and I loved being on it. But I lost all my gains (With a good PCT). It's pointless.

Save your d-bol for once you get some Test. Go get a PH. Epi would be a great place to start. You will get gains that you can keep with proper PCT.

You have to understand Im brand new to this, Im no good with acronyms lol could someone explain exactly what he said in his second paragraph???

 

[Pavlovs Vodka]

You have to understand Im brand new to this, Im no good with acronyms lol could someone explain exactly what he said in his second paragraph???

What I said was save your d-bol until you are more experienced, and stack it with Testosterone. Which is an injectable steroid.

If you do want to go with a hormone increasing substance I would reccomend Epistane (sold as Epistane, E-stane, and Havoc) , or Bold 200. Epistane is methylated. (It is toxic to you liver) So you would need to run liver support supplements. I would reccomend Liv 52, Milk thistle, and Sam-E.

Bold 200 would be a decent way to start off, as it is not methylated. I don't have a lot of knowledge on bold . I'm sure some other people on this board could help you.

I'm telling you. Save the D-bol.

 

[hoot33]

What I said was save your d-bol until you are more experienced, and stack it with Testosterone. Which is an injectable steroid.

If you do want to go with a hormone increasing substance I would reccomend Epistane (sold as Epistane, E-stane, and Havoc) , or Bold 200. Epistane is methylated. (It is toxic to you liver) So you would need to run liver support supplements. I would reccomend Liv 52, Milk thistle, and Sam-E.

Bold 200 would be a decent way to start off, as it is not methylated. I don't have a lot of knowledge on bold . I'm sure some other people on this board could help you.

I'm telling you. Save the D-bol.

What your suggesting, does that depend on my goal?? Alot of people on here are body builders and such and while I have the utmost respect for them its not what Im striving to do. With Dbol alone I was told I would have large gains but lose half because it would be water weight, Im ok with that, Im trying to put on 10 or 15 lbs of muscle and keep it on.
'
For this should I still save my Dbol and get test???

Thanks for all the help.

 

[nephilim666]

why would u suggest epi over dbol? dbol is a better muscle builder, and its been used for so long now we know what to expect from it. dbol 25-30mg ED for 6 weeks is a great way to put on some nice LBM and gain some good strength. and no it wont all go away when you come off, thats waht happens when people dose too high and dont diet correctly.

 

[hoot33]

why would u suggest epi over dbol? dbol is a better muscle builder, and its been used for so long now we know what to expect from it. dbol 25-30mg ED for 6 weeks is a great way to put on some nice LBM and gain some good strength. and no it wont all go away when you come off, thats waht happens when people dose too high and dont diet correctly.

Im 5' 9" 178 And Im pretty active other than going to the gym, what do you recommend for a diet?? Caloric intake? I live in a sort of dormatory so my options are limited to the microwave and my foreman grill.

TY

 

[nephilim666]

foreman grill is great, buffalo paties are a good source of lean protein. chicken, fish, tuna, turkey. solid meats every 3 hours, with a decent helping of some basic carbs. IE brown rice, potatoe, yam, oatmeal.

train no more then 6 times a week, 5 is what i do, most guys train 4-5. cardio is fine to do no more then 3x a week and for 30 minutes tops just to maintain cardiovascular health.

 

[hoot33]

foreman grill is great, buffalo paties are a good source of lean protein. chicken, fish, tuna, turkey. solid meats every 3 hours, with a decent helping of some basic carbs. IE brown rice, potatoe, yam, oatmeal.

train no more then 6 times a week, 5 is what i do, most guys train 4-5. cardio is fine to do no more then 3x a week and for 30 minutes tops just to maintain cardiovascular health.

Lol thats alot of food, how large should my servings be?? I know I am new to this and require alot of help but I do appreciate all the advice I am getting, thank you.

 

[nephilim666]

about 50g protein per meal. 50-60g carbs. 600-700 calories.

youl get used to eating frequently after about a week, and this is when you will see the most improvements in your physique. the loads of good food coupled with the increased metabolisem will add some solid LBM and possibly even burn some unwanted fat.

 

[Jayburned]

nephilim you are the ****, good advice.

 

[brk_nemesis]

idk about others,.... but i kept all my gains on my last dbol cycle in feb. with a "descently good" pct. Supplement wise it was great, but my pct suffered a lil due to financial problems, and therefore i could not spend $50 on meat and potatoes/pastas a week like i did when on,lol so thats what i mean by "decently good.". 2 months later i started a cut, and at the time i still had all my strength, so i think its just having that solid diet when on,in pct, then after and also havin all the correct pct supplements that matters most,.... and also the fact that everyones different, ...what works for one might not on the other

 

[hoot33]

idk about others,.... but i kept all my gains on my last dbol cycle in feb. with a "descently good" pct. Supplement wise it was great, but my pct suffered a lil due to financial problems, and therefore i could not spend $50 on meat and potatoes/pastas a week like i did when on,lol so thats what i mean by "decently good.". 2 months later i started a cut, and at the time i still had all my strength, so i think its just having that solid diet when on,in pct, then after and also havin all the correct pct supplements that matters most,.... and also the fact that everyones different, ...what works for one might not on the other

What is PCT and what supplements do you recommend?

 

[knucks3man]

Usually run Dbol with test. however, DBOL alone does work. No you dont keep 100% of your gains. I just finished a cycle not too long ago of d only, and gained about 25-27 lbs, and lost about 6-7 lbs, and have hardened up. Strength is the same, lost about 2 reps on my max bench. But no big deal.

Just make sure your diet is correct!! Use Creatine during PCT, and train hard. Squats, Bench, Deadlifts are a must.

 

[hoot33]

please someone let me know what PCT is.

 

[nephilim666]

post cycle therapy. its run after you come off anabolics to help your natural hormones get back to normal as fast as possible. for your purposes post cycle support and some creatine will work just fine. you could get nolvadex ( tamoxifen citrate) but it is not nesseary.

 

[EasyEJL]

why would u suggest epi over dbol? dbol is a better muscle builder, and its been used for so long now we know what to expect from it. dbol 25-30mg ED for 6 weeks is a great way to put on some nice LBM and gain some good strength. and no it wont all go away when you come off, thats waht happens when people dose too high and dont diet correctly.

At his weight i'd think possibly 20mg a day to start with, but otherwise agree.

 

[mooch2321]

good advice neph....i dont understand the aversion to d-bol on this board...people will hate on it so bad without test...but then turn around and run phera or something. to me d-bol= ...with or without test

 

[jpbennett1208]

D-Bol can offer gains if a proper diet and PCT is used. Like everyone else, I will say that D-Bol is best used in conjunction with injectables, usually to "kick start" a cycle or "bridge" cycles.

I would recommended atleast having clomid and/or nolvadex for a PCT. HCG is good but hard to get a handle on often

Also, I would have one of the following chems for during your cycle to fight gyno,etc. I like letrozole, but armidex, etc. will work.

 

[nephilim666]

dbol wont cause much bloat or convert enough to give gyno at 20-30mg. 20 is on the low side but you will see gains, i put a client on 20mg of dbol for 6 weeks prior to going into marine bootcamp and he came back telling me he couldnt thank me enough, he put on solid lbm and got stronger and didnt use post cycle just tapered off, he came back the same weight he finished his cycle with but shredded.

 

[brk_nemesis]

What is PCT and what supplements do you recommend?

srry been away from a comp all day,... post cycle therapy is basically what nephilim666 said, as it is supposed to "heal" your body up, balance off/get everything back to normal, but also solidify your gains. search pct on here as there are SO many things that you can take, some personal pref. while others are the basics. off the top of my head I had nolva on hand (always have a SERM bro) milk thistle, perfect cycle liver cleaner (old bottle), NAC, hawthorne berry, saw palmetto,.. also sum crap test booster, and ATD , i wrote it all out, idk where it is, as it was about8-9 months ago. Big thing is having a SERM, and other pct supps to help out elsewhere,..... and diet has to be as perfect as possible. better the diet, the better the gains. I was literally a steak,fish, ckn, pasta, and potato monster when on,.... and then moreso on pct

 

[thebulkster]

some of the stuff im hearing in this thread is utterly rediculous!!!!!!!!!

"you could get nolvadex ( tamoxifen citrate) but it is not nesseary."

NOT NESESSARY?!?! wtf??? its Dbol!!! You NEED nolvadex in your PCT. AND some extra during cycle incase you get gyno.

"dbol wont cause much bloat or convert enough to give gyno at 20-30mg"

More bollocks. It will bloat at 20-30 unless controlled by proper diet and/or proviron. And if your saying gyno will not happen at this dosage range your a fool, as it can happen...and it happens quite bloody often.

Jesus guys. You lot are supposed to be giving advise! (not aimed at all of you as some gave good advise) but to whom this may concern, i dont know what the hell your doing telling this guy about your mate who did no pct and tapered off fine. It MAY have been ok for your mate but that just means hes one LUCKY f*cker! This guy is obviously a first timer and seems a hell of a long way off being ready to take steroids. And all of you should be advising him the proper use of pct etc.

To the original poster:

20-30mg/day of dbol for 4 weeks.
You WILL put on a little bloat (a lot if not controlled) so dont confuse bloat as gains. But you will gain some LBM so dont be disheartened. I think dbol is great IMO

Have nolvadex on hand and start taking it if you start to see signs of gyno (itchy nips, puffy nips, lump under nips)

And use nolvadex for your PCT as per usual 21 day protocal.

nice little cycle if diet/training are nailed....and no alcahol

 

[mixedup]

some of the stuff im hearing in this thread is utterly rediculous!!!!!!!!!

I understand what your saying but alot of the stuff you think is ridiculous is coming from a very knowledgeable person who does this for a living and competes at a very high level probablly going pro next year if I remember correctly . So he does have alot of experience and time in doing this.

 

[thebulkster]

He may be knowlegable mate. But to me all that advise is just plain unproffessional. I don't care how big or ripped the guy is...that is just outright bad advise...

 

[honda450]

Hate to say it, but you really need to read up on what you will be doing to your body before you do it.

Roids aren't magic. Research as much as you can before you jump into something like this.

Good advice though guys.

 

[MassBuilda123]

Also if you're afraid of injecting.. IF I'm saying IF because a lot of times these guys don't want to pin.. so if that were the case.. A dbol/Epistane cycle would suffice! I've done it and gained 18 pounds.. lost 4 during PCT.. but that's decent weight.. and of course I had my PCT in order. Nolvadex 40, 40, 20, 20 and some natty test booster like Blue Up will do you just right.

 

[jpbennett1208]

I agree with the bulkster..

You'd be an absolute moron to not have nolvadex or something on hand. Some people are more prone to gyno than others. Nolvadex is inexpensive if you look in the right places and if you can't afford something as inexpensive as nolva you SHOULDNT be doing gear.

I may not have much of a rep on here but some of the advice above was completely ridiculous

 

[Big Phil]

dude pay attention to this. my cousin is a huge roid dealer so i know alot. with dbol, sure it will work on its own, but its much better to take it with something else. either deca or maybe mdrol or torque. the problem with another oral steroid is that ur liver is gonna be fried lol so u gotta take liver support and stay on in for a while. when i was on it, i lifted 2 days off 1 day and lifted extremely hard, consumed about 4000 calories a day.

 

[nephilim666]

im not going to get into an internet-argument with you bulkster. You either have no experience with dianabol or are just regurgitating what you read on the internet.

 

[Pavlovs Vodka]

some of the stuff im hearing in this thread is utterly rediculous!!!!!!!!!

"you could get nolvadex ( tamoxifen citrate) but it is not nesseary."

NOT NESESSARY?!?! wtf??? its Dbol!!! You NEED nolvadex in your PCT. AND some extra during cycle incase you get gyno.

"dbol wont cause much bloat or convert enough to give gyno at 20-30mg"

More bollocks. It will bloat at 20-30 unless controlled by proper diet and/or proviron. And if your saying gyno will not happen at this dosage range your a fool, as it can happen...and it happens quite bloody often.

Jesus guys. You lot are supposed to be giving advise! (not aimed at all of you as some gave good advise) but to whom this may concern, i dont know what the hell your doing telling this guy about your mate who did no pct and tapered off fine. It MAY have been ok for your mate but that just means hes one LUCKY f*cker! This guy is obviously a first timer and seems a hell of a long way off being ready to take steroids. And all of you should be advising him the proper use of pct etc.

To the original poster:

20-30mg/day of dbol for 4 weeks.
You WILL put on a little bloat (a lot if not controlled) so dont confuse bloat as gains. But you will gain some LBM so dont be disheartened. I think dbol is great IMO

Have nolvadex on hand and start taking it if you start to see signs of gyno (itchy nips, puffy nips, lump under nips)

And use nolvadex for your PCT as per usual 21 day protocal.

nice little cycle if diet/training are nailed....and no alcahol

I agree with some of this post. I would like to point out that with AAS and PH's, no one has a monopoly on irrefutable truth. Everyone is speaking from their own personal experiences, and those of people they have trained with. I am of the school of thought that D-bol alone is a little wasteful, and IN MY EXPERIENCE, even with proper nutrition and PCT, I lost about 50% of my gains, weight wise.

Further more, I def agree that an SERM is NECESSARY, not optional when using AAS, particularly one like d-bol, which is attributed to high-aromatization, and always causes me nipple sensitivity.

I am of the school of thought, that when giving advice to someone who a) i don't know and b) has less AAS experience than myself it is one thing to emphasize my personal experience, but I should always encourage the other person to take the safest possible route to HPTA recovery.

 

[thebulkster]

Bennett - thanks
Vodka - totally agree
666 - I've used dbol on many occasions. And have myself experienced the onset of gyno (which was dealt with as i had a SERM ON HAND) i have also known MANY people who have had the same. And im not disputing that your "client" didn't use PCT and was fine or whatever i'm just saying that this irresponsible approach to PCT should not be shown to an inexperienced 1st timer. Dont really care if you think i am just regurgitating information. I am speaking experience and many other people i know's experience and most of all im speaking common bloody sence. Original poster - dont risk messing up your natty test chief. Use a serm. end of

 

[brk_nemesis]

Bennett - thanks
Vodka - totally agree
666 - I've used dbol on many occasions. And have myself experienced the onset of gyno (which was dealt with as i had a SERM ON HAND) i have also known MANY people who have had the same. And im not disputing that your "client" didn't use PCT and was fine or whatever i'm just saying that this irresponsible approach to PCT should not be shown to an inexperienced 1st timer. Dont really care if you think i am just regurgitating information. I am speaking experience and many other people i know's experience and most of all im speaking common bloody sence. Original poster - dont risk messing up your natty test chief. Use a serm. end of

agreed. wow i musta been reading fast the other nite i toatlly skipped the "SERM not necessary" part, wtf? To OP ....always have a SERM bro, no matter what you are taking. Strong, or mild always have one. Read the studies, and do more research on PCT here on the forum as there is plenty of it. SERMs are like condoms,.... its better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it. Although technically you should still be using them no matter what so maybe i went off track with the condom psychology b.s. lol

 

[LilPsychotic]

idk about others,.... but i kept all my gains on my last dbol cycle in feb. with a "descently good" pct. Supplement wise it was great, but my pct suffered a lil due to financial problems, and therefore i could not spend $50 on meat and potatoes/pastas a week like i did when on,lol so thats what i mean by "decently good.". 2 months later i started a cut, and at the time i still had all my strength, so i think its just having that solid diet when on,in pct, then after and also havin all the correct pct supplements that matters most,.... and also the fact that everyones different, ...what works for one might not on the other

A solid diet shouldn't be a maybe, sometimes thing. Its the single most important part of bodybuilding. Lifting all the weight in the world wont matter if that factor is left out of the equation.

 

[raginfcktard]

He may be knowlegable mate. But to me all that advise is just plain unproffessional. I don't care how big or ripped the guy is...that is just outright bad advise...

strong first posts...20-30 mg dbol is not ****. worst side might be back pumps. people on these boards over exaggerate PCT protocol IMO to scare noobs and make them feel inferior. you are also calling out a board vet. by regurgiting crap everyone knows or thinks they know. he recommended a safe dose for a beginner, and assuming he will use it no longer than 6 weeks serms will most likely NOT be needed, not saying not to have one, but probably not necessary!

I think you'll be fine!

 

[LilPsychotic]

A friend of mine did a d-bol only cycle years ago before the controlled substance act, when you could buy it at your local GNC. He went up to 40mg over six weeks, and gained 40lbs (mostly water). That was well before the advent of pct, and he ended up keeping 6 lbs total. That should give you some idea of what your getting into. If you run a good pct, you can probrably at least double what he kept, and could minimize bloat with a simple AI. I don't see any problem with a d-bol only cycle, just to get your feet wet. You may want to try something light, just to see what its like, instead of committing to a longer injectable cycle.

 

[raginfcktard]

A friend of mine did a d-bol only cycle years ago before the controlled substance act, when you could buy it at your local GNC. He went up to 40mg over six weeks, and gained 40lbs (mostly water). That was well before the advent of pct, and he ended up keeping 6 lbs total. That should give you some idea of what your getting into. If you run a good pct, you can probrably at least double what he kept, and could minimize bloat with a simple AI. I don't see any problem with a d-bol only cycle, just to get your feet wet. You may want to try something light, just to see what its like, instead of committing to a longer injectable cycle.

please tell me you are joking

 

[brk_nemesis]

A solid diet shouldn't be a maybe, sometimes thing. Its the single most important part of bodybuilding. Lifting all the weight in the world wont matter if that factor is left out of the equation.

So are you agreeing with me that a solid diet is important or criticizing my post? I thought i made it abundantly clear in my post my diet wasnt 100% perfect in PCT due to financial problems. Please dont take this as argumentative, I'm just clarifying the direction of your post.

 

[EasyEJL]

someone ask arnold what serms he used when he was popping dbols in the 70s...

 

[LilPsychotic]

So are you agreeing with me that a solid diet is important or criticizing my post? I thought i made it abundantly clear in my post my diet wasnt 100% perfect in PCT due to financial problems. Please dont take this as argumentative, I'm just clarifying the direction of your post.

I'm just saying, I've lived on next to nothing as a student for a long time. Somehow, you've got to make the diet work. I've lived off of tuna, eggs, brown rice, oatmeal, and peanut butter for a long time.

 

[LilPsychotic]

please tell me you are joking

No, in the eighties you could buy 100 count Roche d-bol (and other AAS) for less than $20 otc. This was before anabolic steroids were controlled.

 

[Pavlovs Vodka]

If you are in the small percentage of the population who can get gyno from 20-30mg of dbol then you probably won't think an SERM is overkill.

It is not very safe to make blanket statements about whether or not someone we don't know "will be alright" from a particular dose of AAS. Obviously, the majority of the time this person will probably "be alright". But no one who gets a bad case of gyno from following poor advice is going to care about the statistics.

 

[nephilim666]

thank you EJL and RAGIN for some normal imput that i couldnt have read out of bigcats profiles.. and yea 40mg will cause some water retention, i think your friend exaggurated his 40lbs because thats just not possible.

 

[EasyEJL]

If you are in the small percentage of the population who can get gyno from 20-30mg of dbol then you probably won't think an SERM is overkill.

It is not very safe to make blanket statements about whether or not someone we don't know "will be alright" from a particular dose of AAS. Obviously, the majority of the time this person will probably "be alright". But no one who gets a bad case of gyno from following poor advice is going to care about the statistics.

yeah, I'm certainly not saying its a bad idea to have a serm handy, I think you should even if you are doing a 4 week cycle of halodrol at 50mg/day. but at 20mg~30mg of dbol a day you aren't very likely to need it. And for just controlling armotization, probably ATD is a better choice for on cycle, or arimidex over using a serm

 

[hoot33]

Ok, I understand I should have a SERM handy, I will see what I can do about getting one as I dont start my cycle until tomorrow.

As far as mg and cycle length Im not to sure, was going to run 6 weeks but if I can run it in 4 that would be great, when on 6 or 4 weeks what mg is best?

Ill let you know what I ate yesterday as this will basically be the same through out my cycle,

up 7 am jog 8-9 am protein shake and cell tech shake at 10, 12:30 can of tuna no mayo and oatmeal, 4:30 serving of fish and spaghetti, 7 cucumber and tomato. rest.

Is that ok?

 

[raginfcktard]

20/25/30/35/40/40....personially i'd just start 25 or 30. no need for you to push it past 40 either. i like 50 but water retention picks up for me. atd should be strong enough for this imo.

EDIT: eat more and keep it as clean as possible as this is a 'wet' compound. this is the only reason i maintain a considerably low BF when taking it