M-1-T half life

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    M-1-T half life


    It seem that there is some differing opinions on the half life of m-1-t.
    Iv'e read estimates as high as 96 hrs which seems unreal because at 10mg ed after 2 weeks you should have over 200mg in you!!!!!

    So does anyone have any helpful information about what m-1-ts half life is???

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    If you really searched, you would see that no one is sure not even the guys who know just about everything.


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    I'M aware that nobody really know what the half life is, what i should have said is what are y'alls opininionson the subject?
    and why would the half life of this be so long when most orals are rather short?
    and if the half lif is several days doesnt taking 10-30mg ed seem crazy considering the amount that will build up?
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    There is a lot of confusion as to the half life of M-1-T. It is no different than ANY OTHER 17-ALKYLATED ORAL. However, the therapeutic effect may be extended due to its low threshold. Reference below for some sample numbers to illustrate my point:

    DBOL - A well known oral
    Let's say someone dosed 50 mg at one time. Let's further assume that the half life is an even 8 hours and the therapeutic threshold is about 10 mg (arbitrary number) for this test subject.

    HOUR 1 - 50 mg dosed
    HOUR 8 - 25 mg left
    HOUR 16 - 12.5 mg left <- Losing therapeutic effect
    HOUR 24 - 6.25 mg left <- Below threshold

    Let's take it a step further for day 2 of test subject dbol dosing.

    HOUR 1 - 50 mg dosed + 6.25 mg day 1 residual = 56.25 mg TOTAL
    HOUR 8 - 28.13 mg left
    HOUR 16 - 14.07 mg left
    HOUR 24 - 7.04 mg left (dropped below threshold ~20 HOUR mark)

    This illustrates the additive effect of oral dosing of 17-alkylated compounds. Now let's apply this to M-1-T:

    Let's assume that Vida data is at least CLOSE to true. Most will agree that 500 mg test enth weekly is the minimum dose for gains. Now, an equivalent dose of M-1-T would be 40 mg weekly or 5.7 mg daily (Vida, pg 211 tabular data). Generally speaking, threshold will be in the magnitude of half that amount. So, the threshold can be ASSumed to be around 2.5 mg.

    HOUR 1 - 10 mg dosed
    HOUR 8 - 5 mg left
    HOUR 16 - 2.5 mg left <- dropping below threshold
    HOUR 24 - 1.3 mg left

    Continue into day 2:

    HOUR 1 - 10 mg dosed + 1.25 mg residual = 11.25 mg TOTAL
    HOUR 8 - 5.6 mg left
    HOUR 16 - 2.8 mg left
    HOUR 24 - 1.4 mg left

    NOW, let's up the dose to 20 mg M-1-T ED:

    HOUR 1 - 20 mg dosed
    HOUR 8 - 10 mg left
    HOUR 16 - 5 mg left
    HOUR 24 - 2.5 mg left

    Continue into day 2:

    HOUR 1 - 20 mg dosed + 2.5 mg residual = 22.5 mg TOTAL
    HOUR 8 - 11.25 mg left
    HOUR 16 - 5.63 mg left
    HOUR 24 - 2.8 mg left

    IMHO, the half life of M-1-T will be identical to any other oral. The difference is the low therapeutic dose. Further, given the logic flow above 5 mg is my recommended daily dose and should decrease or eliminate sides thereby extending times able to be cycled.

    20 mg is the HIGHEST recommended dose and should be reserved for those with extensive experience with past AAS cycles (not prohormones).

    Humbly submitted,

    Chemo

    Disclaimer: I can be and am frequently wrong...but not often.
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    BTW, I forgot to add an important note:

    Those taking high doses (30-40+ mg ED) after a few weeks the additive effect will cause the elimination time to be at the 96 hour mark as has been reported. Do the math given the examples above...

    ...which leads me back to the recommended dose of 5 mg ED. I prefer to dose an oral that is out of my system the day after taking my last tablet. If one were to stick with 5 mg ED they could run out to at least the traditional 4 week mark and the additive effect should still not be a concern.

    Chemo
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    Reference the attached graphic....

    ...so you can see the basis for my ASSumptions.

    Chemo
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    Anyone else with some input?

    Chemo
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    Originally posted by Chemo
    Anyone else with some input?

    Chemo
    I don't think many are going to be able to match your posts . As always I appreciate the information.
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    Originally posted by Chemo
    Anyone else with some input?

    Chemo
    The new Reeses Sticks are very good. I suggest everyone try them on their carb up.


    Thats my input.
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    I still prefer the good old peanut butter cup myself.
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    Originally posted by sifu
    I still prefer the good old peanut butter cup myself.
    I second that.
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    thanks for the info chemo

    and those reeses sticks are the best. I bought a ****load at wal-mart when they were getting rid of halloween stuff.


    those chocolate eggs with the cruchy centers are real good too.
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    I would say something, but Chemo pretty mcuh summed it up.... dont know what to say....
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    notawk is now OWNED by Chemo.

    damn good info - even for the common non-chemist bbuilder to understand
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    notawk is now OWNED by Chemo

    what? lol


    that was good info though,
    even though it doesn't affect what chemo was trying to get across, isnt the half lif of methandrostenalone like 4-5 hrs and not eight??
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    I agree with your assestment Chemo, but I just find it difficult to believe that 5mg is a sufficient amount.

    Your math skills are very sound though.
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    Iam in the same boat. I ran 20mg for four weeks and had great results. Now I am doing the same with 10mg. And 10mg is definately not as strong as 20mg. I don't even want to try 5mg.
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    Originally posted by nostawk
    ...
    isnt the half lif of methandrostenalone like 4-5 hrs and not eight??
    Individual mileage may vary...your half life elimination time may be 4 hours or may be 8 depending on several factors. It is hard to say "absolutely 6 hours" for EVERYONE. Good point though!
    Originally posted by size
    I agree with your assestment Chemo, but I just find it difficult to believe that 5mg is a sufficient amount.

    Your math skills are very sound though.
    Remember, the intent is to gain slowly over the course of several weeks instead of the 2 week mass explosion that most are seeing. IMO, it is better to run a low dose over 4-6 weeks with steady gains than suffer through 2 weeks with cramps, etc. for the same amount of mass.

    2 weeks @ 20 mg ED, 12 pounds gained -> WITH MUSCLE CRAMPS
    4-6 WEEKS @ 5 mg ED, 12 pounds gained -> NO SIDES

    See my point? M-1-T is most likely the first experience that most will have with true oral anabolics. They don't have the experience to gauge whether they need to increase, maintain, or decrease dose. For a beginner 5 mg ED will still yield EXCELLENT gains while minimizing or eliminating side effects (and should be safer in general for them). Vets can tailor the dose to suit their needs...as they do with everything else anyway

    I believe your statement should read more like this:

    "I don't see how 5 mg ED of M-1-T will do anything FOR ME"
    Originally posted by sifu
    Iam in the same boat. I ran 20mg for four weeks and had great results. Now I am doing the same with 10mg. And 10mg is definately not as strong as 20mg. I don't even want to try 5mg.
    Once again, an individual opinion based on your research. I agree that FOR ME 5 mg ED would yield less gains but then again my receptors are not as fresh as the average prohormone user.

    Chemo
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    Originally posted by Chemo



    2 weeks @ 20 mg ED, 12 pounds gained -&gt; WITH MUSCLE CRAMPS
    4-6 WEEKS @ 5 mg ED, 12 pounds gained -&gt; NO SIDES

    Point taken. I tend to agree with you on that. I have never been one wanting to explode quickly, I prefer slow gains as to keep all suspicion away.
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    I'm still taking 10mg/day and seeing very nice, steady results with practically zero side (compared to my first run at 30mg/day which was hell)
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    Originally posted by Chemo


    See my point? M-1-T is most likely the first experience that most will have with true oral anabolics. They don't have the experience to gauge whether they need to increase, maintain, or decrease dose.
    Bingo!

    I can't imagine some of these people trying Drol or Dbol and practially exploding in a week. They would think its God in a pill.
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    I'll pray for you Bobo..

    30mg a day? 20 had me sick, sweaty, and tired as all hell.. I thought I was being punished..

    10mg ED is doin' my body good..
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    I'm having 0 sides with 10mg ed also. A tad bit of appetite surpression in the morning, but thats it
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    Originally posted by Chemo
    Reference the attached graphic....

    ...so you can see the basis for my ASSumptions.

    Chemo
    Help this ignorant old man out. Why does the table show test prop at 200 and below that, test prop at 50, and below that, a third test prop at 89?

    Also, what are the numbers for orals like winny, anavar, dbol? Might help to put it in perspective.

    Traps
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    Originally posted by MrTrap
    ...
    Also, what are the numbers for orals like winny, anavar, dbol? Might help to put it in perspective.

    Traps
    Let's give someone else the opportunity to step up and post some Vida references to those compounds...I know there are some bros that got the e-book from db862 as well!

    Chemo
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    are the meth 1-test tabs scored at all so they can be cut in half so that one could do 5mg ed?
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    Just get a pill cutter at Wal-mart for $2.
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    Chemo,
    Excellent Info.

    So what do you think about split dosing.

    5 mg twice a day would keep levels above optimal range 24/7

    Any input?

    Would a larger individual require more M1T?

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    Originally posted by ak-47
    Chemo,
    Excellent Info.

    So what do you think about split dosing.

    5 mg twice a day would keep levels above optimal range 24/7

    Any input?

    Would a larger individual require more M1T?

    There are many factors that determine therapeutic dose for an individual. Remember, the amount dosed will have to be translated into actual blood concentration. The volume of blood is pretty constant among people of like body composition but will differ by weight. As an example, the normal blood volume is about 70 mL / kg.

    180 pound, 81.6 kg adult has about 5.7 liters of blood

    220 pound, 99.8 kg adult has about 7.0 liters of blood

    In light of this, it will be necessary for a larger person to dose more to achieve the same blood concentration...but not very much more. There should be no need to go above 10 mg for ANY body weight and 5 mg will do fine for most 180 pounders.

    As for your split dosing question: it will decrease the peak blood concentration but remain above therapeutic dose 24 hours a day. Of course this depends on weight of the person, receptor state, liver function, and many other factors...each one being particular to that person. It may work better for some and not for others. You'll have to try it and report your feedback.

    Chemo
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    hmm maybe I should try dropping my dose from 10mg to 5mg
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    It is always better to start low and work up if necessary than the other way around...

    Chemo
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    well I thought starting at 10 was low before everybody else was at 20mg at the time. But if 5mg is as effect as 10mg, that means Ive got enough m1t for 200 days
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    With a slow, steady buildup - based on half-life - wouldn't perhaps 5 or 10 mg twice a day (12 or 14 hours apart) at the beginning, then cutting it down as it builds up in your system seem to be a better approach?
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    hhmmmm...maybe.

    Very good observation, dsade.

    Would anyone like to comment?

    Chemo
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    Originally posted by dsade
    With a slow, steady buildup - based on half-life - wouldn't perhaps 5 or 10 mg twice a day (12 or 14 hours apart) at the beginning, then cutting it down as it builds up in your system seem to be a better approach?
    HMMM.... Veddy Intudesting...
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    Originally posted by dsade
    With a slow, steady buildup - based on half-life - wouldn't perhaps 5 or 10 mg twice a day (12 or 14 hours apart) at the beginning, then cutting it down as it builds up in your system seem to be a better approach?
    Androgens mainly work by promoting androgen gene transcription. This can take many hours or in some cases days and the half life of the target hormone or in this case androgen doesn't have much of an effect on this timeframe. Even when the hormone is cleared from your system the effects are ongoing. So either spreading it out or taking it all at once, the effects won't be that much different.


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    I'm looking at it not from the split dose perspective but rather the additive effect angle (in terms of sides).

    ...trying to make it easy on the beginner

    Chemo
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    Ok. But then would be have to find out if those effects are based on hormone levels (high or low) or the results of the prolonged effects of the androgen. I would think it works in same fashion as the benefits (gene transcription) but I'm not sure. I would have to do some digging on that one.

    On another note, from my personsal experience I saw zero difference with side effects whether dosage was all in the morning or spread out. I suspect its because of the reason posted above. We also have to take into account the half-life of the metabolites which seem to cause the majority of side effects (which obvisouly your aware of). Thats where you come in Chemo. I don't even know what they are (except for 17 methyl DHT in which the pathway is unkown!)
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    Originally posted by Chemo
    I'm looking at it not from the split dose perspective but rather the additive effect angle (in terms of sides).

    ...trying to make it easy on the beginner

    Chemo
    &nbsp;

    Exactly
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    Originally posted by Bobo
    ...
    Thats where you come in Chemo. I don't even know what they are (except for 17 methyl DHT in which the pathway is unkown!)
    What? M-1-T has metabolites??

    I have no idea what they are and since M-1-T is not my baby I will definitely not be dishing out the $50K to find out.

    I bet we could get some sharp minds together and hypothesize though...

    Chemo
  

  
 

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