Which AI to use?
- 10-28-2008, 03:09 PM
Which AI to use?
So I'm taking dutasteride for hair loss, and have been for several years (.5 mg 2x/week). The results are great, no sexual or mental side effects, but I've gotten slightly pudgy (despite working out pretty consistently) and I'm having a hard time getting rid of the extra padding and putting on hard muscle. While I'm not certain that the dut bumped up my estrogen levels, it seems pretty logical to me, and I don't think I can walk into a doctor's office and demand blood work to investigate the effects of a drug they didn't prescribe.
Anyways, after doing a bit of reading, I feel like an AI of some sort might help. The literature seems pretty wishy-washy on Resveratrol (low oral bioavailibility, for one) but I do like that it's natural. I'm tempted by Letrazole, but I know some people get sides. Most of the people using it for gymno-prevention during or post cycle take pretty high doses. What if I just took half a pill (1.25mg) twice a week? It'd also be fairly economic, as the other AI's people talk about (Nolvadex or tamoxifen) are more expensive (if you're taking a pill every day). Am I crazy?
PS all the hair-loss and AI related posts are in here, so that's where I thought to put it. I don't use steroids, this is for long-term fitness not pre or post or during cycle.
- 10-28-2008, 03:25 PM
6 oxo or 6 bromo low dose 3 x a week can be a long term thing especially with all the estrogens in our drinking water and food.
- 10-28-2008, 10:46 PM
how long are you willing to do this? i assume after you stop the AI you would be back in the same boat.
10-29-2008, 02:17 AM
I would recommend a natural AI. For your situation, you sound like a good candidate for Reverse.
The compound had very good anti-estrogenic properties along with a lot of other added benefits.
10-29-2008, 07:10 PM
Well, I've been taking dutasteride for about 3.5 years, and not especially tempted to stop -- would you rather be fit but not ripped with pretty good hair or sixpack ripped and bald? Easy choice for me, but everyone has different preferences. So, I'd be willing to do whatever counteracts what I perceive to be the negative side effects indefinitely.
I'm intrigued by Resveratrol, having done a little reading. The pharmacokinetics are troubling, though. I'm not thrilled that that product, reverse, has 850mg of "mixture", an indeterminate amount of which is resveratrol, and I don't know anything at all about the other two ingredients.
Update: So, I did a little more reading about Reverse/Resveratrol. I don't understand why Reverse, specifically, is worthwhile.
For $75, I can get 30g of 100% pure trans-resveratrol.
Transmax Trans-Resveratrol Supplement Prices
$42 buys me 24.2g of this reverse stuff, of which at most half (and perhaps a lot less) is acetylated resveratrol, and i'll assume that it's all of the correct stereoisomer.
People say that it's not particularly bioavailable in its natural form, and that's true but misleading. 75% of it is metabolized by the body, it's just that the dominant metabolites are sulfites and gluconurites, and very little undigested resveratrol floats about in the plasma. Does the triaceylate not metabolize to these same metabolites? Do the metabolites not exhibit similar health-enhancing attributes? Also, one of the studies you cite actually shows that the triaceylate is less well absorbed than the natural form. See J Agric Food Chem. 2007 May 2;55(9):3720-8. Epub 2007 Mar 31.
PMID: 17397183 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] ("The order of effectiveness found was resveratrol > trimethylresveratrol > triacetylresveratrol.").
In order to attain comparable levels to that used in rat studies, people would have to consume about 4.5g of resveratrol per day. One authority on these boards suggests taking 1g per day.
6-OXO Extreme Dosing?
Market price for the pure stuff is not cheap -- about $2 per gram. On the other hand, the therapeutic dose is relatively high, and we don't know how much we're getting in this product.
I guess what I'm saying is: if I think resveratrol is something I want to take, why should I pay for an unknown quantity of a particular structural isomer of unknown utility with some mushroom juice and vitamin B12 thrown in, when I can probably get a lot more bang for the buck just by buying a known quantity of a known compound?
Last edited by nycboy80; 10-29-2008 at 11:12 PM. Reason: did homeworks
10-29-2008, 08:35 PM
umm....you can def go get bloodwork done without telling your doc you have been taking anything. id do this first, you never know he could give ya somethin good.
10-29-2008, 08:58 PM
How? Just make an appointment and walk in saying, I'd like my hormone levels analyed? I have university healthcare, fwiw, they don't seem overeager to cater to (what they perceive to be) hypochondriacs.