Liver Damage???

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    Liver Damage???


    Does anyone really know how much liver damage Pro-Hormones can cause? I have seen products like Tri-bolic which is a combination of superdrol, halodrol, and phera max... from what i've heard the 3 Pro-Hormones that are hardest on your body. Is the damage comparable to excessive drinking for many years or what????

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    anything that is 17aa is gonna hurt, thats why the combos are the "worst" because most have 2 methylated products in them, so its double the damage..
    it depends on what support supps you are running
    and your own body type
    the only way to know for sure is to run the compounds yourself and have bloodwork pre and post cycle
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    Quote Originally Posted by smshannon001 View Post
    anything that is 17aa is gonna hurt, thats why the combos are the "worst" because most have 2 methylated products in them, so its double the damage..
    it depends on what support supps you are running
    and your own body type
    the only way to know for sure is to run the compounds yourself and have bloodwork pre and post cycle

    Combo's aren't necessarily worse. It depends on the dose of each compound. Ex: 50mg Halo and 10mg SD is probably less toxic than 30mg SD. It depends on the maker and the total Mg's per dose. THey can be harmfull - e.g., the ones giving you a full dose of all components - that's just nuts.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetta View Post
    Combo's aren't necessarily worse. It depends on the dose of each compound. Ex: 50mg Halo and 10mg SD is probably less toxic than 30mg SD. It depends on the maker and the total Mg's per dose. THey can be harmfull - e.g., the ones giving you a full dose of all components - that's just nuts.
    False.

    30mg is not 30mg.

    Each compound also has its own metabolites that have their own toxicity as well. So when taking one you may have multiple toxic metabolite. When taking three you may triple that amount.

    It is ill advised but the consumer is ultimately responsible for himself.
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    Liver damage can be very real if abused. You also have to count on other factors while you're on your oral(s). Alcohol, pain killers, muscle relaxers etc. Best bet is to have before/during/after bloodwork if possible. If not then you should keep your cycles short and don't run them back to back.
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    Quote Originally Posted by B5150 View Post
    False.

    30mg is not 30mg.

    Each compound also has its own metabolites that have their own toxicity as well. So when taking one you may have multiple toxic metabolite. When taking three you may triple that amount.

    It is ill advised but the consumer is ultimately responsible for himself.
    30 is not necessarily 30 but combos' toxicity isn't necessarily multiplied by the number of compounds. How you can make a claim like that seems odd. Do you have literature or a study to back that up? This isn't to challenge your integrity but if you do it should be posted as a sticky for anyone conteplating such a cycle.
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    Notice the use of 'may' meaning that when stacking methyls, you may possibly increase the toxicity or you may not. Depends on the compounds and not the dose. Also, integrity would assume he was lying about what he stated and knew it. Even if what he stated wasn't true, I don't think he's the type of person to mislead someone on purpose. However, he's correct.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayhawkk View Post
    Notice the use of 'may' meaning that when stacking methyls, you may possibly increase the toxicity or you may not. Depends on the compounds and not the dose. Also, integrity would assume he was lying about what he stated and knew it. Even if what he stated wasn't true, I don't think he's the type of person to mislead someone on purpose. However, he's correct.
    "Integrity" can be used in a number of different ways and, while it's reasonable for you to inferrr that is what I meant, it is not. As a matter of fact I do not think he way lying - intentionally or otherwise. I think I recall him stating that my earlier response was "false" but then offered an opinion that "may" or "may" not be true. I guess that kind of thing gets under my skin a little. I'm sure he's right that different metabolites are toxic for different reasons but I do think it's a stretch to disagree with my assertion that combo's are not necessarily 2/3/etc. X more toxic than a stand alone. That's all I'm saying. Also, I never said that I beleive 30mg=30mg. In fact, I think I said, at least suggested, the opposite - e.g., 50mg Halo+10 mg SD is probably less toxic than a straight 30mg HD.

    Either way: Topic aside, I'm sorry if I implied that you were lying 5150. That was not my intent.
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    The steroid itself is not what is toxic it is the metabolites. When you introduce three steroids you introduce three toxic metabolites. It is my understanding that the quantity of metabolites is not so much the issue but the variety of metabolites that may pose greater stress to the liver. It is sufficient enough information for me to chose more wisely.

    As far as lying goes; anyone that remotely knows me knows I would never lie to a complete stranger.

    I lie only to those I know and love; friends, family, people who trust me
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    Quote Originally Posted by B5150 View Post
    The steroid itself is not what is toxic it is the metabolites. When you introduce three steroids you introduce three toxic metabolites. It is my understanding that the quantity of metabolites is not so much the issue but the variety of metabolites that may pose greater stress to the liver. It is sufficient enough information for me to chose more wisely.

    As far as lying goes; anyone that remotely knows me knows I would never lie to a complete stranger.

    I lie only to those I know and love; friends, family, people who trust me
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    I hear you. I'll be the test case since I'm taking a cylce of Monster Caps as we speak - a fine blend of three active 17aa steroids.
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    Quote Originally Posted by B5150 View Post
    The steroid itself is not what is toxic it is the metabolites. When you introduce three steroids you introduce three toxic metabolites. It is my understanding that the quantity of metabolites is not so much the issue but the variety of metabolites that may pose greater stress to the liver. It is sufficient enough information for me to chose more wisely.

    As far as lying goes; anyone that remotely knows me knows I would never lie to a complete stranger.

    I lie only to those I know and love; friends, family, people who trust me
    Yes sir, i'm in complete agreement with this statment. I have an article explaining something of this nature. Let me see if i can dig it up.

    Now.........quit telling fibs b!

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