Brady Could be the greatest ever

[MaDmaN]

Brady Could be the greatest ever,people laughed years ago that Brady was better than Montana but if he wins in 2 weeks he will be the best ever IMO Thoughts...

 

[Big Dane]

He sucks.

 

[Nabisco]

You realize that you're stating he is the best quarterback ever, right off a 3 interception game in which he single handedly kept San Diego in that game? I think he's a pretty damn good quarterback, but people need to jump off this Golden Boy bandwagon and take a step back. Look at the weapons and defense he has surrounding him. That team is so GOOD that he can throw 3 interceptions and they still win.

Is he a great quarterback? Of course.

Has he been surrounded by almost unprecedented talent this year? You better believe it.

Let's give it another couple of years before we crown him king. Because if you recall, when he wasn't surrounded by excellent teams he failed to make the Super Bowl.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

I don't know how there is space for you AND Trauma1 in Brady's jock strap.

:twisted:

Just jokes Trauma, you know I love ya.

 

[Trauma1]

Let's give it another couple of years before we crown him king. Because if you recall, when he wasn't surrounded by excellent teams he failed to make the Super Bowl.

Yes the patriots are very good all around indeed. However, whether people want to believe it or not brady is the KEY cog that makes that team as great as they are. It all stems from strong leadership and motivation that filters down to the rest of the team. It's that powerful dynamic that turns good teams into great teams. While brady may not be "king" yet, if he wins his fourth superbowl in as many tries he'll be just about ready to sit upon that throne.


What the patriots have achieved in general since 2001 is remarkable to say the least. I think 4 superbowl apperances in 7 years says it all in fact. People can say what they will about brady......The guy produces on many different levels in the game to continually help his team win. It shows in his overall talent, leadership, motivation, charisma, attention to detail, and focus on a solid team work foundation. It's that unique quality about him in my mind that defines his greatness.

 

[Trauma1]

I don't know how there is space for you AND Trauma1 in Brady's jock strap.

:twisted:

Just jokes Trauma, you know I love ya.

I was wondering when you would show up in this thread haha :FUfinger:........

 

[Iron Warrior]

He's defintely the best of his era. IMO, the best ever would be Joe Montana. Brady's career isn't over yet so it's hard to say he's the best ever at this point. Montana has done things Brady hasn't done YET, Brady might be it whe it's all said and done but it's premature right now.

The NFL was more competitve in Montana's ear then in today's watered down NFL. Montana and the 49ers had to beat GREAT teams. He beat the famed Bears defense in championship games twice ('84 & '88). He beat the Doomsday Cowboys when they were the hottest thing in the NFL ('81). He outdueled Marino and the 14-2 Dolphins 38-16. He dismantled the top ranked Broncos defense 55-10 in '89. John Elway could not rescue the Broncos from this one LOL.

Montana had to deal with great teams since there was no salary cap or free agency until 1990 IIRC. He also had to get through Joe Gibbs' Redskins squad, that insanely talented Eagles defense, the LT Giants, da Bears, the rising Rams which were supposed to overtake the 49ers in the mid to late 80's. All these squads would have been AFC Super Bowl representative at one time if they were lucky enough to have been in that conference. That's another reason why Elway's Broncos and later on the Bills got the Super Bowl that many times. It was because they had weak competition.

His '88 49ers squad was 10-6, and seen as declining franchise who would be overmatched by the hungry, phyiscally superior, and rising Bengals but he led the 49ers on a true com from behind win in the last minute going 92 yards

Joe Montana kept Steve Young on the bench until he suffered a major elbow injury in 1990. People had been calling for Young to take over in 1988 because he was the younger and more athletically gifted of the two.

Joe Montana almost took the Chiefs to the Super Bowl in his late 30's with an aged Marcus Allen as his main offensive weapon. I think this truly shows how great he was since he had an average squad that was know for never getting past the wild-card round.

Joe Montana won 2 Super Bowls w/out Jerry Rice. His 1981 squad's leading rusher had 543 yards and a team high 3.6 yards per carry. He also won a Super Bowl without a 1,000 yard receiver in 1984. Dwight Clark was on the decline and there was no Jerry Rice at the time.

I think I could work for NFL films or edge NFL match-up

In reality, it's unfair to compare players from different eras. The game keeps evolving and the players have to adapt to their situation(s). Brady has to deal with more drastic roster changes on his team and other teams while Montana had to deal with some tougher opponents that got the lion's share of success in the 80's.

 

[Trauma1]

He's defintely the best of his era. IMO, the best ever would be Joe Montana. Brady's career isn't over yet so it's hard to say he's the best ever at this point. Montana has done things Brady hasn't done YET, Brady might be it whe it's all said and done but it's premature right now.

The NFL was more competitve in Montana's ear then in today's watered down NFL. Montana and the 49ers had to beat GREAT teams. He beat the famed Bears defense in championship games twice ('84 & '88). He beat the Doomsday Cowboys when they were the hottest thing in the NFL ('81). He outdueled Marino and the 14-2 Dolphins 38-16. He dismantled the top ranked Broncos defense 55-10 in '89. John Elway could not rescue the Broncos from this one LOL.

Montana had to deal with great teams since there was no salary cap or free agency until 1990 IIRC. He also had to get through Joe Gibbs' Redskins squad, that insanely talented Eagles defense, the LT Giants, da Bears.

His '88 49ers squad was 10-6, and seen as declining franchise who would be overmatched by the hungry, phyiscally superior, and rising Bengals but he led the 49ers on a true com from behind win in the last minute going 92 yards

Joe Montana kept Steve Young on the bench until he suffered a major elbow injury in 1990. People had been calling for Young to take over in 1988 because he was the younger and more athletically gifted of the two.

Joe Montana almost took the Chiefs to the Super Bowl in his late 30's with an aged Marcus Allen as his main offensive weapon. I think this truly shows how great he was since he had an average squad that was know for never getting past the wild-card round.

Joe Montana won 2 Super Bowls w/out Jerry Rice. His 1981 squad's leading rusher had 543 yards and a team high 3.6 yards per carry. He also won a Super Bowl without a 1,000 yard receiver in 1984. Dwight Clark was on the decline and there was no Jerry Rice at the time.

I think I could work for NFL films or edge NFL match-up

Lol, I believe you could. Nice post iron! :thumbsup:

 

[Fastone]

Most successful, possibly but best ever? I don't know about that. I would say that Terry Bradshaw would have a say in this discussion.

:bruce3:

 

[Iron Warrior]

Lol, I believe you could. Nice post iron! :thumbsup:

I try, but I am somwhat biased towards Montana Joe may have not been the best ever but he was the best during his reign. I know there a some who say Elway was the better of the 2 but this is not true and I can provide plenty of data if someone wants to be open minded about it

People who say Montana was lucky to have Jerry Rice just don't realize that Rice spent more time with Steve Young then Joe Montana. I like Young but if that was the case the Young would have won more then 1 Super Bowl. I also think Young is better then Elway and Montana was good enough to keep him on the bench for years.

 

[Iron Warrior]

Most successful, possibly but best ever? I don't know about that. I would say that Terry Bradshaw would have a say in this discussion.

:bruce3:

Bradshaw's stats aren't impressive but the man was a great big game performer. Great players aren't always great, they're just great when they have to be The guy's a decent entertainer too LOL.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

I was wondering when you would show up in this thread haha :FUfinger:........

I'm not even going to offer an opinion, but for different reasons than you may assume. I find, more than any other professional league, opinions on certain players in the NFL are incredibly fickle. People were so brash as to proclaim AP as the up-and-coming greatest RB ever earlier this season, now, for ostensible reasons, the hype surrounding him has somewhat died down (for the record I think he is unreal, just demonstrating how opinions flare and then wain).

When Peyton set the record (which Brady broke) he was inarguably (so pundits would say) the most gifted, and statistically endowed QB of his generation; a veritable 'student-of-the-game' who could single-handedly disseminate a secondary pre-snap. Now, a few years later, Brady has all but unseated him as the 'fantasy-league king' with his play.

I suppose my point is that hindsight is 20/20, and with the average career of the NFL'er being so short, coupled with the parody created by the salary-cap era, it is easy to get excited before true patterns emerge. Brady has led his team to 'the Bowl' with clutch performances in the playoffs, but until this point was not seen as the Marino-Peyton type of statistical QB. If the game-winning performances of the Pats in recent years are what primarily characterize Brady as a great QB, then some of that misplaced acclaim should fall on A-Vin. :twisted:

I think Iron's post also demonstrated, maybe, the difference between a good QB on great teams, and the greatest QB on good teams. I think this goes double for Bellichek.

 

[VolcomX311]

He's defintely the best of his era. IMO, the best ever would be Joe Montana. Brady's career isn't over yet so it's hard to say he's the best ever at this point. Montana has done things Brady hasn't done YET, Brady might be it whe it's all said and done but it's premature right now.

The NFL was more competitve in Montana's ear then in today's watered down NFL. Montana and the 49ers had to beat GREAT teams. He beat the famed Bears defense in championship games twice ('84 & '88). He beat the Doomsday Cowboys when they were the hottest thing in the NFL ('81). He outdueled Marino and the 14-2 Dolphins 38-16. He dismantled the top ranked Broncos defense 55-10 in '89. John Elway could not rescue the Broncos from this one LOL.

Montana had to deal with great teams since there was no salary cap or free agency until 1990 IIRC. He also had to get through Joe Gibbs' Redskins squad, that insanely talented Eagles defense, the LT Giants, da Bears, the rising Rams which were supposed to overtake the 49ers in the mid to late 80's. All these squads would have been AFC Super Bowl representative at one time if they were lucky enough to have been in that conference. That's another reason why Elway's Broncos and later on the Bills got the Super Bowl that many times. It was because they had weak competition.

His '88 49ers squad was 10-6, and seen as declining franchise who would be overmatched by the hungry, phyiscally superior, and rising Bengals but he led the 49ers on a true com from behind win in the last minute going 92 yards

Joe Montana kept Steve Young on the bench until he suffered a major elbow injury in 1990. People had been calling for Young to take over in 1988 because he was the younger and more athletically gifted of the two.

Joe Montana almost took the Chiefs to the Super Bowl in his late 30's with an aged Marcus Allen as his main offensive weapon. I think this truly shows how great he was since he had an average squad that was know for never getting past the wild-card round.

Joe Montana won 2 Super Bowls w/out Jerry Rice. His 1981 squad's leading rusher had 543 yards and a team high 3.6 yards per carry. He also won a Super Bowl without a 1,000 yard receiver in 1984. Dwight Clark was on the decline and there was no Jerry Rice at the time.

I think I could work for NFL films or edge NFL match-up

In reality, it's unfair to compare players from different eras. The game keeps evolving and the players have to adapt to their situation(s). Brady has to deal with more drastic roster changes on his team and other teams while Montana had to deal with some tougher opponents that got the lion's share of success in the 80's.

:goodpost:

 

[Iron Warrior]

He sucks.

Great 10th post man LOL. I hope you're being sarcastic

 

[Iron Warrior]

I'm not even going to offer an opinion, but for different reasons than you may assume. I find, more than any other professional league, opinions on certain players in the NFL are incredibly fickle. People were so brash as to proclaim AP as the up-and-coming greatest RB ever earlier this season, now, for ostensible reasons, the hype surrounding him has somewhat died down (for the record I think he is unreal, just demonstrating how opinions flare and then wain).

When Peyton set the record (which Brady broke) he was inarguably (so pundits would say) the most gifted, and statistically endowed QB of his generation; a veritable 'student-of-the-game' who could single-handedly disseminate a secondary pre-snap. Now, a few years later, Brady has all but unseated him as the 'fantasy-league king' with his play.

I suppose my point is that hindsight is 20/20, and with the average career of the NFL'er being so short, coupled with the parody created by the salary-cap era, it is easy to get excited before true patterns emerge. Brady has led his team to 'the Bowl' with clutch performances in the playoffs, but until this point was not seen as the Marino-Peyton type of statistical QB. If the game-winning performances of the Pats in recent years are what primarily characterize Brady as a great QB, then some of that misplaced acclaim should fall on A-Vin. :twisted:

I think Iron's post also demonstrated, maybe, the difference between a good QB on great teams, and the greatest QB on good teams. I think this goes double for Bellichek.

You brought up a great point about stats that I almost forgot ! Some sports might not have inflated stats but football certainly does when it comes to QB's. There are tons of QB's that can throw for 4,000 yards each year and throw 25-30 TD's a year. This is occasionally the byproduct of playing on teams that lose a lot and have to throw a ton to stay competitive in most games.

Vinny Testaverde and Boomer Esiason are good examples. They were solid players but they have stats that are more impressive the Aikman, Montana, Bradshaw, and Brady but when they needed to win a big game they caved under pressure. That's why I'll respect a guy like Bradshaw or Aikman who I keep hearing are over-rated by many idiots.

Marino was amazing but some of his stats were due to the fact that he had no running game or reliable defense for a great part of his career. The man had to throw a ton to keep his team competitive but he simply could not elevate his team to the next level. Please don't assume I'm saying he's over-rated, I'm just saying his passing stats would not be the same if he played on a successful team.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

This is why I love Hockey - consistency. Guys grind in the NHL for 20+ years and cement their legacy.

 

[Big Dane]

Great 10th post man LOL. I hope you're being sarcastic

No, he is actually pretty good. One of the best, not yet. I would take Montana, Marino, Elway, Aikman, Bradshaw, or Favre before I would even consider Brady for my QB. The entire Patriots team is great, and the team record is great. Brady individually is very good, not one of the greatest (yet).

 

[Dagron]

I don't know that he sucks, he is undeniably great and debatably the best in the league the past few years, but the great-EST? Gimme a break. He needs to show some individual "OMG DID YOU SEE THAT?!?!?" sort of plays before he will ever be in the same league as Elway, Favre and Montana. Those guys have done that every single week of their careers, all I have seen from Brady this year is shuffling around in the pocket for 8 seconds then casually dumping the ball to one of his weapons.

 

[Dwight Schrute]

If Brady wins this one, he's tied with Montana for best all-time IMO.

 

[SureShot]

Everyone does realize that Brady through 50 touchdowns and only 8 interceptions this year right? Pointing out that he threw 3 INTs in the Chargers game does not even matter, the Pats still finish the game and not once does a football fan even think that Brady is going to melt under pressure. The man has 3 super bowl rings. He does not crack under pressure or self destruct (see Brett Favre and is pension for throwing like 8 INTs in a game once in a while.) He does not care about stats, he cares about wins. He is consistently great, does not complain, does not make excuses, and he adapts to whatever the defense throws at him. Hell, he made WES WELKER the #1 receiver in the NFL this year. He can go entire games without even having to look Moss' way. He did all this for an entire season while having virtually no running game (Maroney's 1st TD of the year came in week 11). As far as I am concerned Montana and Brady are tied for that top spot.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Everyone does realize that Brady through 50 touchdowns and only 8 interceptions this year right? Pointing out that he threw 3 INTs in the Chargers game does not even matter, the Pats still finish the game and not once does a football fan even think that Brady is going to melt under pressure. The man has 3 super bowl rings. He does not crack under pressure or self destruct (see Brett Favre and is pension for throwing like 8 INTs in a game once in a while.) He does not care about stats, he cares about wins. He is consistently great, does not complain, does not make excuses, and he adapts to whatever the defense throws at him. Hell, he made WES WELKER the #1 receiver in the NFL this year. He can go entire games without even having to look Moss' way. He did all this for an entire season while having virtually no running game (Maroney's 1st TD of the year came in week 11). As far as I am concerned Montana and Brady are tied for that top spot.

I think you touched on a few points that a few of us were attempting to make, just from a different perspective. Tom Brady didn't make Wes Welker the #1 receiver, the Patriots Offense did. Do you think that if you took T. Brady and Welker off that team and interjected them into the Dolphins O they would have the years they did? They wouldn't, because the Patriots as a whole were greater than the sum of their parts. Their Wide-Out core was almost impossible to stop; double team Moss? Great, Welker is there for quick post routes for a first down. Shallow coverage for him? Cool, Stallworth and Moss are there. Point is, Tom Brady didn't single handedly do any of that.

And the fact he threw 3INTs proves the above point, that being the team and not necessarily the man are arguably the best ever (pending next weekend's victory of course). They can win with Moss making one reception and Brady throwing 3INTs. Rex Grossman could have had a stellar Offensive year on this team.

 

[SureShot]

I think you touched on a few points that a few of us were attempting to make, just from a different perspective. Tom Brady didn't make Wes Welker the #1 receiver, the Patriots Offense did. Do you think that if you took T. Brady and Welker off that team and interjected them into the Dolphins O they would have the years they did? They wouldn't, because the Patriots as a whole were greater than the sum of their parts. Their Wide-Out core was almost impossible to stop; double team Moss? Great, Welker is there for quick post routes for a first down. Shallow coverage for him? Cool, Stallworth and Moss are there. Point is, Tom Brady didn't single handedly do any of that.

And the fact he threw 3INTs proves the above point, that being the team and not necessarily the man are arguably the best ever (pending next weekend's victory of course). They can win with Moss making one reception and Brady throwing 3INTs. Rex Grossman could have had a stellar Offensive year on this team.

Point taken, but Rex Grossman!?! My grandmother has a better arm than him!:cheers:

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Exactly. :lol:

That might be an exaggeration, but you get the point!

 

[Dwight Schrute]

Everyone does realize that Brady through 50 touchdowns and only 8 interceptions this year right?

I don't think they do and my team lost a Superbowl to them so I"m not a fan either.

 

[Fastone]

Bradshaw's stats aren't impressive but the man was a great big game performer. Great players aren't always great, they're just great when they have to be The guy's a decent entertainer too LOL.

This is why "Best Ever" discussions imo are ridiculous. Dan Marino's stats are awesome but he never won anything. I can't hate on Montana though, cause he was the prototype of an era. I would also bring up Jim Kelly. The Bills are looked at as losers because they lost 4 Super Bowls in a row. The in a row thing is what I think makes JK special, no one else has done that.

:bruce3:

 

[MaDmaN]

Great discussion,Brady is the fastest to 100 wins he did it in 20 less games than Montana.



Career bests
Highest single-game quarterback rating: 158.3 (at Miami, October 21, 2007)
Highest single-season quarterback rating: 117.2 (2007)
Highest total passing touchdowns in a game: 6 (at Miami, October 21, 2007)
Highest total passing touchdowns in a regular season: 50 (2007)
Lowest interception total, season (minimum 2 starts): 8 (2007)
Largest touchdown to interception difference: +42 (2007)

21-game win streak statistics (including post-season)
690 passes attempted
412 passes completed
4,953 passing yards
34 passing touchdowns
13 passes intercepted
20.29 passing attempts per touchdown
53.07 passing attempts per interception
59.71 completion rate
90.3 passer rating

Career (as of January 20, 2008)
86-24 (regular season), 100-26 (career) as a starter
18.87 passing attempts per touchdown (career)
42.74 passing attempts per interception (career)
7-0 (career) in overtime games
30-5 (career) in games decided by 3 points or fewer
11-1 (career) in dome stadiums
38-2 (career) on artificial surfaces
27-4 (career) vs NFC teams
84-1 (regular season) when the Patriots have a lead at any time in the fourth quarter[32]
28 game-winning drives after a Patriots' fourth-quarter tie or deficit

Post-season records and statistics
NFL record for most consecutive wins in post season: 10 (broke record of Green Bay's Bart Starr).
Most consecutive post season wins (college and professional combined): 12
3 Super Bowl victories
2 Super Bowl MVP awards
Most completions in a Super Bowl (32 in Super Bowl XXXVIII)
Highest completion percentage in a single game, minimum 20 attempts (26 of 28, 92.9%, against Jacksonville in 2007 AFC Divisional round)[33

 

[rugger48]

Couple of things, brady won 3 other superbowl with basically no star wrs. Anybody tell me how Brown,branch, and givens are fairing with the rest of their NFL careers. 2nd 2 of those superbowl were basically without a consistent rb.


Its simple

The patriots without moss dont go undefeated

The patriots without brady dont win 10 games

The patriot without their current offensive line wouldnt be a
.500 ball club.


and no you cant just play musical qbs and plug any qb in to that offense and say they are just as succesful, brady fits that team to a tee. people forget brady wasnt drafted to be a starter the guy won the job and kept it from what some say was a probowl qb.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Couple of things, brady won 3 other superbowl with basically no star wrs. Anybody tell me how Brown,branch, and givens are fairing with the rest of their NFL careers. 2nd 2 of those superbowl were basically without a consistent rb.


Its simple

The patriots without moss dont go undefeated

The patriots without brady dont win 10 games

The patriot without their current offensive line wouldnt be a
.500 ball club.


and no you cant just play musical qbs and plug any qb in to that offense and say they are just as succesful, brady fits that team to a tee. people forget brady wasnt drafted to be a starter the guy won the job and kept it from what some say was a probowl qb.

I disagree completely. Brady is a perfect fit for that offense because of his accurate, game-control style. You could not 'plug and play', but my above point was that he is not the sole reason for their success, no player is. Conversely, I was making the point that another QB could have success in that offense pending his ability to play within that system.

 

[rugger48]

I disagree completely. Brady is a perfect fit for that offense because of his accurate, game-control style. You could not 'plug and play', but my above point was that he is not the sole reason for their success, no player is. Conversely, I was making the point that another QB could have success in that offense pending his ability to play within that system.

Isnt that what i just said.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

No, it wasn't. You stated that without Brady that team does not achieve 10 wins, implying another QB could not assist them to win 10 games. I said I disagree.

 

[rugger48]

No, it wasn't. You stated that without Brady that team does not achieve 10 wins, implying another QB could not assist them to win 10 games. I said I disagree.

I didnt imply that at all, their are some qbs that they would win 10 games with this year, but previous ones I disagree. I dont think they win 3 superbowls without him.

 

[AE14]

it is still too early in his career to be the "greatest"

 

[Mulletsoldier]

I didnt imply that at all, their are some qbs that they would win 10 games with this year, but previous ones I disagree. I dont think they win 3 superbowls without him.

Are you sure?

The patriots without brady dont win 10 games

 

[Trauma1]

Are you sure?

Honestly i agree with him mullet. Yes the pats have a very good team in general that are effective in all aspects of the game, however the dynamic that brady adds to the team is quite remarkable and unique. I agree many qb's would be effective in their offensive set, but qb's like brady and manning have unique characteristics to them that define their teams success. I honestly don't believe that New England would have won 3 superbowls without him. They may have done well, but he makes them that much better in the end.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Oh no, he definitely pioneered those wins, and was a very large aspect of them; I was only disagreeing with the 10 win comment, and the 'Are you sure?' was directed at rugger saying he did not imply that.

 

[Iron Warrior]

it is still too early in his career to be the "greatest"

Thank you for seeing it this way. Brady has another 5-6 good years if he stays relatively healthy. He's a South Bay Area guy so I secretely root for him as well as Jeff Garcia and Trent Edwards. He may win another 2-3 Super Bowls or he may not win another one after this year. The NFL is unpredictable these days so let's all be patient and bump this thread 5-6 years from now

Brady not put up Play Station stats, 50TD's to 8 INT's. That's 6.25 TD's per INT, an unheard of ratio.

A few mentioned that Brady hasn't had any stellar moments like Montana, Elway, or Favre. What about the Super Bowl upset against the Rams ? What about the come from behind win agaisnt the Raiders in the tuck rule game ? He still had to make many plays to bring the Pats back against the Raiders.

Brady did throw 3INT's vs. San Diego but that's an hiccup, he's too damn good to the same thing again.

Someone mentioned that the Pats wouldn't be a 10 game winner w/out him. Let's be realistic though, take away Manning out of the Colts, Romo out of the Cowboys, Roethlisberger out of the Steelers and suddenly you have an average squad because this is the most crucial position in the NFL, that's why they make tons of ca$h.

One thing I would like to see is Brady leading another team to a Super Bowl win or strong Super Bowl run at the end of his career. I think this is what shows Montana's true greatness since he led the Chiefs to the AFC title game. His main offensive threat was an old Marcus Allen. He did this after he had suffered what was considered 2 career ending injuries, one in 1986 and the other in 1990, both against the freaking Giants !

 

[Trauma1]

Oh no, he definitely pioneered those wins, and was a very large aspect of them; I was only disagreeing with the 10 win comment, and the 'Are you sure?' was directed at rugger saying he did not imply that.

Oh.....my bad

 

[Dwight Schrute]

it is still too early in his career to be the "greatest"

Not if he ties and/or beats those who are deemed the greatest in terms of stats (on a yearly basis, not career) and Superbowl wins.

 

[The_Reverend]

Let's spread some of the credit to his O-line. Those guys give him just ridiculous amounts of time in the pocket. Any NFL QB would be good with that much time.

 

[Dwight Schrute]

Let's spread some of the credit to his O-line. Those guys give him just ridiculous amounts of time in the pocket. Any NFL QB would be good with that much time.

Every great QB had a great O line. Its ALL relative. In fact, if I look at the Colts line (when Manning broke the record) and Montana's great years, I think they had MORE offensive talent then New England has now.

 

[Iron Warrior]

Let's spread some of the credit to his O-line. Those guys give him just ridiculous amounts of time in the pocket. Any NFL QB would be good with that much time.

True, but he's very decisive and has great footwork in the pocket. Those little things can be the difference between getting sacked or completing a clutch 3rd & long pass

 

[Iron Warrior]

Every great QB had a great O line. Its ALL relative. In fact, if I look at the Colts line (when Manning broke the record) and Montana's great years, I think they had MORE offensive talent then New England has now.

The 1989 49ers squad was loaded ! The difference was that Roger Craig and Tom Rathman were lethal receiving threats out of the backfield. Faulk is good but Craig led the 49ers receiving during the Jerry Rice era. Craig also had 1,000+ yards receiving and 1,500+ rushing in one season, not bad for a guy who was started his career as a fullback.

 

[The_Reverend]

Every great QB had a great O line. Its ALL relative. In fact, if I look at the Colts line (when Manning broke the record) and Montana's great years, I think they had MORE offensive talent then New England has now.

You make a valid point, but I'm not sure you can say Manning's/Montana's lines were better than Brady's.

 

[The_Reverend]

True, but he's very decisive and has great footwork in the pocket. Those little things can be the difference between getting sacked or completing a clutch 3rd & long pass

He's very calculated and cool.

 

[Dwight Schrute]

You make a valid point, but I'm not sure you can say Manning's/Montana's lines were better than Brady's.

Sure I can. I watched them all.

Sacks allowed this year.

New England 18 games 24 total

Indy 17 games 23 allowed.


Both were beat by Saints, Bengals, Packers and Browns.


Colts led the league in 2005 and 2006

 

[The_Reverend]

Sure I can. I watched them all.

Sacks allowed this year.

New England 18 games 24 total

Indy 17 games 23 allowed.


Both were beat by Saints, Bengals, Packers and Browns.


Colts led the league in 2005 and 2006

Sacks don't tell the whole story. Factors such as elusiveness, how long a QB holds onto the ball, etc play a part as well. Manning gets rid of the ball much quicker than Brady.

 

[Trauma1]

Manning gets rid of the ball much quicker than Brady.

Maybe that's true, but in doing so manning also made more mistakes than brady in the end of the year. All in all the results and performances speak for themselves......brady is playing in the superbowl yet again, and manning will be at home watching it on tv again. You could go round and round all day long with the "Who's the better quarterback arguement." This year there's really no question about who it was. I'll completely agree to the fact that brady isn't the best QB ever "yet", but he's well on his way of accomplishing that feat if his progress and accomplishments continue.

If the pats win this superbowl convincingly and complete the perfect season, they'll be no doubt in my mind he's one of the best to ever play the position. It's really amazing the similarities montana and brady have in their overall play, leadership and demeanor.

 

[VolcomX311]

Maybe that's true, but in doing so manning also made more mistakes than brady in the end of the year. All in all the results and performances speak for themselves......brady is playing in the superbowl yet again, and manning will be at home watching it on tv again. You could go round and round all day long with the "Who's the better quarterback arguement." This year there's really no question about who it was. I'll completely agree to the fact that brady isn't the best QB ever "yet", but he's well on his way of accomplishing that feat if his progress and accomplishments continue.

If the pats win this superbowl convincingly and complete the perfect season, they'll be no doubt in my mind he's one of the best to ever play the position. It's really amazing the similarities montana and brady have in their overall play, leadership and demeanor.

As much as I hate the Pats, you have a strong argument if we want to talk bottom line.

I don't see the Pats losing the superbowl, they're too damn efficient and confident this year... Oi!!

It's going to doubly annoy me when they achieve that perfect record too... [deep sigh]

 

[Dwight Schrute]

Sacks don't tell the whole story. Factors such as elusiveness, how long a QB holds onto the ball, etc play a part as well. Manning gets rid of the ball much quicker than Brady.

If he gets the ball off quicker then it should benefit his stats and performance more so than Brady. It didn't... which sort of proves the point even more.

 

[The_Reverend]

Maybe that's true, but in doing so manning also made more mistakes than brady in the end of the year. All in all the results and performances speak for themselves......brady is playing in the superbowl yet again, and manning will be at home watching it on tv again. You could go round and round all day long with the "Who's the better quarterback arguement." This year there's really no question about who it was. I'll completely agree to the fact that brady isn't the best QB ever "yet", but he's well on his way of accomplishing that feat if his progress and accomplishments continue.

If the pats win this superbowl convincingly and complete the perfect season, they'll be no doubt in my mind he's one of the best to ever play the position. It's really amazing the similarities montana and brady have in their overall play, leadership and demeanor.

Where did all that come from? I wasn't arguing which QB is better.