Who are your 3 most OVER-RATED QB'S in the NFL?

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by MaDmaN View Post
    Farve overated give me a break..
    Rogers did put up nice numbers when they needed him to come in, not to mention he lookd smooth also. Kitna had better numbers than Favre did last year.....KITNA...
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  2. Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    Regardless of draft status, Brady stands tall in the pocket. He releases high and anticipates where his recievers are going to be very well. His eyes are also downfield during the center exchange and during his dropback. The only other current QB that I see doing that on a regular basis in Peyton.

    If you watch brady hes making the same type of throws that you said Ben was making this year. Brady has thrown quite a few long balls short the difference has been Moss has been reeling them in. Im not saying brady is playing badly and definitly deserves the recognition, but if your gonna criticize big ben for making some off throws lets spread the love.
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  3. As long as were talking about chuckin it up there dont forget about the king of just chucking it up there, Brett Favre
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  4. Quote Originally Posted by rugger48 View Post
    If you watch brady hes making the same type of throws that you said Ben was making this year. Brady has thrown quite a few long balls short the difference has been Moss has been reeling them in. Im not saying brady is playing badly and definitly deserves the recognition, but if your gonna criticize big ben for making some off throws lets spread the love.
    I hear ya... Ben would be great if he had a tree for a reciever downfield. Problem is, our recievers are about 6 inches shorter, which again, makes it a less intelligent decision to "chuck." I'm not rooting for Brady or his bunch, just trying to be objective.

    To give credit where credit is due, Ben has thrown into coverage significantly less than he did last year. He still throws a garbage deep ball so I'll maintain my position on that note.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by rugger48 View Post
    I also disagree about Big Ben. Feel free to name any qb that has the stats he has that has been sacked 43 times. Problem with the steelers is they are overated as a team, oline even more so.


    Whoever said TJackson is underated is nuts, only thing keeping Minny back from a superbowl appearance is a coach and a qb, jackson is really bad.
    I disagree about Jackson entirely. He has a high skill set for a young kid. He is learning and will be a very good QB IMHO. Regarding the coach I agree 100%, Childress is an OC and always will be

  6. Quote Originally Posted by Distilled Water View Post
    Favre had a few good years (MVP years) but other than that I think he's the most overated QB ever. I'll give you he's one tough mofo and has an absolute cannon but has to make some of THE WORST decisions ever.

    I think Romo is a little over rated and not worth his new contract.

    Then McNabb and McNair. Are they always hurt or does it just seem that way.
    I disagree about Favre. He is overrated in the same way Emmitt Smith would be, they are compilers and tough performers.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    I disagree about Favre. He is overrated in the same way Emmitt Smith would be, they are compilers and tough performers.
    Emmit SMith ran behind human trees for 8 years in dallas. I could have ran for 10,000 yards with that line. He doesn't even compare to Payton, Brown, or Sanders.
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  8. Quote Originally Posted by Distilled Water View Post
    Rogers did put up nice numbers when they needed him to come in, not to mention he lookd smooth also. Kitna had better numbers than Favre did last year.....KITNA...
    Yeah I gotta admit... I liked that kid.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    I disagree about Jackson entirely. He has a high skill set for a young kid. He is learning and will be a very good QB IMHO. Regarding the coach I agree 100%, Childress is an OC and always will be
    C'mon are you watching the same guy I am? the guy is not an NFL caliber qb the Vikings could be a real threat to the Cowboys and Packers with an actual qb. Childress would be a genius if he had Peyton Manning at qb, it's funny how that works.

    OVER-RATED
    1) Tony Romo - I need to see him perform at a high level for more than part of a season before I anoint him like everyone else has.
    2)Eli Manning - same assessment as with Jackson, at least Jackson wasn't first pick overall.
    3) Tom Brady - not really but I hate him so much I had to put him on my list.

  10. LOL Romo will be in the league 5 years and people will still be saying that. He's played half of last year and three quarters of this year
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  11. Quote Originally Posted by BULLDOG View Post
    OVERRATED
    McNabb
    Brady(offensive line is the key)
    Favre(Rodgers can do just as good)
    UNDERRATED
    Romo (see last post)
    Kitna
    Brady overrated?.....my god i seriously hope you're kidding here.

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  12. Quote Originally Posted by BUCKNUTS View Post
    C'mon are you watching the same guy I am? the guy is not an NFL caliber qb the Vikings could be a real threat to the Cowboys and Packers with an actual qb. Childress would be a genius if he had Peyton Manning at qb, it's funny how that works.
    are you kidding? he has progressed at a rapid rate and has shwon tremendous improvement. I am not saying he is top 10, but he is getting better every week and as a young kid is keeping his team out there without making too many mistakes

  13. Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    are you kidding? he has progressed at a rapid rate and has shwon tremendous improvement. I am not saying he is top 10, but he is getting better every week and as a young kid is keeping his team out there without making too many mistakes
    Thats huge. Too many QB's try to make plays when their teams need big plays instead of maneging the game and handing the ball off to a stud RB (Adrian Peterson).

    I, at one time, thought that about Kitna "he wont win you any games, but he wont lose them either" but he's slowy loseing it. I think their OC deserves more of the blame. If they get down by 7 at any point early or late all he wants to do is throw
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  14. Quote Originally Posted by Distilled Water View Post
    Thats huge. Too many QB's try to make plays when their teams need big plays instead of maneging the game and handing the ball off to a stud RB (Adrian Peterson).

    I, at one time, thought that about Kitna "he wont win you any games, but he wont lose them either" but he's slowy loseing it. I think their OC deserves more of the blame. If they get down by 7 at any point early or late all he wants to do is throw
    I agree philosophically with everything you say here. There's too many OC's that kill successful drives trying to get fancy.

    Distilled, I rarely get to watch Detroit in the Pittsburgh region but I definately can follow your logic with Kitna. The Steelers used to have a guy named Mike Tomczak that fit a similar description.

  15. Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    I agree philosophically with everything you say here. There's too many OC's that kill successful drives trying to get fancy.

    Distilled, I rarely get to watch Detroit in the Pittsburgh region but I definately can follow your logic with Kitna. The Steelers used to have a guy named Mike Tomczak that fit a similar description.
    In all lions win's they're balanced almost 50/50. They have 3 1,000 yard rushers ( at one point, Duckett had close to 800 not 1,000 but would have without VIck and Dunn).

    Back on topic. I think Big Ben is legit (steelers ) I think he's the same kinda QB. He's having to learn to play without another intangeable WR in Randell El and the leadership lost in Bettis, not to mention all the stuff he's been thru since he's came into the league. Not to mention, from what i've watched, Willie Parker isn't a real consistant runner IMO
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  16. Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    are you kidding? he has progressed at a rapid rate and has shwon tremendous improvement. I am not saying he is top 10, but he is getting better every week and as a young kid is keeping his team out there without making too many mistakes

    he had 3 ints and a fumble monday night, and has 6 tds 10 ints in 12 games. He has probably 1 of the best 3 olines in football on top of that.

  17. Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    I agree philosophically with everything you say here. There's too many OC's that kill successful drives trying to get fancy.

    Distilled, I rarely get to watch Detroit in the Pittsburgh region but I definately can follow your logic with Kitna. The Steelers used to have a guy named Mike Tomczak that fit a similar description.
    All right, Celc, now I'm mad. You want to tell me how your boy Ben deserves the Pro Bowl over Garrard? Or even Derek Anderson? I don't get it. Stats are close, I suppose, but to your original point, Big Ben has been shaky lately, where Garrard has been great and Anderson has been solid too.

    The other one I don't get is Tony Gonzalez over Kellen Winslow Jr. Again, similar stats. But the Chiefs suck and I always think when stats are similar that the guy who is contributing to the better team should get the nod. Maybe that's just me.

  18. Quote Originally Posted by EctoPower View Post
    All right, Celc, now I'm mad. You want to tell me how your boy Ben deserves the Pro Bowl over Garrard? Or even Derek Anderson? I don't get it. Stats are close, I suppose, but to your original point, Big Ben has been shaky lately, where Garrard has been great and Anderson has been solid too.
    Ben saved the day on a Monday night against Baltimore. So a large portion of the voters' opinions will be skewed based on that performance. He's also a likable guy from a novice fan's prospective so he wins the popularity contest.

    I was discussing Ben's status over a few drinks with my buddies the other night. I picked 7 QBs that I would rather have over Ben and 5 others that I picked as equals (according to this season only, to clarify). So, he wouldn't have made the pro bowl if my vote was the deciding the factor.

    I've only watched Gerrard 2 or 3 times this season. He threw about 5 or 6 balls that our D-backs and LBs dropped against the Steelers. I was unimpressed based on that particular game only. On a side note, I was VERY impressed with how Jones-Drew attacked our blitzers on 3rd down throughout the whole game.

  19. Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    Ben saved the day on a Monday night against Baltimore. So a large portion of the voters' opinions will be skewed based on that performance. He's also a likable guy from a novice fan's prospective so he wins the popularity contest.

    I was discussing Ben's status over a few drinks with my buddies the other night. I picked 7 QBs that I would rather have over Ben and 5 others that I picked as equals (according to this season only, to clarify). So, he wouldn't have made the pro bowl if my vote was the deciding the factor.

    I've only watched Gerrard 2 or 3 times this season. He threw about 5 or 6 balls that our D-backs and LBs dropped against the Steelers. I was unimpressed based on that particular game only. On a side note, I was VERY impressed with how Jones-Drew attacked our blitzers on 3rd down throughout the whole game.
    Yeah, for a little guy, MJD packs a hell of a punch. Just ask Shawne Merriman! Or better yet, ask YouTube (quick, before the NFL pulls it again):

    YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

  20. Quote Originally Posted by EctoPower View Post
    All right, Celc, now I'm mad. You want to tell me how your boy Ben deserves the Pro Bowl over Garrard? Or even Derek Anderson? I don't get it. Stats are close, I suppose, but to your original point, Big Ben has been shaky lately, where Garrard has been great and Anderson has been solid too.

    The other one I don't get is Tony Gonzalez over Kellen Winslow Jr. Again, similar stats. But the Chiefs suck and I always think when stats are similar that the guy who is contributing to the better team should get the nod. Maybe that's just me.

    Gerrard has only 16 tds on the year

    anderson has 56 comp. percentage over the same schedule.

  21. Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    Ben saved the day on a Monday night against Baltimore. So a large portion of the voters' opinions will be skewed based on that performance. He's also a likable guy from a novice fan's prospective so he wins the popularity contest.

    I was discussing Ben's status over a few drinks with my buddies the other night. I picked 7 QBs that I would rather have over Ben and 5 others that I picked as equals (according to this season only, to clarify). So, he wouldn't have made the pro bowl if my vote was the deciding the factor.

    I've only watched Gerrard 2 or 3 times this season. He threw about 5 or 6 balls that our D-backs and LBs dropped against the Steelers. I was unimpressed based on that particular game only. On a side note, I was VERY impressed with how Jones-Drew attacked our blitzers on 3rd down throughout the whole game.

    Their is absolutly no way their are 7 qbs out their i would rather have than Roethlisberger. I like to see this list.


    I think you are blaming way to much of whats is going wrong on him. Their are really only about 2-3 qbs that are playing better than him in the nfl. Anybody feel free to name a QB who has been sacked more than Big Ben and even has close to his numbers. Were talking about a qb that has 65 comp. percentage 32td and 11 ints all while being sacked 47 times.


    just so we get an idea

    brady has been sacked 20 times
    gerrad 20
    romo 23
    favre 14
    garcia 17
    manning 20
    brees 12

    these are the top 7 qbs in the nfl besides big ben, roethlisberger has 47 and is currently playing better than or eqaul to all these guys except brady.
    Last edited by rugger48; 12-22-2007 at 07:28 PM.

  22. That's a pretty nice list dude. I can't remember exactly who I picked but I bet it was very similar to your list.

    Of course, all of the guys on your list make quick reads and are very decisive with their decision making. Ben does neither.

    This is why Ben is an overrated QB:

    1) After his plant, he takes his first step sideways whether there is a pass rush or not. I'd say that side step accounts for 60 or 70% of his sack numbers. On the rare occasion when Ben steps up (as the QBs in your list do), he delivers the ball very well.

    Sidenote: Ben's athleticism allows these lateral scrambles to work just fine in college and against crappy defenses. It'll secure a loss in the playoffs against consistent defenses though.

    2) Poor presnap reads. He is OBLIVIOUS to about 1/2 of the blitzes that are coming... In Ben's defense, rumor mill says Washington and Holmes frequently miss hot routes so of course that could be a reason to hold onto the ball.

    This makes it scary that OC Ariens BRAGS about Ben coordinating the blocking assignments for the line.

    3) Poor deep ball. For example, Holmes has his man beat by 3 to 4 steps on the first play offensively against St.Louis. Ben hesitates to wait, why??? you tell me???, and throws what looks to be a wounded punt about 10 yards short forcing Holmes to slow his route (and make a SPECTACULAR adjustment shielding the defender from the ball btw).

    Ben has good qualities such as his toughness. I've also seen a HUGE turnaround this season with NOT throwing into double coverage and/or forcing the ball, which may contribute to the # of sacks. So yes, I'll take a red zone sack followed by a field goal over his red zone INTs from last season.

    Last point: It's not all Ben's fault. Mahan consistently lands on his back with feet his feet in the air. Then there's usually at least 1 other lineman per game who comes in a close second. This weeks' second worst pass blocker goes to Heath Miller.

  23. Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    That's a pretty nice list dude. I can't remember exactly who I picked but I bet it was very similar to your list.

    Of course, all of the guys on your list make quick reads and are very decisive with their decision making. Ben does neither.

    This is why Ben is an overrated QB:

    1) After his plant, he takes his first step sideways whether there is a pass rush or not. I'd say that side step accounts for 60 or 70% of his sack numbers. On the rare occasion when Ben steps up (as the QBs in your list do), he delivers the ball very well.

    Sidenote: Ben's athleticism allows these lateral scrambles to work just fine in college and against crappy defenses. It'll secure a loss in the playoffs against consistent defenses though.

    2) Poor presnap reads. He is OBLIVIOUS to about 1/2 of the blitzes that are coming... In Ben's defense, rumor mill says Washington and Holmes frequently miss hot routes so of course that could be a reason to hold onto the ball.

    This makes it scary that OC Ariens BRAGS about Ben coordinating the blocking assignments for the line.

    3) Poor deep ball. For example, Holmes has his man beat by 3 to 4 steps on the first play offensively against St.Louis. Ben hesitates to wait, why??? you tell me???, and throws what looks to be a wounded punt about 10 yards short forcing Holmes to slow his route (and make a SPECTACULAR adjustment shielding the defender from the ball btw).

    Ben has good qualities such as his toughness. I've also seen a HUGE turnaround this season with NOT throwing into double coverage and/or forcing the ball, which may contribute to the # of sacks. So yes, I'll take a red zone sack followed by a field goal over his red zone INTs from last season.

    Last point: It's not all Ben's fault. Mahan consistently lands on his back with feet his feet in the air. Then there's usually at least 1 other lineman per game who comes in a close second. This weeks' second worst pass blocker goes to Heath Miller.

    Every thing you said are things that alot of qbs do. when a pocket collapses as much as the steelers does I doubt any will be able to step into it. As far as his scrambling only working in college, i beg to differ he one of the hardest qb to bring down in the NFL I cant imagine how many sacks he would have had if he didnt go outside the pocket. To pick apart every single pass is just plain crazy. I watched manning 1st lost this season i wonder who the hell he is throwing the ball to, you know how many deep balls of brady's would have been int if it wasnt for moss, qb makes these mistakes. All Im telling is more mistakes can happen when a qb has half the time in the pocket to make plays. Steelers lost to the jets do you know how many times he was sacked that game, 7 times, how does a playoff caliber line with a 5 time probowler give up 7 sacks, we also gave 4 sacks to st lous, how does that happen. Like I said I would blame alot on the surrounding cast before I threw Ben under the bus, their might be only 2 qbs in the league I would rather have under center than him. After this year is over I might only consider 1 of the 2. And before I would say that he doesnt make quick decisions, I would 1st ask yourself how many 3 step drops does ben even get a chance to make this season. I dont think he has had 1 I have seen this year.

    His stats speak for themselves, you wont be able to find a qb with better performance that has more than 30 sacks. He has a 3-1 td to int ration and a 65% rate those are incredible numbers. None of the top qbs in the league today would even have close to those numbers with the same oline.

    What will lose or 1 st playoff game will be our defenses ability to lay down when the game is on the line, and the oline inability to block for sufficient amount of time.
    Last edited by rugger48; 12-22-2007 at 10:33 PM.

  24. Quote Originally Posted by rugger48 View Post
    I would 1st ask yourself how many 3 step drops does ben even get a chance to make this season. I dont think he has had 1 I have seen this year.
    Great point. Whether it's Ben's fault or the o-line, it's not like things are going to magically click after 15 games. Shame on the inability to make play-calling adjustments to shorten the drops.

  25. Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post

    This makes it scary that OC Ariens BRAGS about Ben coordinating the blocking assignments for the line.
    Dude, seriously, THIS is your biggest problem. Arians is the same guy who tried to convince everyone in Cleveland that Charlie Frye's ability to read defenses and pick up the blitz was improving. Pretty sure he said the same thing about Kelly Holcomb. The only worse OC in the league that I know about is Mo Carthon who almost single handedly destroyed the Browns last season.

    To your point in another post, Arians is also to blame for not making adjustments to protect his QB. Again, he's your biggest problem. The guy sucks at his job.

    I'm glad he's the Steelers' OC!

  26. Quote Originally Posted by rugger48 View Post
    he had 3 ints and a fumble monday night, and has 6 tds 10 ints in 12 games. He has probably 1 of the best 3 olines in football on top of that.
    100% correct this is exactly what I was talking about. This type of qb is successful in college but has never worked in the NFL not nearly accurate enough of a passer. Minnesota should make a run at someone like McNabb if he becomes available in the off season as is rumored. Let's see how well Jackson does tonight against Washington.

  27. OVERRATED:
    Phillip Rivers
    Eli Manning - Should be doing much more with those weapons
    Jay Cutler
    Matt Leinart
    Marc Bulger
    Steve McNair

    UNDERRATED:
    Derek Anderson
    Jeff Garcia
    David Garrard
    Matt Hasselbeck
    John Kitna
    Trent Edwards -Watch out for him in the near future !

  28. how about under rated QBs of the past?

    Jim Kelly
    Warren Moon
    Randel Cunningham <- spelled wrong im sure.

    Jim Kelly being the best out of the bunch.

  29. Quote Originally Posted by Chad View Post
    how about under rated QBs of the past?

    Jim Kelly
    Warren Moon
    Randel Cunningham <- spelled wrong im sure.

    Jim Kelly being the best out of the bunch.
    Since we're on a Bills kick, I really enjoy watching Lynch run. I hope he continues to be successful for a few years.

  30. Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    Since we're on a Bills kick, I really enjoy watching Lynch run. I hope he continues to be successful for a few years.
    Ditto. He's a beast.
  

  
 

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