UFC or Boxing

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by plenny View Post
    Mohommed Ali, Smokin Joe Frazier, Mike Tyson...whats there not to love?

    Call me old fashioned, but I'd rather watch boxing over MMA anyday. If I wanted to watch MMA I would go to the local bar or tavern about 1-2am and watch 2 drunk idiots roll around on the floor fighting. Someone mentioned earlier that MMa looks sloppy, I agree. Boxing is much more classier and straightforward.
    As someone who does brazilian jiu jitsu three days a week. I can tell you if you understand what you are watching in a grappling match of two black-belts, it is every bit as skilled and entertaining as a Mayweather fight. It is a chess match. I can guarantee you nothing you see in a drunken bar fight even resembles a skilled mma fight.


  2. It really means that each has every take on what sports they like. I for one like boxing and MMA I don't choose from one from the latter. I love MMA because of what Randy Couture has brought to the Octagon and I like Manny Paquiao for what he brings on the ring to date.
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  3. I love and hate both sports. I started boxing when I was 14. At the time there were still great fighters that put on excellent bouts. Now, before people get all pissy, there are still a few great fighters in American mainstream boxing. Boxing is dying int the US but in the rest of the world it is still huge. Now a days is I watch boxing its usually on Telemundo where you can still see some great events and fighters with true heart

    On to MMA. After the Army I started training in Muay Thai and eventually moved to MMA. It is completely different than boxing. So this arguement of a boxer would lose in MMA is completely irrevelent. As mentioned by a couple people it is a completely different sport. Now even though I dont fight anymore I still love MMA. I have grown to dislike the UFC however. I think they need to go back to putting on PPV events every few months. They're cranking out events with what I feel is lower quality fights and still charging PPV to make a quick buck. For how much they pull in annual revenue their fighters are underpaid (it is getting better however) Dana White goes on TV and says how UFC is all about pushing the sport into the mainstream. But then when Affliction starts their own promotion UFC does everything possible to put them out of business. As well when EA sports started development of a MMA game. The UFC told all fighters that if they signed a likeness contract with EA that they would never be allowed to fight in the UFC. Neither of these actions in my opinion help develope the sport. I personally cant wait for DREAM to start to develope their heavyweight class

  4. Boxing definitely. I find boxing having more class than MMA. It has tradition and very exciting to watch.

    As for who would win?

    Hands down MMA. True, grappling gets boring but its essential to survive in an MMA fight. The old UFC fights proved that you need to know some level of grappling to survive and you could see the fighters in MMA evolve over the years. More and more fighters are learning how to grapple even if it isn't their main style because they know how dangerous it is. Any elite boxer with no experience in grappling going against a seasoned grappler, 9 out of 10 wouldn't last. That's just the truth.

  5. on other hand.. even though its never on tv but has anyone every watched an Elite BJJ or a Judo Competition? Its definitely more exciting than boxing in my opinion. I grew up in judo and watching a competition is pretty intense. In a Judo Match, One point is all it takes to win. Watch some Olympic Judoka, especially a guy name Koga. Youtube. You screw up once and its over so it can get really intense.. imagine. Two people trying their hardest to throw you. haha the mental aspect of it is pretty mind blowing. You have to be concentrating at your fullest the whole match otherwise you'll get thrown.
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  6. [QUOTE=TexasTita

    Mayweather is a freak of nature, literally trained in the crib. I would bet money down his conditioning far surpasses some french canadian fruit loop. When I was boxing, my pulse was into the 30s.[/QUOTE]



    HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA!! french canadian fruit loop eh.
    u sir are an idiot.. sure mayweather is a great boxer with amazing conditioning.. but saying he is more conditioned to one of the best conditioned fighters/atheletes in the world is just silly!

  7. Quote Originally Posted by Young Gotti View Post
    this thread is going to get interesting, i like mma don't get me wrong, it's awesome, but thats because it's always on that i watch it, boxing is hardly ever on, that i see anyway, but watching the old ali and frazier fights, old tyson, even mayweather.....boxers would work mma fights, because get this...they throw proper punches, mma guys punchs are awful...so yeah mma guys can take them down but u can't take someone down who's gonna throw actual combos as you dive at his legs
    do u think that in an mma fight u just shoot for a takedown? u set your take downs up with punchs...

    do u train mma?

  8. UFC for the win.

  9. What you guys think the outcome of Mariusz Pudzianowski vs. Tim Sylvia's gona be. When they going to put mariusz against Brock that be one hell of a fight

  10. MMA > Boxing because in MMA they go at each other and fight and in Boxing they try to avoid getting hit the whole time. After Mayweather fights Mosley, Pacquiao and Paul Williams there will be no fights left in boxing that I want to see.

  11. BOTH ARE AMAZING

  12. Gotta go with the UFC. I just cant get into boxing anymore now that im a UFC fan. It just seems to be outdated now.

  13. i like both.

  14. UFC not to many good boxing for awhile now maybe mayweather vs paq will happen one day.

  15. Grew up watching boxing with father, later on walked into Gleason's famed Brooklyn gym and fell in love. Both sports have their place. Also the business models for both are entirely different, with the top in boxing making vastly more than their counterparts in MMA.

  16. Quote Originally Posted by JudgementDay View Post
    I can't wait to see Randy Couture beat James Toney, then no one can say boxing guys can beat MMA guys...and I would love to see Mayweather fight the guys he has with 4 oz gloves.
    You could take an average 140lb boxer and put him in the ring with a talented MMA fighter, where all they could do was trade hands...I present to you a massacre (in the boxer's favor). I've witnessed it myself.

  17. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    You could take an average 140lb boxer and put him in the ring with a talented MMA fighter, where all they could do was trade hands...I present to you a massacre (in the boxer's favor). I've witnessed it myself.
    Ya I'd like to see Cain Velasquez box with an average 140lbs boxer wearing MMA gloves and just box.....bye bye boxer lol


    Boxer vs MMA fighter in a boxing match= boxer wins

    Boxer vs MMA fighter in a MMA fight= MMA fighter wins

    Boxer vs MMA fighter in a kickboxing match= MMA fighter wins

    Boxer vs MMA fighter in a grappling match= MMA fighter wins


    Thats just how the cookie crumbles
    Core Nutritionals Representative

  18. Quote Originally Posted by Mulletsoldier View Post
    I think you may have misunderstood. It is not about varying the activation of the same muscles, which seems to be what you are implying, but it is an entirely different kind of activation altogether. Your point seems to be that there is only a difference in the degree of conditioning between MMA fighters and boxers - with boxers, in your mind, being superior - whereas the issue is a difference in kind altogether.

    Furthermore, that MMA fighters are faced with the same constraints of intensity - ensuring that takedown attempts are still explosive, that leg kicks are still crisp, jabs are proper, etc - only serves to cement my point: not only are they required to maintain speed, accuracy, etc., over long(er) durations, but are required to do so across different instances of physical stimuli. In any case, the greater metabolic load and subsequent adaptation in MMA quite literally means they are more conditioned in the physiologic sense of the word. This being said, I am not making a blanket statement re: the general level of athleticism and explosiveness between sports. Boxers are phenomenally conditioned athletes.

    Also, Toney began his career at MW, and was slovenly even then.
    Comparing the type of conditioning that each sport takes is comparing apples and oranges. You have to think of a boxing match almost a marathon. The sheer amount of punches thrown and taken in a match is astounding, not to mention the number of rounds compared to that of an MMA bout. However, if boxing is a marathon, MMA is not a sprint, but more of say a 400 or 800m run. You have to pace yourself at a point, but know when to explode and make your move, all while being cognisant of what's in your gas tank. This is especially apparent when you add the element of grappling. To truly appreciate the incredible conditiong of both boxers and mixed martial artists, you really have to try both. A boxer's endurance wouldn't mean **** in a wrestling match, and a wrestler would gas in a boxing match. That's why mixed martial arts is so versatile, as it adds in both elements, and hence why I favor it over boxing (especially as of late). However, to say that either sport's athletes are better conditioned is pretentious.

  19. great, i see the next 5 posts just say everything I tried to but much more directly

  20. Not to mention world class boxers are a at a completely differnet level of skill in striking than a mixed martial artist that trains in boxing. If Randy Couture fought Toney in a boxing match (which he never will), Toney would obliterate him. Even Randy said this would happen. I liked what Vitor Belfort proposed. He wanted to fight Toney in an octagon with 4 oz. gloves and make it a kickboxing/muay thai type of deal.

  21. Quote Originally Posted by JudgementDay View Post
    Ya I'd like to see Cain Velasquez box with an average 140lbs boxer wearing MMA gloves and just box.....bye bye boxer lol


    Boxer vs MMA fighter in a boxing match= boxer wins

    Boxer vs MMA fighter in a MMA fight= MMA fighter wins

    Boxer vs MMA fighter in a kickboxing match= MMA fighter wins

    Boxer vs MMA fighter in a grappling match= MMA fighter wins


    Thats just how the cookie crumbles
    If you were to take Cain Velasquez and put him in the ring with the ghost of Arturo Gatti, it would last a little over 30 seconds, with Cain waking up in the dressing room wondering how a ghost can still be effective at counter punching.

    Use some perspective. Lesnar became a champion after how many pro fights? In boxing that would be damn near impossible, where size has less to do with it, than pure skill. If Lesnar were 15-0 in boxing and you were to put him in the ring with a top 5 fighter, you'd have your license revoked and he would be in the hospital. You can't intelligently compare boxing vs MMA in terms of their popularity. Boxing boasts names like Muhammad Ali and is stoked in tradition. MMA just popped up in the mainstream only a few short years ago. To properly judge both sports and their impact with the public, both sports would have to be judged against time and in that vein boxing takes the belt.

  22. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    If you were to take Cain Velasquez and put him in the ring with the ghost of Arturo Gatti, it would last a little over 30 seconds, with Cain waking up in the dressing room wondering how a ghost can still be effective at counter punching.

    Use some perspective. Lesnar became a champion after how many pro fights? In boxing that would be damn near impossible, where size has less to do with it, than pure skill. If Lesnar were 15-0 in boxing and you were to put him in the ring with a top 5 fighter, you'd have your license revoked and he would be in the hospital. You can't intelligently compare boxing vs MMA in terms of their popularity. Boxing boasts names like Muhammad Ali and is stoked in tradition. MMA just popped up in the mainstream only a few short years ago. To properly judge both sports and their impact with the public, both sports would have to be judged against time and in that vein boxing takes the belt.
    The record thing is something that is always brought up, but you have to look at it in context. When you look at the records of most top MMA guys, very few of them are cans with the exception of the beginning of their careers. However, it can take over 30-40 fights before a boxer gets someone of merit. To boxing, the record is everything and I can think of very few guys that do not fall fall guilty to "record padding."

    If a fighter in MMA starts out with 10 wins without a loss, it is a hell of a beginning to a career, but if a boxer loses that early, it puts a huge dent into his record. The only boxer I can think of with an early loss and still become elite is Pacquiao. To my knowledge, the best official beginning to a career post-NSAC clearance is Diego Sanchez at 17-0 (I say official because of the BS loss on Fedor's record to TK).

    Lesnar become champ because of 20 years of amateur wrestling experience including a DI championship with a 105-6 record during college. Yes, he's a huge dude, but he's also a freak athlete.

    Impact also depends largely upon culture. In Brazil, Japan, Russia, Thailand, etc., traditional western boxing has very low cultural impact while BJJ, Judo, Muay Thai, Sambo, Vale Tudo, etc. have a much higher cultural impact. MMA as we know it is really only about 15 years old, but the concept of having different arts compete against each other goes back well over 70 years in Brazil, which is really the Motherland of MMA.
    M.Ed. Ex Phys


  23. Fair point, however, boxers are brought along slowly to maximize their potential, more so than to simply pad their records. As an example, Fernando Vargas was thrown into the lion's den after having only 20 pro bouts to his name, against the likes of Felix Tito Trinidad; and consequently was never the same after that. If he were given the chance to mature both mentally and physically, presumably he could have gone down as one of the best fighters of his generation, based solely on his talent level. Boxers have a short lifespan to maximize both their potential and their pocket books.

    I agree that MMA is more popular in certain areas of the world, however, if you have one of their countryman fighting for a title in boxing, it will capture their imagination and the entire country, much like Manny Pac has. More over he doesn't speak English, yet was still granted an SI cover, and was a first seat guest on Leno, Letterman and Kimmel. Some of the biggest fights in boxing history were fought internationally, in places like Manila and Zaire. Everyone has heard of the "Thrilla in Manila", not so sure everyone has heard about "Lesnar/Couture". History speaks to my general point.

    I think MMA has it's place. To argue that it's more popular than boxing, would need to be argued in context, given that it's only been given a mainstream outlet in the past few years. It would need another 20 to justify that argument while steeping itself in tradition, much like Muhammad Ali, Tyson and Leonard among many others have come to define boxing and become A-List celebrities outside of their respective sport.

  24. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    Fair point, however, boxers are brought along slowly to maximize their potential, more so than to simply pad their records. As an example, Fernando Vargas was thrown into the lion's den after having only 20 pro bouts to his name, against the likes of Felix Tito Trinidad; and consequently was never the same after that. If he were given the chance to mature both mentally and physically, presumably he could have gone down as one of the best fighters of his generation, based solely on his talent level. Boxers have a short lifespan to maximize both their potential and their pocket books.

    I agree that MMA is more popular in certain areas of the world, however, if you have one of their countryman fighting for a title in boxing, it will capture their imagination and the entire country, much like Manny Pac has. More over he doesn't speak English, yet was still granted an SI cover, and was a first seat guest on Leno, Letterman and Kimmel. Some of the biggest fights in boxing history were fought internationally, in places like Manila and Zaire. Everyone has heard of the "Thrilla in Manila", not so sure everyone has heard about "Lesnar/Couture". History speaks to my general point.

    I think MMA has it's place. To argue that it's more popular than boxing, would need to be argued in context, given that it's only been given a mainstream outlet in the past few years. It would need another 20 to justify that argument while steeping itself in tradition, much like Muhammad Ali, Tyson and Leonard among many others have come to define boxing and become A-List celebrities outside of their respective sport.
    I think the current state of affairs of the HW division dispels this point.
    M.Ed. Ex Phys


  25. Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    I think the current state of affairs of the HW division dispels this point.
    With respect to the heavyweight division, which was once seen as the glamor division, I agree with you; however, it's only one division out of many. Luckily boxing has multiple divisions, filled with a lot of young talent, and that bodes well for the future of the sport. Again this isn't an MMA bash, it does have it's place. To compare it to boxing in terms of popularity in my opinion is a bit disingenuous, given that it's still relatively new to the "mainstream". The litmus test will be in 20 years from now, will MMA have it's own version of a Muhammad Ali, Leonard, Duran, Armstrong, Marciano, Tyson etc.

  26. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    With respect to the heavyweight division, which was once seen as the glamor division, I agree with you; however, it's only one division out of many. Luckily boxing has multiple divisions, filled with a lot of talent, and that bodes well for the future of the sport.
    However, the phrase "HW Champion of the World" used to be amongst the most prestigious titles in all of sports, but it means very, very little now. There is just something about the HW division that captivates people and plays a huge role in the overall health of the sport.

    I think to say that the future of boxing is secure is a tad too arrogant in the sense that the overall popularity of boxing has tailed immensely because of the lack of an infusion of fresh, captivating talent. For better or worse, the marketing of a fighter plays a huge role and this is where boxing has really faltered. There is a rich history of characters in boxing, but it really seems like that could be a thing of the past as the scumbag promoters have really taken over the sport and delay the fights for years and years. Even if they do happen, it's often too late as the luster of the matchup has ended (I'm not saying that this doesn't happen in MMA because it does and there's 1 person to blame for it).
    M.Ed. Ex Phys


  27. Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    However, the phrase "HW Champion of the World" used to be amongst the most prestigious titles in all of sports, but it means very, very little now. There is just something about the HW division that captivates people and plays a huge role in the overall health of the sport.

    I think to say that the future of boxing is secure is a tad too arrogant in the sense that the overall popularity of boxing has tailed immensely because of the lack of an infusion of fresh, captivating talent. For better or worse, the marketing of a fighter plays a huge role and this is where boxing has really faltered. There is a rich history of characters in boxing, but it really seems like that could be a thing of the past as the scumbag promoters have really taken over the sport and delay the fights for years and years. Even if they do happen, it's often too late as the luster of the matchup has ended (I'm not saying that this doesn't happen in MMA because it does and there's 1 person to blame for it).
    MMA and boxing have vastly different business models. MMA is controlled/governed under one entity (Dana White) with the top fighter not even making a fraction of what a mid-level fighter featured on a boxing PPV would make, or generate from a live gate.

    In terms of raw marketing, I like the direction that Dana White has taken, especially with the rumor that he plans to create his own network, which is a game changer. If you could forgo the networks then you're ahead of the game. Dana White was losing money until the UFC made it's reality tv debut, which showcased the sport to a much broader audience. I don't think the heavyweight division is as important as it use to be, with respect to the long term health of the sport. Even when Lennox Lewis was the heavyweight champion, boxing's most popular figure was Oscar Dela Hoya. As long as you have a mixture of talent coupled with a dynamic personality, then you're back in business. Manny and May possess both.

    Boxing needs a uniformed commission, however, that would alter the current business model, affecting both the fighter and their promoter, which is why it hasn't happened yet. Having said that, the last few boxing PPV's were all successful, with some even breaking prior records for both purses made and live gate. Boxing moving away from networks like ABC and CBS, have been detrimental to the sport in terms of marketability, however, fighting on HBO (subscription model) brings in a lot more money to the fighters and promoters; it's a catch 22. Both boxing and MMA will ultimately thrive; albeit through different mechanisms.

  28. Im a big fan of both sports. Both have amazing skill sets of their own. MMA is so much more diverse, giving the fighter much more to worry about. Which is technical is its own way. Because you dont know if the guy will punch, kick, knee, or take you down for G&P or to set up a sub. In boxing its much more artful since all you use is footwork, body movement, and your hands.

    Overall I prefer MMA but a great boxing fight is tough to beat by a top MMA fight. I miss the old days when you seen great fights and fighters on free TV. I remember watching my favorite fighter Thomas Hitman Hearns on Wide World of Sports. Boxing lead to its own demise. By no means am I saying its dead, but its fading fast while MMA is steadily rising.

  29. Quote Originally Posted by primetime74 View Post
    Im a big fan of both sports. Both have amazing skill sets of their own. MMA is so much more diverse, giving the fighter much more to worry about. Which is technical is its own way. Because you dont know if the guy will punch, kick, knee, or take you down for G&P or to set up a sub. In boxing its much more artful since all you use is footwork, body movement, and your hands.

    Overall I prefer MMA but a great boxing fight is tough to beat by a top MMA fight. I miss the old days when you seen great fights and fighters on free TV. I remember watching my favorite fighter Thomas Hitman Hearns on Wide World of Sports. Boxing lead to its own demise. By no means am I saying its dead, but its fading fast while MMA is steadily rising.

    Agreed!

    Guys like Tommy Hearns, Ray leonard, marvin hagler, Tyson Watching guys like them box is entertaining, time to time I still have to watch some good old boxing matches on youtube.

    But the last few fights I've seen with Mayweather I just can't get into it.
    Core Nutritionals Representative

  30. Objectively speaking, the UFC has dominated boxing in pay-per-view buyrates, revenue, and television ratings over the past three-and-a-half years. Unless there is some other measure of popularity that I am unaware of - one obviously not related to the purchasing behavior of consumers who endorse a given sport - that particular point is moot. UFC is, for and at the moment, more popular, successful, and profitable than boxing. (I would say MMA in-general, here, but truthfully speaking the UFC commands this attention moreso than all the other promotions combined.)

    This owes itself to many factors, not the least of which being the [at best] tepid state of boxing's heavyweight division, the inability of major promoters to capitalize on the largest fight(s) currently possible (Pacquiao/Mayweather) and the abject failure of boxing as a sport to remain relevant in the contemporary sports narrative. Fairly or not, boxing has come to be seen as antiquated, and the consequence is an increasingly aging demographic who is less inclined to purchase, and who is therefore unable to keep boxing "popular."

    As for the argument on tradition, I find this an ineffective rubric for measuring the worth of a particular sport. Competitive chess, and ringette, and lacrosse have their traditions, does this mean they captivate the current sports audience? A feat, again, that is necessary to proclaim something as "popular." Tradition is a function of time as much as it is quality and we cannot project hypothetically forward in time in order to assess a thing's current popularity.

    As for Lesnar and the amount of pro fights, I believe I did a summation of similar phenomenon in boxing on the previous page.
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