Dermacrine

[n87]

Which would be better to stack Oral Dermacrine with for a 4 week cycle P-plex or Eq-plex? This is what I have:

P-plex (17a-Methyl-etioallocholan-2-ene-17b-ol ) 20/30/30/40

Eq-plex (1, 4 Androstadiene-3, 17-Dione) 600/800/800/800

I have tried topical Dermacrine with Epistane with good results before.
That was the only cycle I have run.
For PCT, I am thinking PP TRS, AI cycle support. Will have nolva and clomid on hand if needed. The goal would be to gain strength/LBM, if it comes with extra BF, that's ok too.

 

[Psychabinol]

Which would be better to stack Oral Dermacrine with for a 4 week cycle P-plex or Eq-plex? This is what I have:

P-plex (17a-Methyl-etioallocholan-2-ene-17b-ol ) 20/30/30/40

Eq-plex (1, 4 Androstadiene-3, 17-Dione) 600/800/800/800

I have tried topical Dermacrine with Epistane with good results before.
That was the only cycle I have run.
For PCT, I am thinking PP TRS, AI cycle support. Will have nolva and clomid on hand if needed. The goal would be to gain strength/LBM, if it comes with extra BF, that's ok too.

p-plex, because you need to run EQ-plex for 6 weeks for it to start for working, plus you need higher dosing.

But two bottles of Demacrine would stack well with 2-3 bottle of EQ-PLex

 

[n87]

Thanks. Should I use Nolva or Clomid for the PCT?

 

[UKStrength]

Thanks. Should I use Nolva or Clomid for the PCT?

I don't like conventional SERM protocols for PCT, but that's from my own experience of them and others may disagree.

I'd prefer to run something akin to the Testosterone Recovery Stack and have the SERMS on hand in case gynecomastia did rear its ugly head.

 

[n87]

I am hoping to get away with just using OTC PCT, but you never know.

 

[UKStrength]

I am hoping to get away with just using OTC PCT, but you never know.

What have you used before if you don't mind me asking?

My inclination would be to go OTC and use the SERMS if needed but often this is a user-dependent issue.

 

[n87]

I ran Havoc/topical Dermacrine with TRS PCT. Had nolva but never used it. Didn' have any issues. Strength was up, kept about 5lbs of weight gain after PCT.

 

[UKStrength]

I ran Havoc/topical Dermacrine with TRS PCT. Had nolva but never used it. Didn' have any issues. Strength was up, kept about 5lbs of weight gain after PCT.

Apologies mate I re-read your post and saw that you've mentioned this.

The TRS should be fine for your cycle, however I'd keep the Nolvadex on-hand just in case gynecomastia becomes a problem as P-Plex can drive SHBG so low that your body makes more oestrogen to counteract it...leading to possible gyno

You could run a low dose AI throughout the cycle, that would be another option.

 

[crowbar46]

UK, could you explain your statement: "P-Plex can drive SHBG so low that your body makes more oestrogen to counteract it". I've heard the theory that P-Plex (as well as S-drol, M-drol) drive SHBG so low that estrogen is freed up to circulate--basically, that certain steroids bind so tightly to SHBG that they compete with test/estrogen. However, I posed this idea to Bill Roberts who said that the "theory" was absolutely, without question, wrong.

At any rate, why/how would driving SHGB very low cause your body to produce more estrogen to counteract it? It seems to me, if anything, it would be the opposite--with less SHBG present less androgens are being bound, thus more are in a free state, and the body would "see" no need to produce more.

Thanks,

Crowbar

 

[n87]

Thanks UKstrength, appreciate the advice!

 

[Trauma1]

UK, could you explain your statement: "P-Plex can drive SHBG so low that your body makes more oestrogen to counteract it". I've heard the theory that P-Plex (as well as S-drol, M-drol) drive SHBG so low that estrogen is freed up to circulate--basically, that certain steroids bind so tightly to SHBG that they compete with test/estrogen. However, I posed this idea to Bill Roberts who said that the "theory" was absolutely, without question, wrong.

At any rate, why/how would driving SHGB very low cause your body to produce more estrogen to counteract it? It seems to me, if anything, it would be the opposite--with less SHBG present less androgens are being bound, thus more are in a free state, and the body would "see" no need to produce more.

Thanks,

Crowbar

I'm not sure that it necessarily drives SHBG lower, but rather can disassociate an already bound estrogen from SHBG further making it unbound and in an active state. I would say that it's probably more a theory than anything and I personally haven't read anything significant to support it myself.

I think many of the inherent gyno issues that we read about often have precipitating factors already in place prior to androgen use; whether the user is aware or not. This is another reason why blood work is so vital. The hormonal axis is very fragile in nature and even very small alterations in some people can cause profound effect(s).

There is still so much we don't know (and probably never will); especially in regard to many of these Designer compounds.

- John