Need serious help with bench

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    Need serious help with bench


    Ok I need serious help with this as the title says lol. Before track season I was benching 185 5x at 138 or so pounds then during track I had no access to a real bench and was having to use 35 lb dumbells for benching which obviously didn't help. So now I'm weighing 130 and struggling with 145 5x which is extremely embarassing and no matter what I do the weight won't go up, if anything it goes down. My workout is 1 week I do 5x5 next week 10,8,6,2 next week 5x3 then back to the beginning. Any advice?

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    make a better workout i do this 2 times a week

    5x5 on bench (220)
    3x10 lying flat on bench with dumbells(75)
    3x10 incline dumbell(65)
    3x10 decline dumbell(65)
    3x10 dumbell flies(25)
    3x10 cable cross overs

    and you have to work your back and triceps shoulders, etc, to get a real strong increase in bench or else your goin to be unproportional and injuries will occur... so i say start a 5 day split full body workout but if you dont ahve the much time go to a 3 day but yeah... thats just my chest workout.
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    That is not the way to increase a bench press; it is going to lead to serious overtraining. Check out this article to increase not only you BP, but also overall strength and mass.http://www.defrancostraining.com/art...s_westside.htm
    M.Ed. Ex Phys
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    It increased my bp 50 lbs in 3 months... then agian i had never taken weightliftin seriously... and that is also a good program
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    Alright I'll look into that, thanks for the help the whole bp thing was really starting to get me mad lol.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bkoguy07 View Post
    make a better workout i do this 2 times a week

    5x5 on bench (220)
    3x10 lying flat on bench with dumbells(75)
    3x10 incline dumbell(65)
    3x10 decline dumbell(65)
    3x10 dumbell flies(25)
    3x10 cable cross overs

    and you have to work your back and triceps shoulders, etc, to get a real strong increase in bench or else your goin to be unproportional and injuries will occur... so i say start a 5 day split full body workout but if you dont ahve the much time go to a 3 day but yeah... thats just my chest workout.
    Good lord that's like 20 sets... I do like 3-4 sets max.
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    Quote Originally Posted by UHCougar05 View Post
    Have you tried that one? looks really interesting
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Have you tried that one? looks really interesting
    I've used the principles from the article and they do seem to help. I only do one bench session a week though, to lessen the wear and tear on my shoulders. Also, I tend to press back towards the rack rather than straight up and down, but this is to mimic my technique in my shirt.
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    I refuse to even admit how little I bench, thats how much it depresses me. I may try and see how I can work out that method given what equipment my gym has
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    That is not the way to increase a bench press; it is going to lead to serious overtraining. Check out this article to increase not only you BP, but also overall strength and mass.http://www.defrancostraining.com/art...s_westside.htm

    That article is about best as it gets for beginning Powerlifting. Always remember more is not better.

    Originally Posted by bkoguy07
    make a better workout i do this 2 times a week

    5x5 on bench (220)
    3x10 lying flat on bench with dumbells(75)
    3x10 incline dumbell(65)
    3x10 decline dumbell(65)
    3x10 dumbell flies(25)
    3x10 cable cross overs


    If you follow a routine like that you would get weaker and be seriously overtrained within a few weeks.
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    I've usually found that when someone is suffering on bench, it's usually due to a weakness somewhere else.. Shoulders, Back, Tri's etc..

    If you're wanting to increase strength, it might be a good idea to stick with a bar and lay off the DB's for a while.. DB's are great but not the best thing for actually increasing Stength..

    I would Highly recommend reconstructing your entire routine and primarily focus on compounds..

    Squats, deads, Flat Bench, Hang clean & press, Rows..
    Like I said before, lack of bench isn't usually due to weak pecs, it's due to weak delts and Tri's..

    Try doing this for several weeks and I'll bet you're bench will start moving up in numbers..

    Monday:
    Squat: 4X6-8
    Flat Bench: 4X6-8
    CG Bench: 4X8-10
    Hang Clean & Press 4X6-8
    Rows 4X6-8

    Wednesday:
    Deads 4X6-8---------at the top of each rep, do a double shrug
    Flat Bench: 4X6-8
    Incline Bench: 4X6-8
    Arnolds: 4x6-8
    CG Bench: 4X8-10

    Friday:
    Squats 4X6-8
    Flat Bench: 4X6-8
    OH Press: 4X6-8
    Rows: 4X6-8
    CG Bench 4X8-10

    If you feel the need you can throw in a few sets of isolations for your lats, bi's and tri's but it's not at all necessary
    Don't go to failure, work around fiishing at 85% of your max for the speciffic reps.. Work with constant weight.."no bumping up each set" increase slightly, 2.5-5lbs each training session..
    Not a very glamorous routine but I guarantee if you do it for 6 weeks you'll see some great results on your lifts..




    Quote Originally Posted by wrasslin116 View Post
    Ok I need serious help with this as the title says lol. Before track season I was benching 185 5x at 138 or so pounds then during track I had no access to a real bench and was having to use 35 lb dumbells for benching which obviously didn't help. So now I'm weighing 130 and struggling with 145 5x which is extremely embarassing and no matter what I do the weight won't go up, if anything it goes down. My workout is 1 week I do 5x5 next week 10,8,6,2 next week 5x3 then back to the beginning. Any advice?
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    Quote Originally Posted by smoundzou View Post
    I've usually found that when someone is suffering on bench, it's usually due to a weakness somewhere else.. Shoulders, Tri's etc..

    If you're wanting to increase strength, it might be a good idea to stick with a bar and lay off the DB's for a while.. DB's are great but not the best thing for actually increasing weight..

    I would Highly recommend reconstructing your entire routine and primarily focus on compounds..

    Squats, deads, Flat Bench, Hang clean & press, Rows..
    Like I said before, lack of bench isn't usually due to weak pecs, it's due to weak delts and Tri's..

    Try doing this for several weeks and I'll bet you're bench will start moving up in numbers..

    Monday:
    Squat: 4X8
    Flat Bench: 4X8-10
    CG Bench: 4X8-10
    Hang Clean & Press 4X8
    Rows 4X8-10

    Wednesday:
    Deads 4X8
    Flat Bench: 4X8-10
    Incline Bench: 4X8-10
    Arnolds: 4x8-10
    CG Bench: 4X10

    Friday:
    Squats 4X8
    Flat Bench: 4X10
    OH Press: 4X10
    Rows: 4X10
    CG Bench 4X10

    Don't go to failure, work around fiishing at 85% of your max for the speciffic reps.. Not a very glamorous routine but I think it will get your numbers up..
    I think doing flat bench every training day would only lead to overtraining, not to numbers going up. One rest day isn't enough to heal up inbetween.
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    I think over-training is probably the most abused word used.. If the trainee were doing 4 or 5 pec exercises per working day 3 X's per week and pushing heavy loads.. then CNS Fatigue , over-training could become a factor..

    And the routine is not based around working the pecs, it's meant to focus each muscle group with compounds.. Like I mentioned before, A weak bench is usally due to other muscles..Primarily Delts and Tri's not entirely the pec..

    Consider that on the touchest day for chest the routine only calls for 8 sets, 4 sets flat and 4 sets incline.. and the other two days, only 4 sets.. I hardly think over-training is going to become a facotor.. The entire routine works the pecs 16 sets per week broken down into 3 training days.. IMO.. muscles do not have to fully recover , Key Word(s) FULLY RECOVER" before they can be trained again.. I know some people live and die by this but there is no scientic studies to back this up.. some of the worlds most recognized strenght training coaches recommend 3 day full body routines..

    That's the worse thing I hate about these forums.. it' only takes one person making a comment like yours to discourage someone from doing a solid routine that is proven to gain both strength and mass without the aid of Pharmaceuticals.... Keep in mind this advice isn't being given to a pro BBer but a beginning lifter.. low level intermediate at best..

    do a little research on how split routines evolved into bodybuilding....
    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    I think doing flat bench every training day would only lead to overtraining, not to numbers going up. One rest day isn't enough to heal up inbetween.
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    Quote Originally Posted by smoundzou View Post
    I think over-training is probably the most abused word used.. If the trainee were doing 4 or 5 pec exercises per working day 3 X's per week and pushing heavy loads.. then CNS Fatigue , over-training could become a factor..

    And the routine is not based around working the pecs, it's meant to focus each muscle group with compounds.. Like I mentioned before, A weak bench is usally due to other muscles..Primarily Delts and Tri's not entirely the pec..

    Consider that on the touchest day for chest the routine only calls for 8 sets, 4 sets flat and 4 sets incline.. and the other two days, only 4 sets.. I hardly think over-training is going to become a facotor.. The entire routine works the pecs 16 sets per week broken down into 3 training days.. IMO.. muscles do not have to fully recover , Key Word(s) FULLY RECOVER" before they can be trained again.. I know some people live and die by this but there is no scientic studies to back this up.. some of the worlds most recognized strenght training coaches recommend 3 day full body routines..

    That's the worse thing I hate about these forums.. it' only takes one person making a comment like yours to discourage someone from doing a solid routine that is proven to gain both strength and mass without the aid of Pharmaceuticals.... Keep in mind this advice isn't being given to a pro BBer but a beginning lifter.. low level intermediate at best..

    do a little research on how split routines evolved into bodybuilding....

    I agree that the split of full body works well, but I think that doing 4 sets each of flat bench and CG bench every 2 days is too much.

    Bodybuilding is very personal, we all have different body types, and different genetics. So what may work well for you may not work well for him or for me. There are very few universal things in bodybuilding. Granted creatine seems to have no nonresponders, but there are people who refuse to take it because of bathroom related side effects Some guys struggle to gain 5 lbs. I have to struggle to not gain 5 lbs.

    You are no more entitled to your opinion than I am to mine. Thats the real point of these forums, so that different points of view are available. It only takes one workout plan like yours that leaves a guy feeling sore 24x7 to discourage him from bodybuilding entirely And are there scientific studies to show that this sort of workout scheme builds bench press strength? since you say there are no scientific studies showing that a length of time is required to fully heal muscles.

    Thats the beauty here, he can get opposing points of view, have people help give him new ideas to try. He still needs to take all that any of us say with a grain of salt.

    Heck, maybe at 15 he can bounce back that fast inbetween (I know theres no way I can), but I think he should be prepared to give up the workout scheme you suggested if its bothering him from soreness after a couple weeks, and go to something with high intensity on workout days, and more time between.
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    I think the point being is, if the OP is 15 years old and healthy doing the routine is not going to lead to CNS fatigue, over-training.... especially doing the weights he listed.

    Far to often people throw around the word over-training without fully realizing what it is.. Over-training is not being sore. I'm 45 years old and if I were to train only when I'm not sore I would only be training 1 X every 2 weeks..

    Being a beginner, the OP is going to get better results form doing a full body mostly compounds 3 X's per week than he would ever get from doing some hokey split routine found in a muscle mag.. that was designed by some pro bber who is roided out..

    The routine's focus is on developing all the muscles by utilizing compound exercises.. Like mentioned.. his week bench is probably more than pec related and will more than like be a combination of pec, delts and tri's..

    Here's a cliassic example of 1 X per week pec routine..
    Flat Bench 4X10
    Incline Bench 4X10
    Decline Bench 4X10
    Incline flyes 4X10
    Standing cable Flyes 4x10

    Weekly set total: 20..

    Followed by:
    Tuesday : Back
    Wednesday: Legs
    Thursday: Shoulders
    Friday: Arms

    Now realistically, the object is work 1 muscle per day.. is that possible.. Nope.. can't be done.. so he's not only doing a massive chest routine on Monday, clutered with isolations that are better served beng done by an advanced lifter.. not to mention the pecs get pounded on Thursday.. but everyone seems to think that's OK and pecs are only being hit on Monday. Give me a break..

    If the trainee has difficulty doing the routine, it can easily be reduced to a 2 day, Tuesday-Thursday.. but i hardly think that's going to happen..

    Regarding hitting the pecs with Flat Bench and CG Bench 3X's per week.. if the CG bench is done with proper form, the pecs are not obsorbing the full load of the weights, the focus of the move is to work all 3 heads of the tri and again, if done with proper form.. that's what's going to obsorb the most.. the pecs will get stimulated but not as if they were taking a full load on flat or incline bench.. But even if they were, it would still probably be fine.. Better to split 24 sets into 3 days than kill one muscle with 24 sets all at once.. then hit it again in another two days with a massive Delt routine??

    Frequency in training is important for beginners.. especially young guys.. the weight isn't massive and although the muscle fibers are being broken down.. not anywhere near the extent of a intermediate or advanced lifter who is pushing heavy weight.. and I do agree, everyone is entitled to their opion.... but I didn't invent the structure of that routine.. It was around long before you and I.. and to say hitting the chest with 16 sets broken down into 3 weekly workouts is actually humorous.. Give the human body a little more credit than that.. Especially the human body of a healthy energetic 15 year old who probably has so much testosterone running throught his body his head is about to explode..


    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    I agree that the split of full body works well, but I think that doing 4 sets each of flat bench and CG bench every 2 days is too much.

    Bodybuilding is very personal, we all have different body types, and different genetics. So what may work well for you may not work well for him or for me. There are very few universal things in bodybuilding. Granted creatine seems to have no nonresponders, but there are people who refuse to take it because of bathroom related side effects Some guys struggle to gain 5 lbs. I have to struggle to not gain 5 lbs.

    You are no more entitled to your opinion than I am to mine. Thats the real point of these forums, so that different points of view are available. It only takes one workout plan like yours that leaves a guy feeling sore 24x7 to discourage him from bodybuilding entirely And are there scientific studies to show that this sort of workout scheme builds bench press strength? since you say there are no scientific studies showing that a length of time is required to fully heal muscles.

    Thats the beauty here, he can get opposing points of view, have people help give him new ideas to try. He still needs to take all that any of us say with a grain of salt.

    Heck, maybe at 15 he can bounce back that fast inbetween (I know theres no way I can), but I think he should be prepared to give up the workout scheme you suggested if its bothering him from soreness after a couple weeks, and go to something with high intensity on workout days, and more time between.
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    Follow Dave Tate's tips as posted and eat more (weell, eat enough to recover, this is something I had problems with following track season)!
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    I do a heavy bench day and mix in raw and shirted bench with boards. I then do a speed bench day and keep it light. Throw in triceps and back also on bench day. I would listen to Nick W., he has a great bench. I have benched 523.5 in single ply, still WAY behind.



    http://www.elitefts.com/articles/Cur...es/default.asp
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    dude if you wanna increase your bench heres 1 thing you need to know....

    YOU HAVE TO WORK OUT SUPPORTING BODY PARTS I.E. SHOULDERS TRI'S UPPER AND LOWER CHEST

    if all your doin is bench and you expect it to go up youre in for a huge shock.
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    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to smoundzou again.


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    I figured I would add my .02 cents. To increase your bench, your first start is googling "westside barbell club", followed by "louie Simms", and if you haven't figured out wtf is going on, you can also look up "Dave Tate."

    I'm not a beast by any measure of the word. I've got 25% bf, 3 kids, 2 car notes, and a fulltime deskjockey gig. I train 4 days on, 3 days off. In a month and a half of relatively clean eating, good sleep, and westside max rep/dynamic speed training I upped my bench from 225 to 300. I didn't get bigger, I just learned how to use my body properly to perform the exercise in question. I took my squat from low 300s up to a solid 375 for reps and I'm cvnt hairs away from a clean 435. Westside works. Read the articles. Follow the routines. Eat raw eggs. Drink raw milk. Get plenty of sleep.
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    I agree with everyone who says you should work out other body parts. I actually feel a chest workout in my lats and back a little bit. I think my back workouts have helped increase strength in my chest from strengthening the support areas.

    I say hit the deadlifts and focus on back, don't worry so much about your pecs, and before you know it you'll be pushing 185 on the bench again.
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    I want to add "stop using a barbell, and use dumbbells instead". It forces you to work more of the other muscles just to keep stability, etc.
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    Lots of good advice, but I think the real problem is you aren't eating enough to keep up with your track training.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    I want to add "stop using a barbell, and use dumbbells instead". It forces you to work more of the other muscles just to keep stability, etc.
    He could use bands for this purpose (I love me some bands, definitely great for adding strength and explosiveness to your lifts), or he could throw some db work in after he is done with the barbell bench.
    As many others have said, you definitely want to work your back and triceps hard, but I imagine your doing that anyways.
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    Eat More Food!! Nuff Said!
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    What sports do you play? Bench press doesn't help out a track athlete at all. Don't worry to much about it man, if you want to eventually get a scholarship in college for track.

    It will go up in time, don't push it to hard. Hit the triceps hard. Skullcrushers are the best. Do incline bench for a while. Do heavy weighted dips. Don't actually bench more than once a month, for a few months
  

  
 

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