opinions on shirts/suits/etc.
- 08-27-2005, 05:54 PM
Originally Posted by kwyckemynd00
anyhoo, here is a powerlifting/bodybuilding board i frequent that has a bunch of videos of members performing their lifts. one of the mods has a vid of him doing a 425 raw bench and it looks like he's doing all the same **** ya'll are talking about. check it out and see if this is kinda **** i should be doing. http://www.massmuscleinc.net/forum/s...ead.php?t=6651
kwy, you're already a member there little fella.
- 08-27-2005, 06:05 PM
- 08-27-2005, 09:42 PM
Originally Posted by Beelzebub
I would not start altering technique and practicing a high arch until you are familiar with the rules of the federation you are competing in. If it is an IPF type fed, you will be required to bring the bar down relatively high on the chest compared to the way many guys w/ insane arches bring the bar down to the upper abs.
Don't get caught up too much in keeping your elbows tucked to a certain amount. You don't want your arms brushing the sides of your body on the way down. Most good benchers have their elbows at around 30-45 degrees at the bottom of the lift and gradually rotate/flair them out to 90 as they ******* the weight. Especially if you are lifting raw and need the extra strength from the delts and chest at the bottom of the lift--you don't want to tuck too much. I would advise you to practice your form w/ an empty bar every day for 30-40 good singles so you can find the perfect groove/bar path and re-train your CNS (not gonna be easy).
The best thing I did for my bench press was buying the Elite Fitness Systems bench press index DVD. I had no one to show me how to properly set up for the bench and perform it in person, and trust me--this is the next best thing. Jim Wendler (675lb bench press, 2375lb total @275)spends 20-25 minutes going through the proper way to bench for powerlifting from foot placement to setting up, to arching, pressing, using leg drive etc. And then he does it again for lifters who cannot/don't want to arch. Additionally, he gives you several great tips for competition, one of them is a technique to ******* the last 2-3" of a bench w/o actually moving the bar (you'll have to see it to believe it) by manipulating your wrists/forearms. Trust me, I've used it at strictly judged comps and it works. After that he shows how to use bands/chains, boards, and a bunch of other exercises to increase the BP. The DVD is really worth the 50 bucks if you have never competed and don't have someone right there showing you. It is really something you have to see to understand, I can't explain it in words or I would to save you the money (LOL). I really recommend it if you want to learn the right way to bench for strength. www.elitefts.com
08-27-2005, 09:48 PM
09-05-2005, 03:07 PM
Just got done watching a guy put up 495 with a shirt....first half of lift was cake, second half I thought he was going to drop it.......I just don't get it....
So, I had to bump the old thread
09-21-2005, 09:13 AM
Shirts prevent injuries and prolong careers. My shirt gives me about 100lbs +/- a few. I can bench well over 600 raw, but getting overzealous and doing it every week caused me to tear both my pecs. I have had very few injuries since using a shirt, so I will continue to use one. I will eventually be over 800shirted (hopefully by october 29th,lol), but that won't be until I have learned to use my shirt properly, and that is something that takes a ton of practice and work. Its a lot more difficult than most would imagine. I do agree that there are thos in the sport who know how to work the gear good enough to get 400lbs out of it, but there are less than 10 in the sport like that.
09-21-2005, 05:47 PM
I know shirted benching is hard...some people never find their groove. And, your lifts are huge BTW
But, is a 3 ply suit really necessary to prevent injuries? Or, has it absolutely turned into a way for lifters to add (what are in my opinion, artificial) numbers to their lifts. If a single ply works, it works. IMO, If I were to make a powerlifting federation, I would standardize equipment. Use what is essential for protection, and make sure everyone uses the same equipment.
09-21-2005, 06:00 PM
Over two-ply anything is overkill, and truth be told will prolly hurt you more than help (too much shirt resistance with 3). I think 2 ply should be the max, and it is according to WPO rules.Originally Posted by kwyckemynd00
09-21-2005, 06:12 PM
Really? All the big lifters i know are in 3ply. But yeah, usually they can't even touch their chest until they get damn near 600lbs on the bar. And, like i said before, they'll explode the weight up for the first half of the lift (when the shirt's resistance is helping) and then as soon as they get to the ******* and the tris have to "actually" work, the lift slows down considerably. Just seems odd....
I've never lifted shirted, so I can't say too much for or against From what I know now, I'm just not big on the idea.
09-21-2005, 06:14 PM
lattimer is having problems touching with 900+ right now. rage double X shirt or some ****. he blew another one recently. got a pic of it on MMI kwy.Originally Posted by kwyckemynd00
09-21-2005, 06:18 PM
WPO only allows 2ply, but I have heard rumors of Big Gene cheating a bit with the ply #. I only wear two ply and that is more than enough for me to handle. I have so much trouble finding the groove and dropping the weight in properly so as not to dump the weight. I still have a ton to learn, but luckilly I train with the best in the world at shirt technique. I would start out with a single ply, get good at that, then switch to a second ply, and then get good at it. The form is so much different for shirted bench and raw bench.
09-21-2005, 06:24 PM
That just sounds too ridiculousOriginally Posted by Beelzebub
900lbs on your chest, and you can't even get it to touch, despite a huge arch? See...this is just where it seems to be "too freggin' much", ya know?
Just imagine the additional force a PLer is given by a shirt that resists 900lbs and the PLer trying to pull the weight to his chest?
09-21-2005, 06:24 PM
That was in his Inzer Ultimate Denim, which is actually a canvas shirt. I think he might be switching to a RageX though. Mike Wolfe used his RageX for the first time and BLASTED up 855, that shirt is the one everyone is hitting big numbers in.Originally Posted by Beelzebub
09-21-2005, 06:27 PM
Latt is the 2nd best shirt technition there is. He benches about 550 raw. I wish I could manipulate a shirt that well.Originally Posted by kwyckemynd00
09-21-2005, 06:38 PM
550 exactly. new PR for him. at least that's the last i read. he keeps a training log over there. and yup, you're right, ultimate denim is the one he blew recently with a 925 bench that had just touched. 905 wouldn't touch at all.Originally Posted by NickW
like you said, the rage double X is putting up some big #'s for random ppl.
09-21-2005, 06:40 PM
Iam not against lifting shirts and the like, but like kwyck said I feel it would be better with standardization of lifting gear. I used to use a single ply some but became too troublesome since many times I dont have a training partner. Also, I know a couple of guys locally that said they were benching 600+ and squating 800+(SHW) . Funny thing is that at the meets they didnt pass their squat because they couldnt get down far enough and the same guy couldnt get his first lift in on the bench because he couldnt get 315 down to his chest. To me that would be embarsing. They blamed it on politics.
09-21-2005, 06:46 PM
Yes, it would be embaressing to miss a weight because you can't touch. You are always supposed to start with a weight that you know will touch and go from there. It really just boils down to the lifter knowing how to use their shirt and making good decisions on lifting attempts.
09-21-2005, 06:51 PM
IMO, if you have to use a shirt to bench 315...you shouldn't be using a shirtOriginally Posted by grape ape
09-21-2005, 06:55 PM
09-21-2005, 08:47 PM
i'd say 405. then add a single ply for safety. to hell with the rest. but like we discussed earlier, if one guy uses a double rage X, we all have to. pretty ****ty.Originally Posted by kwyckemynd00
09-21-2005, 11:04 PM
I didn't start using a shirt until after I did 600 raw, I maxed out too often tore both my pecs, and then decided that it would be prudent to get some protection. Tearing pecs hurts, luckilly it was just the muscles and not an avulsed tendon.
09-22-2005, 08:52 AM
pulled (maybe tore) my pec recently (about 3 weeks ago) and it's taking some getting used to. 425 ****ed my **** all up. totally my fault though. it was my first day back on flat in over a year and i was going for broke. i got my wish, i broke.Originally Posted by NickW
09-22-2005, 09:42 AM
09-22-2005, 09:47 AM
Beelz, is there much bruising in the area of the pec pain? if it was torn there would be sever bruising and swelling.
09-22-2005, 10:05 AM
no brusing. mild swelling. i was able to do a medium weight workout last week. hitting it again today to see if things have improved. have a slight lump that has formed from the chest into the underarm area. can't see it, but i can feel it. kinda like where there's that connector muscle that runs from the chest to the underarm-shoulder muscle. well, now, i have two connectors to that area. kinda hard to explain.Originally Posted by NickW
09-22-2005, 10:06 AM
09-22-2005, 11:22 AM
I would say that you just tweaked the tendon at its attachment point, take it easy on the heavy weights. I wouldn't do anything heavier than you did for your last workout.Originally Posted by Beelzebub
09-22-2005, 11:26 AM
sounds about right. think i'll stick to the hammer machines for another week or so before hitting up flat again. hoping GH will assist things as well, about to give that a run for it's money.Originally Posted by NickW
09-22-2005, 11:28 AM
I would think it would due to the expedited healing and increased tendon strength GH is supposed to provide.
09-22-2005, 11:30 AM
yessir. spoke to a national bb'ing competitor in my gym about this. said it worked wonders for a knee injury he had. found a good price. everything kinda fell in place, figured it was a sign to try it. won't hurt to try anyway.Originally Posted by NickW
09-22-2005, 11:38 AM
I am sure I will be using GH once my joints/tendons start giving me constant trouble. Let me know how well this works out for you, I might start some Hexatropin before the BB4$ to help my nagging pec tendon pain.
09-22-2005, 11:42 AM
09-22-2005, 11:46 AM
09-22-2005, 05:08 PM
First off ive never used Illegal Gear/Juice and Im 300lbs,6ft 1",and got 573lbs up on bench a few weeks ago with Fury single ply.
Raw i get around 450lbs on flat bench,but on delcine bench i get over 500lbs.I got 315lbs for 31reps on delcine also.
I have bad shoulders and train on decline alot.
I have alot of pain on flat bench but not on decline.When i use a shirt i have almost NO pain at all.When you start getting that
heavy on bench i think shirts are a good idea so you dont blow out your shoulders.That is of course my opinion.I have never used
a denim or double ply shirt.If you are doing a PL meet its almost a must that u use a shirt to compete with the others using shirts.
I personally am glad that they allow shirts because of my shoulder injuries.
09-22-2005, 07:36 PM
thanks for the input bro. yeah, i've come to realize that a single ply is acceptable after a certain weight, just for safety reasons.Originally Posted by MrSkullCrusher
does a double ply give even more safety or does that just take it to a point of ridiculousness?
09-22-2005, 09:53 PM
How are those Hammer's working out for ya' brudda? Love those quotes you got!Originally Posted by Beelzebub
09-22-2005, 10:52 PM
i posted the workout over at MMI. it's getting there. i'm probably around 80%.Originally Posted by hulagn1971
hey hul, since you're here now, what's your view on the PL'ing equipment nowadays?
09-23-2005, 12:41 AM
09-24-2005, 06:47 PM
Never used one so i dont know.Originally Posted by Beelzebub
They should either make everyone go RAW (which would suck for me) or use single ply or just let EVERYTHING go!Start Having guys wrap their elbows (with knee wraps) and Maybe even Full body wraps!!LOL!!!
Ive only entered tested meets that only allow single ply.
09-25-2005, 10:48 AM
are there generally enough competitors to divide it up that much? yeah, it would be great if it could be divided up into RAW, singleply, double ply, anything goes divisions, but it'd probably end up with about 1-2 competitors in each class. at least it'd be more of a level playing field though.Originally Posted by MrSkullCrusher
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