RAW speed work w/no chains or bands?

[SoupNaziNazi]

Hey everyone. Was hoping someone would be able to help me with picking a % to use for RAW speed work with no chains or bands. I know it's generally anywhere from 40-65% with bands or chains, leaning more towards the 65% for RAW lifters. Would it just be 65% without bands or chains aswell? Thanks in advance for the help, God bless.

 

[asooneyeonig]

trick questions as it also depends on how solid your technique is, how many sets you are doing, how many reps, what else you are doing that day, exercise order, what else you do during the week, etc.

 

[SoupNaziNazi]

trick questions as it also depends on how solid your technique is, how many sets you are doing, how many reps, what else you are doing that day, exercise order, what else you do during the week, etc.

Technique is sound. I'll be doing 9x3 and it'll be the first thing I do. Would have inclined heavy 48 hours prior aswell

 

[SoupNaziNazi]

Also probably going to hit a decent triple after the 9x3 but that shouldn't matter being that speed work will be first. Maybe it does matter tho I admit I'm slightly ignorant to the subject

 

[GettinSwolen]

In Layne Norton's PHAT he recommends 65-70% of 5 rep max for the speed work which consists of 6 sets of 3 reps. Seems to have been working for me just for reference.

 

[asooneyeonig]

which lift are you doing this speed work on?

 

[GettinSwolen]

In PHAT you do your main lift on your power day but on the hypertrophy days you do the speed work. So in this particular routine it was bench and squat but I am sure you can apply it to other lifts. And now that I think about it I used it for Rows as well.

 

[asooneyeonig]

bench, go high for percentages on speed work. knowing you are doing 9x3 you would lean towards the low end of a range. if you were doing 5x2 you would go with a higher percentage. try 60-75%

for squats, you can go with a lower percentage. try 45-65% and do them paused or even do paused box squats. that will really teach you how to generate power in the hole.

 

[SoupNaziNazi]

which lift are you doing this speed work on?

Yea I'd be doing it on flat. I just wasn't sure what percentage to use if I wasn't using bands or chains

 

[SoupNaziNazi]

bench, go high for percentages on speed work. knowing you are doing 9x3 you would lean towards the low end of a range. if you were doing 5x2 you would go with a higher percentage. try 60-75%

for squats, you can go with a lower percentage. try 45-65% and do them paused or even do paused box squats. that will really teach you how to generate power in the hole.

Would 5x2 and 6x3 work? I'm not to familiar with speed work. I just always heard of 9x3 and in Louie's bench manual it says 9x3

 

[asooneyeonig]

speed work, or dynamic work, is meant to teach you to be fast. no more than 3 reps. i find deads work with 1-2 reps, squats do doubles, bench do triples. i also find the stronger you are the less reps you need to do and the more sets you can do. as many reps as you should do is the number where you can maintain the fastest speed possible. as soon as you slow down you stop the set. how many sets you do depends on you maintaining speed as well. once the overall speed slows down for the sets, you are done.

 

[SoupNaziNazi]

Is it also okay to use varying % throughout the speed work? Like 3x2 with 60%, 2x2 with 65%, and then 1x2 with 70-75%? Or is it best to just stick with the same % for all sets?

 

[asooneyeonig]

a wave is commonly used. you increase the weight by 5% each week and decrease the total sets to compensate. usually by just 2 sets.

here is what i have done for squats in the past over a 3 week span:
Squat 20x2 55%
Squat 15x2 60%
Squat 12x2 65%


for deads i have done:
1x1 daily max then 10x2 70%
1x1 daily max then 8x2 75%
1x1 daily max then 10x1 80%

for rest, i try and keep it short. very short. i will time the overall time to complete all sets and try and beat it each next time.

that has worked for me after many cycles over many years of trying variations out.

 

[herderdude]

There's no point in going up in weight during a speed session, or eventually it will turn into a kinda fast session. Most people use too much weight on speed work. It should move as fast as if you were pressing an empty bar every single rep. So go by feel for awhile, and use the heaviest weight you can move at warp speed.

Also, I recommend some minibands for speed work. Its better than straight weight. Trust me, I've done a lot of both.

 

[7ckingPrevail]

The reason why you want to use bands and chains is because when you press a straight weight as fast as you possibly can, the weight automaticly starts to decelerate, which contradicts the whole purpose of speed work in the first place.
I train westside so my speed work is basicly this
On squats Week1: 50%, W2: 55%, W3: 60% the percentages are straight weight based, but then on top of this you add roughly 25% of band tention.
And after squats I do block pulls (2 inches from the knees, you can do any deadlift variation you'd like) with the same percentages but I only do 1-10 singles with this weight, and I simply wrap the band around the bar (before i put any weight on) and stand on the band and pull the bands out to the sides until desired amount of band tention.
On bench Week1: 40%, W2: 45% and W3: 50% with eight triples (three closegrips, three medium and two wide, arms give out faster so start close)
I wrap my band beneth the bench and on to the barbell (think of it like the string of a hunting bow). Now days westside uses as light as 30% for 8-10 sets of triples, and they change the bench variation each week, but this method doesn't fit for my gym as It's very minimalistic.
I know that getting exactly 25% of band tention is hella hard because there isn't any real way of knowing where that weight is, and even if you did know it your setup for the bands had to be perfect. But I like to figure it out this way. Test your straight weight maxes on one week, so for me it would be my max box squat bellow parallel, my max flat bench and my max blockpull. Then the next week you test those exact lifts again but now use bands, this will simply show you how much your banded max is compared to your straight weight, so lets say I bench 100 pounds straight weight, and 90 pounds with the bands, then my banded max is obviously 90% of my straight weight max, that means that there is circa 10% more tention at the top. This is the method I have used to figure out my percentages, but remember you HAVE TO use the same band setup each time, and if you want to change the setup, lets say go from a red band to black band, then you'll have to re-test your max, but this time with a black band. If the weight doesn't move fast, then it's not speed work, so always go lighter if you're not sure on if it's too heavy or not.
Hope this helps.

 

[BeastFitness]

When deciding between chains or bands for ANY movement, analyze your strength curve, assess where you need work, and adjust accordingly

 

[Bonesaw93]

I think it also matters what kind of lifter are you? If you tend to be more explosive you should use a higher % for your speed work, if you're more of a grinder you should use a lower percentage (at least at first).

 

[7ckingPrevail]

Going lower is always better than going higher for speed work, Everything should be the same even if you bench slow or fast on heavy weights because its most likely in your genetics to do either due to what muscle fibre type you have in certain muscle groups.