HDrol cycle / PCT

msucurt

msucurt

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Here is my setup. I know the dosages and PCT is somewhat debated on all forums, but i just want to get a consensus on a good, clean PCT for this. I dont want a bunch of misc. stuff that isnt needed. Something easy i guess you could say.

CYCLE:

Hdrol : 50/50/50/50
Cycle support during wks 1-4

PCT: (4weeks)

Nolva: 20/20/10/10
Post Cycle Support: 4 caps/day
Lean Xtreme: 3/day (start day 15)
I3C : 600 mgs/ed

6-oxo: tapered down starting in week 4--300ed /200ed /100ed


Any suggestions?

thanks a lot
 

bassgod272

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yea, change your nolva dosing to 20/20/10/10. people are going overboard with SERM dosing these days. more is not better. with such a light cycle like that, my above suggestion will be plenty to get you up and running again, when combined with your other mentioned items. good luck bro.
 
dmangiarelli

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yea, change your nolva dosing to 20/20/10/10. people are going overboard with SERM dosing these days. more is not better. with such a light cycle like that, my above suggestion will be plenty to get you up and running again, when combined with your other mentioned items. good luck bro.
I agree and because you are using PCS as well there is no need for a such a high dose of Nolva ...

Good luck bro!
 
msucurt

msucurt

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yea, change your nolva dosing to 20/20/10/10. people are going overboard with SERM dosing these days. more is not better. with such a light cycle like that, my above suggestion will be plenty to get you up and running again, when combined with your other mentioned items. good luck bro.
thanks bass. I actually have a weird question in a way. I have some nolva and tarom that i have had for quite some time now. It expires in 07, but has always been kept in a dark, cool place. Would this be ok to still use? The packs are still individually sealed (basically like any cough medicine in the foil packaging that you push the pill out of the back....)

thanks
 

bassgod272

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thanks bass. I actually have a weird question in a way. I have some nolva and tarom that i have had for quite some time now. It expires in 07, but has always been kept in a dark, cool place. Would this be ok to still use? The packs are still individually sealed (basically like any cough medicine in the foil packaging that you push the pill out of the back....)

thanks
since you have the tablets, it is considered a medication. most uers use research chems, not the real thing. so this gets tricky. medications(in the tablet/capsule/granule form) are typically "good" for about 6 yrs or so after they are manufactured. i'm a certified pharmacy technician and know that the FDA uses exp dates as a "just to be safe" measure. HOWEVER, things such as tetracyclines and a few other meds actually break down into TOXIC compounds after they expire. nolva, to my knowledge, is not one of those medications, but i can research a bit in our pharmacy's computer for you and get back with you tomorrow to be 100% sure. for all other medications, they don't eally "go bad" per se. they lose potency. 10% after expiration to be exact. since yours are 1 year past expiration, they may need to be dosed higher. 10% loss of potency is an odd number to have to compensate for while speaking of tablets. if you have the time to spare, let me research a bit and get back to you. 10% is minimal and IMO if all is well in nolva's exp info that i find, then just keep the doses the same at 20/20/10/10. users have used POST cycle support alone with an AI as their PCT for a cycle like yours with success, so there wouldnt be a need to worry.
 
msucurt

msucurt

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since you have the tablets, it is considered a medication. most uers use research chems, not the real thing. so this gets tricky. medications(in the tablet/capsule/granule form) are typically "good" for about 6 yrs or so after they are manufactured. i'm a certified pharmacy technician and know that the FDA uses exp dates as a "just to be safe" measure. HOWEVER, things such as tetracyclines and a few other meds actually break down into TOXIC compounds after they expire. nolva, to my knowledge, is not one of those medications, but i can research a bit in our pharmacy's computer for you and get back with you tomorrow to be 100% sure. for all other medications, they don't eally "go bad" per se. they lose potency. 10% after expiration to be exact. since yours are 1 year past expiration, they may need to be dosed higher. 10% loss of potency is an odd number to have to compensate for while speaking of tablets. if you have the time to spare, let me research a bit and get back to you. 10% is minimal and IMO if all is well in nolva's exp info that i find, then just keep the doses the same at 20/20/10/10. users have used POST cycle support alone with an AI as their PCT for a cycle like yours with success, so there wouldnt be a need to worry.
sounds awesome. Obviously the cycle is going to be pretty light, so i think it would be fine. I really appreciate it. Although I could just go ahead and buy some new nolva and know that i have legit chems.

Thanks for your help.
 
rabican

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is

Lean Xtreme: 3/day (start day 15)
I3C : 600 mgs/ed
6-oxo: tapered down starting in week 4--300ed /200ed /100ed

even needed for this cycle?
 

bassgod272

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is

Lean Xtreme: 3/day (start day 15)
I3C : 600 mgs/ed
6-oxo: tapered down starting in week 4--300ed /200ed /100ed

even needed for this cycle?
the lean extreme will make him leaner and help to not put on fat during PCT while keeping cals high. the I3C lowers bad estrogen, so it's a great PCT item IMO. is it truly NEEDED, not really. it does serve a purpose though. the 6-oxo taper IS required. when using an AI and SERM, the AI needs to be tapered back down to prevent an estrogen rebound from happening. if you just drop it all together at its highest dose, estro will rebound after that outside estrogen control is gone, since it has been suppressed for 4 weeks.
 
rabican

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why is the i3c needed if hes using 6oxo? aren't both these AI products, esp for a light hdrol cycle...?
 

bassgod272

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the lean extreme will make him leaner and help to not put on fat during PCT while keeping cals high. the I3C lowers bad estrogen, so it's a great PCT item IMO. is it truly NEEDED, not really. it does serve a purpose though. the 6-oxo taper IS required. when using an AI and SERM, the AI needs to be tapered back down to prevent an estrogen rebound from happening. if you just drop it all together at its highest dose, estro will rebound after that outside estrogen control is gone, since it has been suppressed for 4 weeks.
it's not.
 
rabican

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...iv heard Diindolylmethane (DIM) is better than i3c.
Would a product like Diesel Test Hardcore (which has DIM) work as both a AI and test booster for a light cycle like this?
 

bassgod272

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...iv heard Diindolylmethane (DIM) is better than i3c.
Would a product like Diesel Test Hardcore (which has DIM) work as both a AI and test booster for a light cycle like this?
IMHO for ME anyways, i'd be perfectly comfortable running PCS and DTH as my PCT for this cycle. depends on how prone to suppression and shutdown you are. everybody's different. an AI and test booster are KIND OF the same thing. they both lower estrogen while also increasing teststerone. AI's just do this at a MUCH higher extent. so i guess the answer to your question would be yes. i'm using it now during my PCT for a p-plex/SD bridge cycle. it's being used as my AI/test booster :)
 
mattikus

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The people that say DIM is better than I3C stand to make $$$ with the success of DIM. Very biased.
 
msucurt

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The people that say DIM is better than I3C stand to make $$$ with the success of DIM. Very biased.
I think I am going to stick with my above PCT for the hdrol. Obviously add in creatine, maybe some ZMA.
 

Rob Awesome

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I'm sorry if I missed it, but do you have a liver support during PCT?

And it's been recommended to run Cycle Support for a week prior to the actual cycle to ensure the Milk Thistle/Silymarin are 'IN' your system.. additionally running the liver support during PCT since Nolvadex (Tamox) is harsh on liver enzymes.

Although I'm prone to "pimp" Cycle Support as an AI rep & as a previous user, but there are other liver supports out there as well if you don't wish to continue use of Cycle Support.
 
msucurt

msucurt

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I'm sorry if I missed it, but do you have a liver support during PCT?

And it's been recommended to run Cycle Support for a week prior to the actual cycle to ensure the Milk Thistle/Silymarin are 'IN' your system.. additionally running the liver support during PCT since Nolvadex (Tamox) is harsh on liver enzymes.

Although I'm prone to "pimp" Cycle Support as an AI rep & as a previous user, but there are other liver supports out there as well if you don't wish to continue use of Cycle Support.
Yes, I am running Cycle Support during my hdrol cycle (i loaded with Cycle Support about 4 days before i started my hdrol, which was today - monday). I will use 2 scoops throughout my 4 week cycle, and im not sure about using it PCT....

Should I run:
1) Post Cycle Support
2) Cycle Support
3) Both ,or at least some type of liver support.
 
dmangiarelli

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The people that say DIM is better than I3C stand to make $$$ with the success of DIM. Very biased.
Also, most of the research is based on taking extremely high doses of I3C and for extended periods of time (over 1 year in most cases). Since most runs are about 30 days in length and run at 300-400 mgs/day, the toxicity issues seem to be overstated.
 

bassgod272

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Yes, I am running Cycle Support during my hdrol cycle (i loaded with Cycle Support about 4 days before i started my hdrol, which was today - monday). I will use 2 scoops throughout my 4 week cycle, and im not sure about using it PCT....

Should I run:
1) Post Cycle Support
2) Cycle Support
3) Both ,or at least some type of liver support.
i'd just run it afterward bro. Dr. Hauser(dinoii) has sid thistle hinders gains and negatively affects your androgen receptors while using ph/aas. i have also read in a PDR we have in the pharmacy that "milk thistle should not be taken while also using male hormones." i vote for #3. SAM-e is costly, but great for the liver, mood, joints, and much more. NAC is a good liver supp also. powerful antioxidants really help out the liver when filtering out miscellaneous substances. there are actually better options that thistle.
 
msucurt

msucurt

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i'd just run it afterward bro. Dr. Hauser(dinoii) has sid thistle hinders gains and negatively affects your androgen receptors while using ph/aas. i have also read in a PDR we have in the pharmacy that "milk thistle should not be taken while also using male hormones." i vote for #3. SAM-e is costly, but great for the liver, mood, joints, and much more. NAC is a good liver supp also. powerful antioxidants really help out the liver when filtering out miscellaneous substances. there are actually better options that thistle.
So, im a little confused. You are saying not to run the CYCLE SUPPORT during my cycle of H-DROL?

So, during my run of hdrol (50/50/50/50), i should just stick with the hdrol and....

cycle support
NAC


Just a little confused. I dont see where 2 scoops of cycle support during hdrol run would diminish returns....maybe im wrong, just doesnt add up to me

thanks though
 

bassgod272

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So, im a little confused. You are saying not to run the CYCLE SUPPORT during my cycle of H-DROL?

So, during my run of hdrol (50/50/50/50), i should just stick with the hdrol and....

cycle support
NAC


Just a little confused. I dont see where 2 scoops of cycle support during hdrol run would diminish returns....maybe im wrong, just doesnt add up to me

thanks though
well cycle support contains milk thistle, which negatively affects androgen receptors while the user is also taking exegenous male hormones aka ph or aas. your liver regenerates itself, so taking the cycle support as a pre-load and during PCT would be sufficient. NAC and other good antioxidants will provide great liver support while ON cycle and not negatively affect andogen receptors. check out dr. d's how to pulse orals thread. he actually recommends some other supps besides thistle as it is far from being the best liver support supplement.
 
msucurt

msucurt

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well cycle support contains milk thistle, which negatively affects androgen receptors while the user is also taking exegenous male hormones aka ph or aas. your liver regenerates itself, so taking the cycle support as a pre-load and during PCT would be sufficient. NAC and other good antioxidants will provide great liver support while ON cycle and not negatively affect andogen receptors. check out dr. d's how to pulse orals thread. he actually recommends some other supps besides thistle as it is far from being the best liver support supplement.
Im taking Cycle Support & NAC throughout my cycle of hdrol. Im not sure how much NAC though? Any ideas?
 
msucurt

msucurt

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2 servings of Cycle Support has 1200 mgs NAC in it ...
Duh, I guess i dont need the extra NAC caps i took last nite. I will just shutup and know that CYCLE SUPPORT has everything i need.....just take 2 scoops/day and go about your business.

:dance::dance::dance:

:woohoo::woohoo::woohoo:
 

dpfisher

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I'm curious why milk thistle is in cycle support if it inhibits gains, does anyone else have more to add to this?
 

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