- 02-10-2008, 09:16 AM
I was always under the assumption that SERMS were as legal to purchase as a container of protein. I have recently started to see alot of people posting that SERMS are illegal. Im abit confused, can the DEA come in and pop you for ordering a research chem? Has anyone every been arrested for having a serm shipped to their residence? ALso does anyone know if the defense that im only using this as a research chemical would work esp if i dont have a basement full of lab rats ?
- 02-10-2008, 11:36 AM
For one, IF you have a basement full of lab rats and are caught in possession of a regulated substance like a research chemical, IF you claim you are using for animal-based research, you BETTER have a FDA permit to conduct animal-testing.
SERMS and research chems in general are ILLEGAL for human consumption/use.
- 02-10-2008, 01:34 PM
02-10-2008, 04:59 PM
I'm not an attorney, but have done a little searching under my state laws and have found that these liquid SERMS, clen, AI's, etc fall under what's called "Legend drugs". In my state it is ILLEGAL to buy these. I have recently decided to stop purchase of anymore.
This is relatively a new area that law enforcement is cracking down on, mainly on the distributors end, not the everyday guy buying a bottle here and there. I won't chance it anymore.
Look under your state statutes and search the words "legend drugs".
02-10-2008, 06:40 PM
They're illegal to buy without a script but they arn't scheduled, so i'm pretty sure even if you did get busted with them, they can't do anything to you..
02-10-2008, 09:38 PM
02-10-2008, 09:44 PM
Here's a post that Crowler references this topic. Apparently he's spoken to Rick Collins ( Rick Collins Online - About Rick Collins ):
RcB Since 09-06-2011 20:55 EST, Post 49
02-10-2008, 09:46 PM
There is no law in existence that states that you cannot consume research chemicals. A legend drug IS a prescription drug. They are one in the same. These are however NOT prescription medications. They are RESEARCH CHEMICALS intended for lab use ONLY. Also, it is ILLEGAL to test any chemicals on animals. You must use TISSUE SAMPLES in your lab. Don't believe me? This info comes from a former research chem company owner.(not me btw)
02-10-2008, 09:50 PM
Interesting. Apparantly the guy who owned a research chem company was wrong? Looks like i'll have to find a doctor. Until I see proof that trans-res can prevent gyno like serms do, i'm sticking with serms.
02-11-2008, 07:48 AM
02-11-2008, 07:53 AM
Maybe we should all go find good "understanding" doctors and the legal worries would go away.
02-11-2008, 01:05 PM
02-12-2008, 09:16 AM
02-12-2008, 10:40 AM
02-12-2008, 10:51 AM
Bassgod recanted in his very next post...I'm guessing he saw my post about Rick Collins as we posted very closely together.
RcB Since 09-06-2011 20:55 EST, Post 49
02-12-2008, 02:42 PM
IDPH, Penny Severns Breast and Cervical Cancer Research Fund
DOD BCRP; Grant Number: DAMD-17-99-9334, T32CA 70085
Avon Foundation; Grant Number: SPORE CA89018-01
Resveratrol • ER • agonistic activity • gene arrays • p21CIP1/WAF1 • breast cancer cells
Resveratrol (Res) is a phytoestrogen found in grapes and present in red wine. Res has been shown to function as an estrogen receptor (ER) agonist, but it remains unclear whether it may also exert antagonist activity. Our aim was to study the effects of Res at both the molecular (TGF gene activation) and the cellular (cell growth) levels in breast cancer cells stably transfected with wild-type (wt) ER(D351) and mutant (mut) ER (D351Y). TGF mRNA induction was used as a specific marker of estradiol (E2) responsiveness. Res caused a concentration-dependent (10-8-10-4 M) stimulation of TGF mRNA, indicating that it acts as an estrogen agonist in these cell lines. The pure antiestrogen ICI 182,780 (ICI) blocked Res-induced activation of TGF, consistent with action through an ER-mediated pathway. Further studies that combined treatments with E2 and Res showed that Res does not act as an antagonist in the presence of various (10-11-10-8 M) concentrations of E2. To determine whether Res can be classified as a type I or type II estrogen (Jordan et al., Cancer Res 2001;61:6619-23,), we examined Res with the D351G ER in the TGF assay and found that Res belongs to the type I estrogens. Both Res and E2 had concentration-dependent growth inhibitory effects in cells expressing wtER and D351Y ER. Although the pure antiestrogen ICI blocked the growth inhibitory effects of E2, it did not block the inhibitory effects of Res, suggesting that the antiproliferative effects of Res also involve ER-independent pathways. Interestingly, Res differentially affected the levels of ER protein in these 2 cell lines: Res down-regulated wtER levels while significantly up-regulating the amount of mutD351Y ER. Co-treatment with ICI resulted in strongly reduced ER levels in both cell lines. Gene array studies revealed Res-induced up-regulation of more than 80 genes, among them a profound activation of p21CIP1/WAF1, a gene associated with growth arrest. The p21CIP1/WAF1 protein levels measured by Western blotting confirmed Res-induced significant up-regulation of this protein in both cell lines. In summary, Res acts as an ER agonist at low doses but also activates ER-independent pathways, some of which inhibit cell growth.
02-12-2008, 02:49 PM
What the hell is happening to AM? This is real billsh!t. I think ANY company rep who pushes their products over FICTION and shi! which has NEVER been proven should be BANNED. You tell people who just did a cycle of Superdrol to get post cycle support and they'll need no prescription SERM? You send people to screw up their bodies & lives for that matter so you can continue to get your free supplements from AI? WTF... I love the company & love the products but PCS WILL NOT recover ANYONE from a cycle of any moderately strong PH or GEAR without a proper PCT (Tamox, Torem, etc). Since I own a home remodeling company maybe I should start telling people who live here in PA (snowing, 10 degrees that past few days) that they don't need roofs - they'll be safe & fine without them. Instead just buy more siding from me or a new kitchen for $25,000. What the hell it'll make me more...
02-17-2008, 04:42 PM
Don't get me wrong I would much rather take a natural supp over eating a fcuking research chem from a some what inconspicuous company any-day, if it in-fact did produce the same results. But I have not yet seen this proven IMO...
02-17-2008, 04:46 PM
02-17-2008, 05:28 PM
02-17-2008, 05:42 PM
02-17-2008, 05:56 PM
02-17-2008, 06:17 PM
This is the first time I've seen this response. While I appreciate your reply Ziquor (as we both know there's no hard feelings), I'd have to say that it went somewhat off on a tangent. All I said was that it has been advised against purchasing research chems by Rick Collins. FWIR, there have been some busts on some research chem sites as of late. What will come of it, who knows?
I agree that a RX SERM should always be the first choice. It does appear that pulsing or short straight epi cycles may be okay without a SERM. The same goes for the Halodrol clones.
There have been a couple of cases of guys PMing me that were about to start post cycle therapy and absolutely would not purchase a SERM. I suggested that they at least use something like PCS, but I try and always suggest a SERM first. Just today I told somebody on a PM not to run a superdrol clone b/c they didn't have access to a RX SERM.
This is part of a PM from today at 11:17 AM:
I have to study now; later...Oh, and I wouldn't feel comfortable telling somebody to take superdrol or its clones without having a SERM for post cycle therapy....
RcB Since 09-06-2011 20:55 EST, Post 49
02-17-2008, 06:22 PM
This thread has turned into a "My pee pee is bigger than your pee pee". Remember that argumentum ad hominem, is a logical fallacy and does not prove your point.
08-05-2012, 08:13 PM
I am going to do a short (4) week straight Epi cycle either 20/30/30/40 or 20/30/40/40. This PH alone stacked with nothing else PH wise would be ok for an OTC PTC then since it is only Epi and going just for four weeks? I will use resveratol 800 MG a day and Ease - Daa. Tell me what you think......
08-07-2012, 08:42 PM
No. Trust me, I just ran Epi with an underdosed SERM and nearly had rebound problems. Luckily I caught it quickly. Epi is an active compound bro... You need more than a OTC PCT... Saying "ONLY EPI" made me lol...Originally Posted by Annagabe
I can't believe that God put us on this earth to be ordinary. - Lou Holtz
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