[Navydave]

Thanks for educating a newb and I'll start putting together the CORRECT PCT.

I'll definitely come back here and research before trying any thing else and I promise to use the search function.

Have a great Friday!

[alainbballing]

The wierder thing is that Evolutions LAbs basically lists all there products as being for PCT Im not sure how many people will be getting hurt from that

[Force of Green]

Originally Posted by alainbballing

Run arimEvol should not be used in your post cycle therapy... Good legal sub for a serm from what Im hearing is AI's Post Cycle Support, and throw some AX Advance PCT in there and u should be ok ...read the beginning of the thread to see what else u need.and if all else fails use the search function

Why the Advanced PCT? It's an over-priced cocktail of a low dose steroidal AI, L-Histadine (come on), and 50mg of a good anti-oxidant 'grapeseed extract... Another flopper by AX.

Save yourself a few bucks and just get another bottle of Post Cycle Support and run that double the dose (4 and 4).

[alainbballing]

Some times the simplest answer is the way to go...Dont know why i didnt think of just doubling on the post cycle support.. was over thinking the problem if that makes sense..how u feel about adding some Dermacrine Sustain to that mix?

[UNCfan1]

Originally Posted by alainbballing

Some times the simplest answer is the way to go...Dont know why i didnt think of just doubling on the post cycle support.. was over thinking the problem if that makes sense..how u feel about adding some Dermacrine Sustain to that mix?

If u have both use them together instead of doubling PCS. I think that would be awesome, one is oral and one is trans. If one doesn't work the other should LOL I kid.

[atnartist]

Thanks very much, finally some straight forward no bull teaching.

[coop]

Hey Guys

I'm taking .075ml of anastrozole EOD on a regular basis

And 1ml a day for a week of tamoxifen only if my gyno acts up

Can you tell me if this is proper?

I'm on a beefed up dose of TRT

Thanks
coop

[thesinner]

TRT protocols are going to be a lot different than what are being discussed in this thread.

[bruin124]

I'm looking into running a cycle of epistane/havoc. How do I go about getting a SERM? Is it something my doctor will just give me? If I can't get a SERM can I run AI Post Cycle Support, Dermacrine Sustain, and AX Triple Stack as my PCT? I plan on running AI Cycle Support during my epi/hav cycle.

[coop]

Originally Posted by thesinner

TRT protocols are going to be a lot different than what are being discussed in this thread.

what do you mean by that?

coop

[thesinner]

Originally Posted by coop

what do you mean by that?

coop

A lot of times I get Q's from people on TRT as prescribed by their doctor. They read up on testosterone and post cycle therapy for anabolic use, and compare to what their doctor has planned out for them. Consequently, they think the doc is full of **** because the two protocols (Doping and TRT) have very little in common.

[comacho]

thesinner,

on page 1 i think you said you want to keep estrogen level high post cycle?

do you not like AI then?

i thought once exo T was over, I would 'dry out' high estrogen and lower the cortisol (if i can) to show the body that all the hormones are down. Should kickstart the body faster in developing all those hormones again.

like everyone has discussed previously,,, your T goes up, E and cortisol and other hormones will go up as well to match the activity of androgen. So when it's time to recover, your body sees that the T is low, but if other hormones are still high like estrogen it may take longer to recover than when all the hormones are low. I hope that's not confusing.

Not saying the estrogen should be zero for too long, maybe two weeks of aggressive treatment with AI or anything similar, while doing clomid on top of that maybe better dont you think?

SERM will block high estrogen activity at certain receptors but i think the body will still recognize the high level of estrogen.

[thesinner]

AI's are not good. There's a few schemes where you can phase from a SERM to a weak AI, which work. But an AI right off the bat is pretty much worthless, IMHO.

Estrogen, believe it or not, is an important hormone for optimal muscle growth. By blocking certain pathways you don't want it to go down, such as ER's in the hypothalamus, will trigger an increase in steroidogenesis, to get your androgen concentrations back up, and allow your steroid hormones to more quickly normalize.

[comacho]

Hey thesinner,

I understand that E is good for growth and GH production etc, no doubt.

but too much is bad and will shut you down further right?

A + B = C

too much substrate and/or product can down regulate the enzyme. High amount of estrogen (even if your Test is low) will tell the brain to shut down your nuts.

if i were to take my gf's birthcontrol pills, my nuts will get shut down because the brain thinks i have too much androgen being aromatized eventhough i dont.

however I can see where you are getting at though. If SERM is in place to block out certain ER's in the brain, it will do its job telling the brain that the estrogen is low and it will produce LH/FSH and etc to start making hormones again therefore AI on top of SERM is redundant. Am I getting that scenario right?

not trying to hijack the thread, if you feel taht i should email you then let me know, trying to figure this out with more details why you think its useless : )

If AI was used to control down some of the estrogen prior then only little amount of clomid will be needed dont you think? just enough to tickle the brain. I think that could cut out clomid sides...

also could you explain further how non aromatizing androgens can cause gyno? is it progesterone related? does the body make estrogen out of other pathway? if so how come people look hard and less bloated on DHT derivatives? when people complain about gyno using such products, does it happen in the end? or during? if happens afterwards, how is that possible when a person's nuts are shrunk producing very little natural test and there are no exogenous estrogen in the body already?

thanks in advance

[core1983]

Hi,

Im new to the Anabolic game, ive been training for around 3 years and recently have been talking to somebody about Epistane, I asked Bodybuilding.com what I needed in the way of support supplements and they recommended Milk Thistle and IDA Post Cycle Tabs, I was worried that I needed more than this but they didn’t want to say because they have to be careful of what they "advise" etc (although they are always very helpful). At the moment I am just taking NO-Xplode, Celltech Hardcore and **** loads of Protein but would like to try Epistane out and move up the ladder some what.

All this information on Anabolics just isn’t available to us in the UK and I really find it hard to digest all the names of things and to understand all the cycle routines and what. I was only going to run Epistane for a month and it comparison to some of the above anabolics mentioned I don’t know how powerful it is and how seriously I need to take the PCT.

Basically, is Milk Thistle and PC Tabs enough? what brands and products can you recommend for me to take after/during my first cycle with Epistane. Obviously I want to do things right.

Please help the new boy!

Cheers guys!

[Tom 185]

Originally Posted by core1983

Hi,

Im new to the Anabolic game, ive been training for around 3 years and recently have been talking to somebody about Epistane, I asked Bodybuilding.com what I needed in the way of support supplements and they recommended Milk Thistle and IDA Post Cycle Tabs, I was worried that I needed more than this but they didn’t want to say because they have to be careful of what they "advise" etc (although they are always very helpful). At the moment I am just taking NO-Xplode, Celltech Hardcore and **** loads of Protein but would like to try Epistane out and move up the ladder some what.

All this information on Anabolics just isn’t available to us in the UK and I really find it hard to digest all the names of things and to understand all the cycle routines and what. I was only going to run Epistane for a month and it comparison to some of the above anabolics mentioned I don’t know how powerful it is and how seriously I need to take the post cycle therapy.

Basically, is Milk Thistle and PC Tabs enough? what brands and products can you recommend for