Complex PCT - help needed
03-26-2007 11:27 AM
Complex PCT - finished and blood tests are in!
Ive put together a 4 week post cycle therapy plan for the cycle im just about ending this wednesday. i have a whole bunch of stuff lying around so hopefully this is the best way to use them.
first a little background on the cycle just ending.
was out of shape since june 06. (got married in oct'06 so got very busy) so i needed a a plan to get back in shape real fast.
weeks 1 to 2 : powerfull,camphibolic , NHA, sesathin. adipokintex/stim-x switching
week 3 to 4 : added light to moderate doses of m-4ohn, added ala 3 times daily, stopped powerfull.
* worked out great and dropped from 90KG to 86.5KG while gaining strength and definition. all good so far.
week 5 to 9 :stop m4-ohn, stop activate and nha. Add superdrol at 20mg daily(except for a few days in week 4 at 30mg but sides were becoming noticable and i didnt like that. nothing too bad like m-1t though).
added dcp(morning, pre workout), cycle support(great great product - morning and night), sesathin at lunch. AP before lunch and post workout.
cycle summary results:
since week 1 and ive been seeing tremendous results. i have done a lot of cycles before and i honestly have to say, especially considering week 1 was my return to the gym after a lay-off) that it has been phenominal. The results ive experienced have come in at least twice as fast
current weight is hovering around 91KG, looking twice as big, and strength being around 80% of my old max's.
looking very defined and even my gut has been shrinking quite nicely.
sides were limited to random muscle cramps and lethergy, from managable to quite annoying. but its expected. i feel 4 weeks on superdrol after all that has been perfect. pushing just enough ;-)
this is the trend i want to continue for post cycle therapy.
i had a full blood panel done pre anything(straight after recovering from a nasty virus too )
and ill be doing same panel first day of post cycle therapy just to check everything is a-ok.
I did not and will not be doing hormone tests again, as i cant afford this right now. most likely i will do these end of post cycle therapy by 2 weeks. the test/free test/e2 cost more than the whole panel!
anyways, id really love comments on the following post cycle therapy. i know some of these things are not standard protocols like clomid. that is something im trying new here as i hated clomid's emotional effects. so bear that in mind ;-)
post cycle therapy:
pre post cycle therapy:
* 3 days before post cycle therapy start : 1 dose activate, 1 dose RXT befor bed
* 1 day before post cycle therapy start : start clomid at 50mg/day with 3 ON / 3 OFF dosing
post cycle therapy start:
* start usp labs' camphibolic
* DHEA at : week 1 to 2 150mg, week 3 to 4 100mg daily
* DS's Rebound reloaded at : week 1 to 2 1 pill daily, week 3 to 4 2 pills
* Avants super absolved on midsection 1 to 2 times daily
* continue AI's cycle support untill it runs out (will sustitute with RYR/coq10/ala/guggle combo)
* AP lunch and with post workout shake
* day 1 to 10 DS's LX at 1 pill at night
* day 11 to 28 Retain at 100mg
** day 4 to 11 : Nolva at 30mg daily
**day 12 to 19 : Nolva at 20mg daily
start of week 2:
add powerfull at reg dosing
add adipokinetix/stim-x at 1 to 2 doses per day as needed
* the above will be accompanied by an increase in calories during same period.
at end of post cycle therapy i will evaluate its success and consider repeating the 4 weeks on powerfull,nha and low dose m4-ohn/m-dien for an extreme cut(depending how my midsection looks by then ofcourse.
finally my thoughts on what ive used:
* powerfull : absolutely amazing, the subtle effect on mood and energy is worth the money alone. happy happy and sore all the time!
* m-4ohn : great little supp. perfect aid for that little extra shove in the gym, good mood lift and no side effects.
* AP : havent used by itself so cant decide for sure. but judging from my old superdrol cycles i did feel that nutrient partitioning was improved. this will def show while i increase cals on post cycle therapy so watch this space.
* cycle support : amazing! all major effects of superdrol were kept at a minimum.(burning pee, sporadic cramps, lower back pumps etc) will see more hard facts when i do my blood panel.
fyi. the cramps i did feel i attribute to the combo of superdrol and dcp most likely.
* adipo/stim-x : great, very comparable. they both make me sweat a nasty chemical odor though. so i gotta find a solution for that.
* i added stevia as sugar replacement and NOW's pro biotic blend. i feel they both helped a great deal.
any comments are appreciated especially on retain as ive never used it before, but from what ive gathered it would be a good fit up there?
Link to my previous cycle and blood test results-june 06
Last edited by djremix; 05-09-2007 at 04:56 AM.
Reason: corrections and addition
03-29-2007 07:23 AM
Ok so ive done my blood tests today.
no hormones as i am out of money and they are not very relevant here. ill keep those untill a few days after end of pct.
ill have results in 6 hours...
03-30-2007 06:11 PM
Blood test results
Sorry...its the weekend.
here are the results:
how to read the results: XXX : XXX as below
Value today(1st day of post cycle therapy) : value day right before the cycle
* normal range(for 31 year old males)
* Total cholesterol:
92 : 127 : optimal = < 200
45 : 65 : (optimal =<150)
13 : 42 : (optimal =>60)
70: 72 : (optimal =<100)
158 : 26 : (upto 40)
83 : 23 : (upto 37)
5 : 27 : (9 to 40)
* bilirubin Total serum:
0.75 : 0.31 : (upto 1)
* bilirubin direct serum:
0.28 : 0.3 : (upto 0.25)
* Creatinine :
83 : 92 (normal range is 62 to 120)
* uric acid :
3 : 6.7 (range=3 to 7)
everything seems as expected.(remember m4-hn 2 weeks + 4 weeks superdrol.
i guess the elevated liver enzymes are typical values of when im on. but as my old cycle tests show, everything goes back to normal, at least for me on SD and PP/m-4ohn) combo's
Kinda wondering about my low total cholesterol vales. its quite low compared to my old values on cycle.
So i changed the clomid dosages first 3 days, and i am comfortable with them at day 1 50 day 2 100 and day 3 150mg at night.then 3 day off.
i took a chance and it worked out great for me, i can tolerate 150mg with some obvious mood side effects, but my gamble worked, and it seems i am more calm now in dealing with stress etc. so side effects are working in my favour for a change!
what does low total Choleterol indicate?
Could it be I was not eating enough?
Last edited by djremix; 03-31-2007 at 12:00 PM.
Reason: Added change in clomid dosages
04-03-2007 03:41 AM
now im a bit confused as some of these results do not add up with my previous cycles.
i hope anyone can shed some light?
so for results on day 1 of post cycle therapy (before starting any post cycle therapy supps except for 50mg clomid the day before)
i also did all tests at 8.30 am both times
this time : last time
92 : 154 <--this cycle total cholesterol decreased!! baseline is around 120ish
45 : 65
70 : 141
do you see a pattern? could i infere this is all from the cycle support i added? or maybe nutrition? (i had more shakes than solid food this time...)
liver values are similar. somewhat lower than before. BUT this time i had cycle support and it was 8 weeks m-4ohn/superdrol while last time it was 7 weeks almost with PP/SD, so thats an issue too.
other differance include:
bilirubin Total serum:
0.75 : 1.52
bilirubin direct serum:
0.28 : 0.51
* first time ever my billirubin results were within normal ranges. i am lost on why..
* Creatinine :
92 : 104
ok so the above means my kidney were actually better off this time? less creatinine = better kidney function right? cycle support effects? if so then wow
3 : 6.3
now i know what these mean, what i dont know is why there is such a huge differance?
Can anybody please shed some light? full details and cycle logs are in same thread.
p.s. ive noticed a marked decreas of that calming effect on the 3 days off the clomid...hmmnnn
04-05-2007 09:34 AM
anyways, for those interested. this whole cycle has been going EXTREMLY well.
now ending week 1, while noticably decreasing fat and no apparent loss in muscle mass, probably the contrary as all my lifts has seen an increase this week.
guess all that talk on continued effect of anabolics and delayed cortisol seems true.
liver values are down to normal, didnt do lipids as the liver ones were free (made a bet with the lab...doubt they like me now)
energy is back up, back pumps, cramps disappeared.
libido is a strange little beast. everything works well psyically but i think its an emotional thing in my case.
this is turning out to be even better than my previous sd/pp cycle.
04-11-2007 08:53 AM
Day 11 PCT, everything is going well. started nolva at 10mg yesterday and will run for 12 days going upto 20 and taper back to 10.
clomid use was 50 100 150mg then 3 days off and repeat.
strength is still going up, quite surprisingly though, im lifting more on everything everytime! and my overall weight is dropping, with visible preferance on fat. about 1/2 kg every 2 days.
i take it this is a great indication that im not loosing much muscle.(especially strength increases)
calories are around maintanance(except a couple of easter meals )
I would wager all my liver values are back to normal too.(just retested the GPT for free) judging by urine color and frequency.not scientific but consistant with my previous blood test frenzy testing!
continuing pct as usuall then taking a week or two break. afterwards depending on where i am maybe ill run an nha type stack. maybe with the new usplabs divanil extract. had great success with activate twice now.
04-15-2007 10:17 PM
Hmm, sup man? I remember replying to this over at AX Glad to see things are going well. I will follow along on this a bit.
04-16-2007 02:45 AM
Everything is cool.
i dont wanna sound too worried for nothing. but its going a little bit too well.
im increasing weights at an unexplainable rate. every excercise every time i go up in it.
dont make sense at all. I am fully recovered in less than 10 days, and doing maintanance cals now. alongside adipokintetix.
not complaining at all though
04-16-2007 04:15 AM
stop making people jealous man. seriously!
Originally Posted by djremix
04-16-2007 04:50 AM
Originally Posted by RisingAgainst
hold on the jealosy as im sure you'll be dropping a tear or two for my liver and lipids when i attempt to pulse m1-t
05-05-2007 08:02 AM
ok so for everyone following this thread, i plopped down my cash(goodbye trying some new supps) and got full blood panel + free test + E2. full panel will be down tonight and free test till tuesday.
fingures crossed, this pct was anything but standard and pretty minimalist in terms of dosages so...
05-06-2007 05:45 AM
quite pleased is an understatement!
considering the cycle heres the full results of my blood tests.
(only free test remaining untill tuesday)
So here are the values for the bloodwork I did
Read as follows:
<old value before start of cycle> : <new value 1 week after end of pct?> : <normal range>
Fasting glucose (mg/dl)
4.27 : 4.77 : 3.9 - 6.1
92 : 92 : 62 – 106
Uric acid: (mg/dl)
6.7 : 5.4 : 3 – 7
Cholesterol : (mg/dl)
127 : 130 : <200
65 : 38 : <150
42 : 43 : >60
72 : 79 : <100
26 : 36 : upto 40
GOT : (U/L)
23 : 37 : upto 37
27 : 13 : 9 – 40
Alkaline phosphatase: (U/L)
124 : 49 : 40 – 129
Bilirubin Total: (mg/dl)
0.31 : 0.88 : upto 1
Bilirubin Direct: (mg/dl)
0.3 : 0.14 : upto 0.25
Total protein: (gm/dl)
7.2 : 7.5 : 6.6 – 8.7
Albumin : (G/dl)
4.8 : 5 : 3.5 – 5
2.4 : 2.5 : 2 – 3.5
This test: 26.2pg/ml (normal range for males : <77 )
Last test from dec 2006 : 68pg/ml
Free test :
This test (till Tuesday)
Last test from Dec 2006 : 18.1 (normal range 8.8 to 27) <-my pre cycle result dec 2006 was : 10.4
so considering my cycle(2 weeks m-4ohn+nha / 4 weeks SD / 4 weeks pct with nha and non standard clomid/nolva + minimal Rebound/rebound reloaded dosages) id say the results are great, especially E2, with less dosages i managed to half the amount of estrogen after pct.
now i can lay off the AI's and finish the last week of activate alone.
bilirubin values are strange..
lipids are great though hdl could be higher...
liver values are excellent, considering i had a 3 days virus a couple of days before the test(in the week following pct)
Cant wait for free test to come back, if results are as encouraging ill be starting a nice pulse next.
any comments are welcome
05-08-2007 08:06 AM
explaining why im so freaking hot all the time. DAMN!
Originally Posted by djremix
look at these results
Free Test : normal range for 18-39 year old male : 8.8 - 27 (31 - 94)
mine : 37.2 pg/ml or (130.2 pmol/L)
unbeleivable. im gonna continue this in the gonna pulse BIG TIME thread, here , not quite sure what the above result may translate to.
05-09-2007 03:56 PM
Nice recovery is all I can say. The liver values looked a little scary to me while in PCT, but everything seems to have come back nicely.
Originally Posted by djremix
05-10-2007 03:36 AM
yeah i know, to me too.
Originally Posted by phaeton66
but it turns out that liver values literally double the normal max are still not in a danger zone.
working out or drinking the same day will elevate your values.
i had a virus once that gave me the same values as i had while on cycle.
buttom lineanything less than double the normal max is just increased activity.(i.e. your liver is processing a steroid)
anything more than that, its overactivity and something to worry about.(you should see how much trouble i went through with my doc untill he finally admitted this.
alcoholics and liver diseased people have values 3 to 5 hundred times the normal max. and they are chronic.
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