[NathanKari]

This is the first time i am on pro-hormones and although i've done some reading before taking it, I need some help as far as PCT goes(there are very few logs for promagnon, and so i ask the obvious question, i applogize if they seem stupid).
body stats before cycle:
157 lbs , 8% bf
I am 3 weeks into a 4 week promagnon-25 cycle.
This is what I plan for PCT(some of it is what Gaspari recommends on his 'maximus' stack, the other part is what i gathered , in order to avoid an estrogen rebound)
I started taking novedex( 2 caps) from week 3. I am going to go upto 4 caps the next week(which is also the last week of my cycle)
Am going to taper off using novedex:
week 5-4 caps
week 6-3 caps
week 7- 2caps
I am also going to use Xtreme Lean at 3 caps a day, for the 3 weeks of PCT

Another question i'd like to ask is regarding the traning and nutrition in my PCT.
I am currently eating between 6000-7000 calories(clean) and not doing any cardio at all to keep my body in an anabolic state.
I'd like to know, whether i should continue to do that into PCT or, should i drop my calories and get some cardio.

[idunk42]

Ok first off, you should probably have some nolva on hand, because you are dealing with a PH. Novadex may not be sufficient for pct.

How tall are you by the way? At 157, I definitely think that you could have gained at least another 20lbs naturally. And at 157, if you were eating 6k-7k in calories, then you would blow up like crazy. I find this very hard to believe that you are taking in this many cals. IMO, I also dont find any benefit in starting your PCT while your still on cycle.

As for your question. You dont want to lower your cals during pct. Keep your cals normal (whatever it really is) and your volume low. I wouldnt suggest doing any cardio, but if you do any, keep it minimal.

[NathanKari]

Originally Posted by idunk42

Ok first off, you should probably have some nolva on hand, because you are dealing with a PH. Novadex may not be sufficient for pct.

How tall are you by the way? At 157, I definitely think that you could have gained at least another 20lbs naturally. And at 157, if you were eating 6k-7k in calories, then you would blow up like crazy. I find this very hard to believe that you are taking in this many cals. IMO, I also dont find any benefit in starting your PCT while your still on cycle.

As for your question. You dont want to lower your cals during pct. Keep your cals normal (whatever it really is) and your volume low. I wouldnt suggest doing any cardio, but if you do any, keep it minimal.

Hey thanks for the reply.
I should've probably been more specific when i started the thread, my bad.
I started the promagnon cycle at 157 lbs ( i am 5 feet 11 inches)and was leaning out the first 2 weeks. I was eating between 2000-2200 calories( i normally eat between 2500-3000 calories).
I gained a pound in the first 2 weeks and my bodyfat went down to 7.5%.
I am now bulking up in the last 2 weeks of the cycle( the reason i am bulking and cutting for 2 weeks, is coz, i read something about the androgenic cycle, i am not sure if that is what it is called, and wanted to give it a try).
I have been eating between 6000-7000 calories for the last 3 days(it is all clean, and trust me i am doing it, i am eating non stop all day, and it kinda makes me sick towards the end) and i have put on an additional 3 lbs, so that is a total of 4 lbs so far.
The reason i started with novedex while on the cycle is coz Gaspari's 'maximus' stack says it should be taken that way.
Since I have already started with novedex, do you recommend i stop taking it, or continue with it?
One of the members suggested that i start with novedex 5 days prior to the end of my cycle and continue with PCT for 4 weeks thereafter gradually tapering off the dosage. He also suggested that I stack it with nolva.
The reason i didn't include nolva is becasue, I read through a couple of other logs for promagnon and i don't think they did any nolva. I also know this one other guy who did this stuff without nolva.
So let me just sum it up , and correct me if i am wrong:
Stop novadex, start with it 5 days prior to the end of the cycle and stack it with nolva and lean Xtreme. carry on PCT for 4 weeks.
Since i normally eat between 2500-3000 cals, eat that for the PCT with no/minimal cardio.

[NathanKari]

anybody?

[RobDyson]

Originally Posted by NathanKari

Hey thanks for the reply.
So let me just sum it up , and correct me if i am wrong:
Stop novadex, start with it 5 days prior to the end of the cycle and stack it with nolva and lean Xtreme. carry on PCT for 4 weeks.
Since i normally eat between 2500-3000 cals, eat that for the PCT with no/minimal cardio.

1st, I can't believe you've gained such little weight on this cycle, since your caloric intake is insane. 2nd, how old are you, since if your on the younger side(20-23ish and younger) there would've been little benefit to using such a PH since your natural test is already quite high and you only weigh 157 pounds. 3rd, IMO, I would up your calories to at minimal 4000 since you seem to have a ridiculous metabolism(most people who would eat as much as you are eating would gain at least some weight from fat due to the caloric intakes. 4th, I would recommend stopping the Novedex, and use it with Nolva during PCT or cut i out entirely and either switch it w/ 6-oxo(there has been immense debate on the forums as to whether ATD is beneficial during PCT). Also, do you have all the support supp (i.e. RYR, Milk Thistle, Hawthorne berries etc)? Another recommendation would be to use some form of creatine in order to maintain the gains you've gotten. Hope this helps.

[NathanKari]

Originally Posted by RobDyson

1st, I can't believe you've gained such little weight on this cycle, since your caloric intake is insane. 2nd, how old are you, since if your on the younger side(20-23ish and younger) there would've been little benefit to using such a PH since your natural test is already quite high and you only weigh 157 pounds. 3rd, IMO, I would up your calories to at minimal 4000 since you seem to have a ridiculous metabolism(most people who would eat as much as you are eating would gain at least some weight from fat due to the caloric intakes. 4th, I would recommend stopping the Novedex, and use it with Nolva during PCT or cut i out entirely and either switch it w/ 6-oxo(there has been immense debate on the forums as to whether ATD is beneficial during PCT). Also, do you have all the support supp (i.e. RYR, Milk Thistle, Hawthorne berries etc)? Another recommendation would be to use some form of creatine in order to maintain the gains you've gotten. Hope this helps.

Thanks for the info bro, this was really helpful.
I should've started out with mentioning my age. I am 24.
I have all the support supp. I am using hawthorn berries, liver-x(which has milk thistle), CQ10, vitamin c and e,in addition to the other supps that i normally use (BCAA's etc)
I have also started using a creatine ester recently.
Like i said, I have only started eating between 6000-7000 calories for the past few days, trying to follow the androgenic(i am not sure if that is the name) diet, where you basically super-compensate for 2 weeks and then cut down for the next 2. And I have been blowing up, literally from all that food. i've managed to put on about 8lbs in the last 3 days(i'm sure a lot of it is just the water retention).
The only question I have is, i cannot get my hands on any nolva for the moment, but i am trying. But the guys who've done this before(promag 25) have said that they were fine without the nolva and managed with only novedex.
Also i am going to use Xtreme lean, which i believe is the same as 6-oxo, if not more powerful.

[idunk42]

Xtreme lean, which im sure you mean Lean Xtreme, and 6-oxo are completely different products. LX is for reducing cortisol levels and 6-oxo is an AI. Big difference man. If you didnt know this, then you probably shouldnt have done this cycle in the first place.

[NathanKari]

Originally Posted by idunk42

Xtreme lean, which im sure you mean Lean Xtreme, and 6-oxo are completely different products. LX is for reducing cortisol levels and 6-oxo is an AI. Big difference man. If you didnt know this, then you probably shouldnt have done this cycle in the first place.

My bad, what i meant was, novedex-xt is an AI and I am going to use Lean Xtreme in conjunction with that. Would that suffice or do i need the nolva?

[idunk42]

Definitely get your hands on some nolva. You might not end up needing it, but its better to be safe than sorry.

[NathanKari]

Originally Posted by idunk42

Definitely get your hands on some nolva. You might not end up needing it, but its better to be safe than sorry.

Thanks for the advice bro. This board has definitely helped me a lot. Peace

[Sharia]

Originally Posted by idunk42

Ok first off, you should probably have some nolva on hand, because you are dealing with a PH. Novadex may not be sufficient for post cycle therapy.

How tall are you by the way? At 157, I definitely think that you could have gained at least another 20lbs naturally. And at 157, if you were eating 6k-7k in calories, then you would blow up like crazy. I find this very hard to believe that you are taking in this many cals. IMO, I also dont find any benefit in starting your PCT while your still on cycle.

As for your question. You dont want to lower your cals during post cycle therapy. Keep your cals normal (whatever it really is) and your volume low. I wouldnt suggest doing any cardio, but if you do any, keep it minimal.

Hey Idunk, I have been doing a lot of research on Halodrol and found out about ProMagnon 25. Im curious, for me to gain size would you suggest promag or Halodrol? Right now I am 6'5" tall, 230 pounds and my goal is to hit 245 pounds. Which product will help better In your opinion?