Pct help

[james25]

Hi I'm 26, 13 stone, 6ft 1
I'm currently taking my first cycle of
200mg test cyp every week for 10 week
200mg equitest every week for 10 week
Anavar 4 tabs a day for the final 7 week

I've been advised to take
Nolvadex for 30 days and HCG

Would anyone recommend this?

Cheers guys

 

[biggiesmallz]

You want to take HCG either 250iu twice weekly throughout your cycle, or pin 1000 iu last 4 weeks of cycle split into two shots (500iu each)

HCG is suppressive to natural LH, so it suppresses the HPTA. Recovery doesn't start until you're off HCG.

If running HCG in cycle, start it 4 weeks in.

Nolva for 30 days should be fine for PCT, can even extend it another week if want

 

[james25]

So would I be ok to take HCG 2 weeks after my last pin.
I won't be taking during my cycle, I have 2 weeks left to juice then cycle over

Thanks for the help

 

[biggiesmallz]

Ya as far as I know HCG is funky, it has a fractory half-life (not sure if I phrased that right)... meaning it's bi-phasic, so two-part. In any case it's half life is something like up to 36 hrs, so you may want to stop your last HCG pin at least 3 days before starting PCT

 

[james25]

But if I don't take the HCG during my cycle. Will I be ok too take after I finish the cycle with the nolvadex.
Also if I take the HCG after my cycle how long would you recommend you take for?

Cheers

 

[biggiesmallz]

But if I don't take the HCG during my cycle. Will I be ok too take after I finish the cycle with the nolvadex.
Also if I take the HCG after my cycle how long would you recommend you take for?

Cheers

You don't really need HCG for a 12 week cycle, it becomes more important for something like a blast and cruise finisher... or a much longer AAS cycle, so-to-speak. For fairly shorter cycles, HCG is not even necessary. You would be more than fine with just a SERM PCT and maybe something like Erase overlapping the final weeks of the SERM and extending a couple of weeks past the SERM (so, 2-3 weeks after you stop using the SERM)

Can also add DAA or another functional test booster if want, but not entirely necessary. If the SERM is legit, that's all you should really need for recovery. The mild AI (preferrably suicidal) would just help lower estrogen a little, since SERMs raise circulating estrogen.

For a better understanding, if want, can check out this thread;
http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/237681-common-cures-treatments.html

It will give you a better idea of the functioning of SERMs/AIs

 

[biggiesmallz]

Also, if you take HCG after your cycle, or after PCT, keep in mind it suppresses natural LH production, because it mimics LH, so you would sort of have to do a mini-PCT afterwards, or wait for your natural LH production to restart, or return to normal, after HCG treatment. So I would advise not using it post-cycle on it's own, simply because it suppresses the HPTA

 

[james25]

Cheers biggiesmallz
Il look into SERM's all the information is muchly appreciated

 

[james25]

Cheers biggiesmallz
Il look into SERM's all the information is muchly appreciated

 

[biggiesmallz]

No biggie :lmao:

 

[veaderko]

I would look into Indimidate SRT and Tropinol.

 

[laneanders]

Adding Intimidate SRT would be a good idea.

 

[biggiesmallz]

HCG myth debunked:

There are 2 ways that could potentially desensitize Leydig Cells:

1. Prolonged LH deprivation: When you inject steroids, your LH production is halted at the pituitary, remember? So if you continue in a suppressed state for weeks upon weeks, your Leydig Cells could potentially become unresponsive, or desensitized. It is possible to reverse desensitization of the cells, but that has been proven to be quite a difficult task. So when you use hCG on cycle, the mimicked LH analog will maintain stimulation of Leydig cells so that you don't run the risk of rendering them useless. This level of maintenance will ensure a much healthier and speedy recovery and one of the most important reasons to use hCG on cycle.

2. Over stimulation/supplying of Leydig cells: There is no reason to use more than 500 IU of hCG at one time. And certainly not a good idea to run even that dose on a daily basis. You do not have an unlimited-ever-flowing-supply of Leydig cells. There is only so much stimulation hCG can do. What happens when you dose hCG really high, is that you're increasing intra-testicular estrogen. So you're thinking that you could use an aromatase inhibitor in that case, right? Nope. AI's are not effective treatment for intra-testicular e2. Furthermore; high doses is a surefire way to desensitize Leydig Cells. So we have a double whammy here. And this is just another reason to use hCG on cycle, and not "blast" hCG post cycle leading up to and/or during PCT.

For the sake of preventing another debate, Rich Piana is clueless.

Now, I understand the proper usage of HCG on-cycle... generally advised at 250iu bi-weekly, sometimes at 500iu bi-weekly, but from the source I came across they referenced a study that basically said there's marginal benefit from HCG when pinning 250 vs 500 bi-weekly, so with that understanding I don't see the need to pin more than 250. That said, is there some limited duration to which HCG should be used on-cycle?

I also heard conflicting information on long-term HCG use can possibly desensitize lydig cells to natural LH response. Any truth to that?

There's only so many cells to stimulate, and the doses of 1500 weekly max, spread over 3 or more doses is sufficient enough. If long term therapy was dangerous at those doses, it would mean that our very own production would desensitize cells, doesnt make sense, does it? 250 IU is not necessarily the magic number. Your goal should be to use the least amount of hCG that works for you. Recently, discussing my concerns with the lead urologist in (some magical place out there somewhere), we came to conclude that for me, as a TRT patient, my usual dose of 250 twice weekly is excessive. So we are planning on reducing the dose to 100 IU, 3 times weekly. Note that this urologist is not my doctor, but a friend and partner in a clinical trial.

Blasting hCG is unhealthy, and the increase in intratesticular E2, which cannot be managed with the commonly readily available aromatase inhibitors, is damaging.