Long EQ/Test Cycle PCT

smash1904

smash1904

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So my friend is running a cycle I'm interested in running as well, and he's asking for my advice. I would run it a little different, but this is what he did:

1-3 Dbol 50mg/day
1-12 Test E 500mg/week
13-23 Test E 250mg/week
10-22 EQ 600mg/week

He has Nolva, and then HCG and Aromasin which he didnt run on cycle. I'm saying to hold off on Aromasin cause its counter productive in PCT, but should he run hcg at the end of the cycle or at the beginning of pct?

23-24 HCG 250mcg Mon/Wens/Fri
25-30 Nolva 60mg first day then 20/20/20/10/10/10

Or

25-26 HCG 250mcg Mon/Wens/Fri
25-30 Nolva 60mg first day then 20/20/20/10/10/10

I'm also thinking GHRP and Triptorelin - GHRP throughout 100mcg x3/day (I hear gh helps pct and maintain gains), and either using trip to kickstart pct with hcg or sub for hcg.

Hes had awesome gains, says he feels great, has no testicular atrophy that he can tell and has been fine in terms of libido. I told him to get blood work, but the cycle sounds great.

If he turns out ok I was thinking of trying:

1-24 Test P 300-350mg/week
1-22 EQ 600mg/week
1-30 GHRP6 100mcg x3/day
1-24 HCG 250mcg Mon/Fri(if suggested)
Aromasin as needed

25 Triptorelin 100mcg first day pct
25-30 Nolva 60mg first day then 20/20/20/10/10/10

Any thoughts? I've heard EQ is great for long periods, and gets real nice around week 16. Should I dose higher on the EQ? The test is basically TRT for the EQ to feel normal, am I right with 300-350mg/week?
 

gymrat827

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DO THIS







If he turns out ok I was thinking of trying:

1-24 Test P 300-350mg/week
1-22 EQ 600mg/week
1-30 GHRP6 100mcg x3/day
1-24 HCG 250mcg Mon/Fri(if suggested)
Aromasin as needed

25 Triptorelin 100mcg first day pct
25-30 Nolva 60mg first day then 20/20/20/10/10/10











but nolva 60/40/40/20/10/10 and add a good natty t booster. The test dose is about double of HRT/TRT (100-150 wk) and the EQ @ 600 will be lots of fun after wk 6.

Pin the EQ with the prop. The EQ is smooth and will help with the pain from the prop.

HCG wed/sat or tue/sun @ 250IU's. aromasin ON cycle 12.5 mg ED or EOD, dose based on estrogen sides/feel.
 
smash1904

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Ok so I should go with the Triptorelin to kickstart pct? Would I need to run hcg if I did use trip, or should I run hcg regardless? I haven't used the stuff before, but I've never really had testicular atrophy before either. And hcg doesn't stop suppression, just atrophy?

Nolva 60mg/day for the first 7? Cause my outlined nolva protocol is one for "heavy/long" cycles.

100-150mg/week Test is trt dosage, should I run it that low? Or at 300-350mg/week? So either 50 or 100mg Test with 200mg EQ Mon/Wens/Fri, or eod(which would be 350mg Test 700mg EQ/week?), or small daily doses?

Aromasin as needed, but low dose Test and EQ shouldn't cause much estrogen sides? I haven't had a problem before.
 
smash1904

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Oh and should my friend run HCG now at the end of cycle, or beginning of pct? What's the recommended protocol?
 

gymrat827

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If he turns out ok I was thinking of trying:

1-24 Test P 300-350mg/week pin 115mg mon/wed/fri = 345mg per wk total ~ this is a good decent dose
1-22 EQ 600mg/week pin 200mg mon/wed/fri or pin 300mg mon/fri
1-30 GHRP6 100mcg x3/day pin 100mcg 1st thing am, post wo, pre bed
1-24 HCG 250mcg Mon/Fri(if suggested) pin 250IU's mon/fri
Aromasin as needed take as needed. id guess 12.5mg 2-3x a wk starting wk 3-5

25 Triptorelin 100mcg first day pct using this stuff is up to you....never used it, dont know much about it....u decide
25-30 Nolva 60mg first day then 20/20/20/10/10/10 60/40/40/20/10/10 this dosing is per wk....so 60mg ED for the 1st wk. than 40mg ED for the 2nd wk, etc etc





but nolva 60/40/40/20/10/10 and add a good natty t booster. The test dose is about double of HRT/TRT (100-150 wk) and the EQ @ 600 will be lots of fun after wk 6.

Pin the EQ with the prop. The EQ is smooth and will help with the pain from the prop.

HCG wed/sat or tue/sun @ 250IU's. aromasin ON cycle 12.5 mg ED or EOD, dose based on estrogen sides/feel.




on a 20-22wk cycle you will need to use hcg, start using it by wk 3 ish, it will test t production going naturally (ie, you will still be able to finish when having sex with lady friend) . aromasin by wk 4. prepare to be hungry with the GHRP 6.



anything else?
 
smash1904

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It's a 24 week cycle, but only 22 for EQ cause it takes so long to kick in, and last shot is week 22 so that I can start pct week 25(3 weeks later).

HCG week 250mcg x2/week week 3-23 - you need 2 weeks off HCG before Triptorelin usage because of pituitary stimulation/overstimulation.

So question 1:
Would I want stop GHRP during Triptorelin for the same reason? Would trip n ghrp cause over overstimulation of pituitary and maybe cause damage? Or am I mixing up organs - pituitary and pancreas?

And 2:
What should the Test dosage and protocol be? I mean androgenic and estrogenic sides at 600mg Eq would be equivalent or less(cause there's so much ester) than 300mg Test right? So 150 would keep me feeling normal, but have very little effect aside from that in terms of sides and anabolic effects. So is it just a matter of if I want more sides for growth and strength sides? Or at 300 would sides be pretty negligible?

Thanks
 
smash1904

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Question 3:
And with Triptorelin wouldn't a protocol of 40/40/20/20/10/10 Nolva suffice? Or would I really just want to kill it with the Nolva?
 

gymrat827

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IDK about trip, never used it, cant comment cuz i dont know anything about it either.

test id do 100-115 mg mon,wed,fri. eq @ 600 is a very big difference than eq @ 400. really try to go 600mg or at least 500mg
 
smash1904

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IDK about trip, never used it, cant comment cuz i dont know anything about it either.

test id do 100-115 mg mon,wed,fri. eq @ 600 is a very big difference than eq @ 400. really try to go 600mg or at least 500mg
Ya I'm still reading about trip, trying to find bloodwork n logs. Not sure about it. Will prolly just use nolva. Is there anything I can use to counter shbg aside from proviron?

Ok that's what I thought you were saying with test. And I would definitely run Eq 600, I was just talking about its sides in equivalent to test. As in it is half as androgenic and aromatizes half as much as test.
 

gymrat827

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EQ really doesnt have sides IMO...i ran it twice 400 & 600...nothing.

Forma stanzol will lower shbg


read








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7,8 - Benzoflavone (99%) 25mg
chrysin 4mg
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Effect of 4-hydroxyandrostenedione on murine Leydig tumor cell steroidogenesis.

Zimniski SJ, Brandt ME, Melner MH, Brodie AM, Puett D.

Department of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology, University of Miami School of Medicine, Florida 33101.

The murine Leydig cell tumor (M5480A) possesses high levels of estrogen receptor and is known to produce estrogens. In these studies we examined the effects of the potent aromatase inhibitor 4-hydroxyandrostenedione (4-OHA) on Leydig tumor cell steroidogenesis both in vitro and in vivo. The addition of 4-OHA to Leydig tumor cells in primary culture resulted in a dose- and a time-dependent decrease in media progesterone levels. The observed decrease was most likely due to impaired synthesis of progesterone, inasmuch as no alteration in progesterone metabolism was seen when progesterone levels were diminishing. However, 4-OHA inhibited progesterone conversion to testosterone following 1 h of incubation, but this effect disappeared coincident with 4-OHA metabolism. Analysis of pregnenolone production revealed a biphasic dose-dependent effect of 4-OHA. At low doses (0.01-0.1 microM), 4-OHA was found to decrease pregnenolone concentrations, while at higher doses (1-10 microM) pregnenolone levels were elevated. Therefore, the actions of 4-OHA on Leydig cell steroidogenesis in vitro appear to be multifocal. Other experiments were performed to evaluate the effects of 4-OHA on tumor-bearing male mice in vivo. In these studies, the predominant effects of 4-OHA were to act as an aromatase inhibitor and to inhibit progesterone production. Thus, while 4-OHA is a potent aromatase inhibitor, we have found that this compound may alter steroidogenesis in Leydig tumor cells at several sites prior to aromatization.

PMID: 2065323 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]



What is in FORMA-STANOZOLOL
Per serving 10 pump serving
60 servings Per container

100mgs Formestane
25mgs DIM
7,8 - Benzoflavone (99%) 25mg
chrysin 4mg
Horse Chestnut seed extract 8mg


Directions for use.

1. On cycle estrogen and progesterone control.
Apply 3-10 pumps twice daily For up to 10 weeks to upper back,shoulders,arms and abdomen. Strength
of effects are dose dependent. Start of with a lighter dose and work up as needed.

2. Stand alone Anabolic fat burning agent
Apply 7-10 pumps twice daily for 4-6

weeks to upper back,shoulders,arms and abdomen. Strength
of effects are dose dependent. Start of with a lighter dose and work up as needed.

3. For post cycle therapy
apply 3-7 pumps twice daily for 4-6 weeks to upper back,shoulders,arms and upper abdomen


If used at higher doses, conversion to the steroid 4-hydroxytestosterone takes place, which is actually less androgenic than formestane and slightly more anabolic.
If used on cycle it can reduce water retention caused by aromatisation to estrogen, so helping you stay looking lean, and improving your post cycle therapy as recovery will be easier.

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Benveniste O, Simon A and Herson S. Successful percutaneous dihydrotestosterone treatment of gynecomastia occurring during highly active antiretroviral therapy: four cases and a review of the literature. Clinical Infectious Diseases 2001;33:891-893.

This shows that when in this case dht, but anything strongly androgenic in its actions is applied to gyno where high levels of prolactin are found then gyno can be reduced!!! Now this will work with prolactin induced gyno, as this and at least 6 other studies show.
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So how does it work exactly, Aromatase is an enzyme that synthesizes estrogen. Aromatase inhibitors block the synthesis of estrogen. This lowers the estrogen level, and slows the growth of cancers, And trans dermal formestane is one of the strongest drugs for this, so that means lean ROCK HARD gains on cycle. This is because the androgens can no longer convert into estrogen.. That is good news as it doesn't act like exemestane which forms a permanent bond with the aromatase enzyme, so preventing any estrogen which is bad for your joints and tendons.
Also because of exemestane


So why does gyno happen on cycle?

Bodybuilders who use steroids may experience an increase in estrogen levels , and this has undesirable consequences for a bodybuilder, such as gynecomastia. This is often the case when a natural aromatase inhibitor 4-OHAD has itself been inhibited. 4-OHAD is a metabolite of testosterone, which can mean 4-OHAD remains inhibited whilst aromatase levels are allowed high, so you actualy get even less androgens than normal and higher estrogen levels, so using Forma-Stanozolol can change the ratios allowing the enzyme 4-OHAD to remain active, so limiting estrogen, by increasing testosterone itself through its AI activity, And by preventing estrogen from binding to receptors so preventing gyno, but as it allows some estrogen to circulate, tendons and ligaments are kept strong and healthy.

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Yes NEEDTO has done it again...In fact this could even be used to treat and prevent DECA droopiness.

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gymrat827

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Chrysin is the stuff in transderm, its topical so it will work much better.
 
smash1904

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So basically the 1-2 combo of nolva - forma-stanzol is one counter acts the negatives of the other for a synergistic and more complete pct. Formestane is anabolic/androgenic, but not suppressive(like proviron) and increases igf1(which nolva decreases) and decreases shbg(which nolva increases). Plus it has characteristics similar to clomid/hcg in that it boosts lh/fsh without the negatives, and modulates e so that its within healthy ranges. So serm blocks e, and form keeps it in check(instead of dropping it to nothing - which is bad for cholesterol and joints). You also have the benefit of having the form helping you maintain gains and keep growing, while leaning you out.

Would you use it on the high or low end throughout pct, or just for part of it? I'm sure this is variable depending on how long/heavy your cycle was. What do you think for aforementioned cycle?

Is forma-stanzol a sub for hcg/ai? Sounds like it...
 

gymrat827

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no forma wouldnt take the place of hcg.....but it is a AI.

Unleashed/post cycle is also very good at lowering shbg levels, but you need to use the two as a pair.
 

PVL

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good reply gymrat827...........I will add this.........

not everyone reacts the same to exogeneous test so some people recover fast, where as other may need 6 months of PCT.........it really isnt as simple as some think. also, you dont want to rely on drugs to help your body out........you would not need that crazy of a PCT if you did your cycles at a dose for your size.

IMO, if you are under 230 at any height, you just need to eat more and train smarter............and sleep a lot for gosh sakes. the one constant I found was getting a good nights sleep because the human body is a crazy thing, it listens to what you tell it to do.

when you are on PCT, you need to recover. ask any competitive bodybuilder, how long they stay on cycle(contest prep) and how long they relax after a contest..............its about 2-3 months of light cardio and lighter weights with lots of rest man. your body cant be on overdrive all the time.........it will burn out..........thats just science dude.

if you can obtain HCG, keep in mind every time you use it, its less effective and soon you will NEED it just to feel normal.
 

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