question about pct after gyno

[jj104]

ill do cliffs to make it easier

- used steroids years ago but quit cold turkey
- didnt pct
- developed gyno
- used letro to shrink gyno
- gyno is almost gone so i'm switching to aromasin/nolvadex/HCGenerate


my questions:

- will aromasin/nolvadex/hcgenerate be enough to boost my natural testosterone production back to normal?
- i think my testes are on the small side, do i have to use pregnyl HCG (injectables) to bring it back up or is there an alternative?
- is pregnyl HCG really necessary if i do my above protocol?
- will IFG-1 be a better alternative if i cant get pregnyl HCG, if so, which brand? (over the counter)
- is IFG-1 the one i'm looking for or is it another IFG (i've seen different numbers)


i've made my mistake and i'm just trying to fix it. any help will be appreciated. thanks

 

[masonmarin18]

Well the way I understand it is unless you ran a cycle, your test levels shouldn't be low.. So you just took letro to shrink your gyno right? Letro is one of the strongest AI's out there and has been said to inhibit 98% of the estrogen in your body, What has your dosing on this looked like? I would suggest tapering down the letro, since you probably little to no estrogen in your body, there will be a definite rebound effect causing gyno to come straight back. Soo taper down the letro, then on your last day of letro, begin your serm or AI. If you run the AI remember to taper down off it slowly to prevent rebound. Here is a cut and paste from a Gyno thread I have saved in my favorites with alot of useful information.


Running letro to reverse gyno: I am going to go over the three different scenarios which people could fit into. Remember regardless of what scenario you are in it is important that you begin taking the letro ASAP.

1. Already using an anti-e aside from letro . 2. Already using letro @ a dose of .25mg or .50mg ED. 3. Not running any estrogen protection.

1. Day 1: .25mg letro + anti-e* Day 2: .50mg letro Day 3: 1.0mg letro Day 4: 1.5mg letro Day 5: 2.0mg letro Day 6: 2.5mg letro **

2. Day 1: .50mg letro Day 2: 1.0mg letro Day 3: 1.5mg letro Day 4: 2.0mg letro Day 5: 2.5mg letro **
3. Day 1: .50mg letro Day 2: 1.0mg letro Day 3: 1.5mg letro Day 4: 2.0mg letro Day 5: 2.5mg letro **

*Regardless of the anti-e you are using it is important to still use it for the first day you begin letro as the letro will not have taken any effect and you by no means want your body to be without any protection when gyno is already prevalent.

** You will remain at this dose until gyno symptoms subside. Once you believe your gyno is gone it is important to stay at this dose for another 4-7 days to ensure all traces are gone. I recommend people with a bf% over 15 stay on for a week as it may be harder to judge completely whether the lump is completely gone. Once this period is over it will be important to taper letro down slowly rather than coming off it completely. Regardless of which manner you tapered up your dose you will all taper down in the same fashion.

Day 1: 2.0mg Day 2: 1.5mg Day 3: 1.0mg Day 4: .50mg*** Day 5: .25mg ***You can remain at this dose or go down further to .25mg. It is really up to you at this point. They are both very common maintenance doses as an anti-e while on cycle . Personally I have stayed with .25mg and never had a problem.

letro and the estrogen rebound: With your estrogen being completely inhibited there is a definite estrogen rebound as your body tries to re-stabilize the testosterone :estrogen balance. We can prevent this rebound effect by supplementing further with another AI or SERM . So, I suggest that when you are coming to the end of your cycle you will more than likely be using Nolva in your PCT so just make sure that you begin taking nolva the last day you are going to take your letro and then continue on as you would with regular PCT .

This now leads us into the question of reversing gyno while not on cycle . There are a few things to remember here. You have already waited longer than you should have, and your sex drive will be shot . You can use tribulus or another natural test booster to help you in this scenario but I can’t guarantee the effectiveness. Just follow gyno reversal protocols 2 or 3. When coming off again you must taper and begin using nolvadex to prevent any rebound effect that may occur.

How much nolvadex should you use if you are not going into PCT and running this off cycle ? I suggest starting at 20mg ED for a week and then lowering it to 10mg for another week and then coming off completely.


I bolded the situation I believe you are in, hope I helped!

 

[jj104]

Well the way I understand it is unless you ran a cycle, your test levels shouldn't be low.. So you just took letro to shrink your gyno right? Letro is one of the strongest AI's out there and has been said to inhibit 98% of the estrogen in your body, What has your dosing on this looked like? I would suggest tapering down the letro, since you probably little to no estrogen in your body, there will be a definite rebound effect causing gyno to come straight back. Soo taper down the letro, then on your last day of letro, begin your serm or AI. If you run the AI remember to taper down off it slowly to prevent rebound. Here is a cut and paste from a Gyno thread I have saved in my favorites with alot of useful information.

thanks for replying! i did take letro just for my gyno but i've read studies that nolvadex will treat gynecomastia a lot better than letro so i'm switching over to aromasin/nolvadex to finish it out. i did bloodwork and they said my test was higher than normal, however, i feel like my testes are still on the smaller side from my time when i took prohormones.

my main questions i guess are:

- how long does it take for the testes to go back to a normal size (since i quit cold turkey and didnt pct) w/o HCG?
- if it isn't able to w/o HCG, is there an alternative b/c shipping from europe takes a month and i'm starting nolvadex/aromasin on monday
- is IGF-1 a good replacement for HCG for testes size and maintaing muscle gains?

thanks and much appreciated

 

[jbryand101b]

gyno is caused from multiple hormonal imbalances.

igf-1 is insulin like growth factor-1, it is completely different from the hormone hcg.

I honestly dont have any thing to recomend for you to do.

I guess you should go with your plan, and see how it works out. maybe add in some anti prolactin compounds as well, or an hgh/sleep supplement too that regimen, and def get a cortisol control product like 7-spray, supress c, reduce xt.

your test, estrogen, hgh, igf-1, progestin, prolactin, cortisol, etc is all most likely out of balance for what is "normal" to you.

if you dont have blood work pre steroids, then you or anyone else, will have zero idea what your numbers should be at.

your test, estro, etc may be normal for men your age, but may not be normal for you. this is the problem.

once you remove the gyno, the trick is going to be getting your hormones back to normal. but since you dont know what your normal, baseline is, it's going to be shooting darts at a target blindfolded.

 

[masonmarin18]

thanks for replying! i did take letro just for my gyno but i've read studies that nolvadex will treat gynecomastia a lot better than letro so i'm switching over to aromasin/nolvadex to finish it out. i did bloodwork and they said my test was higher than normal, however, i feel like my testes are still on the smaller side from my time when i took prohormones.

my main questions i guess are:

- how long does it take for the testes to go back to a normal size (since i quit cold turkey and didnt pct) w/o HCG?
- if it isn't able to w/o HCG, is there an alternative b/c shipping from europe takes a month and i'm starting nolvadex/aromasin on monday
- is IGF-1 a good replacement for HCG for testes size and maintaing muscle gains?

thanks and much appreciated

Letro will do wayyy better in treating gyno then nolva ever will. The letro gets rid of all your estrogen, so then you get on a serm like Nolva to block the estrogen to rebinding to your breast tissue.

Im no very familiar with HCG and IGF-1 so I don't have much to say about that, but I believe HCG boosts natural test levels, which so will nolva. So I would just suggest getting a test booster like DAA or something along with your nolva. Then remember to taper off the aromasin.