Epsitane PCT, with complications

[Shuggah]

Hey guys, my first post, after lurking about for some time.

I have a question,

I'm starting my first epistane cycle in 2 weeks, I'll be running like this;

wk 1, 10-10-20-20-20-30-30
wk 2, 30-30-30-30-30-30-40
wk 3, 40-40-40-40-40-40-40
wk 4, 40-40-40-40-40-40-50

Now here's the problem. I live in the Netherlands, and therefore am not able to obtain a proper SERM, just no way, costums are HELL here, and i'm lucky the epistane even got through from the UK.

So I have to got for 'legal' options, which BTW are illegal in my country, but I can have em shipped from the UK without a huge risk, they dont check many UK packages.

I was thinking of running the following as PCT;

Novedex XT
[6, 17 Keto-Etiocholeva-3-Ol Tetrahydropyranol]
[3, 17 Keto-Etiochol-Triene]
[3', 5, 7-Trihydroxy-4'-Methoxyflavone]

and;

Reduce XT
7-alpha-hydroxy-dehydoepiandrosterone
7-beta-hydroxy-dehydoepiandrosterone

Obviously the Novedex is for my eostrogen and test levels, the Reduce is a cortisol blocker.

These are just about my only options, what do you guys think, is it safe enough? I mean, I can always pay a visit to my physician if gyno starts to be a problem..... I just need a green light from some guys who know their stuff.

Thanx in advance!

 

[james1]

Most are going to tell you that your pct is not enough at that epi dosage. Personally I think that would be fine, but some people get much more suppressed then others on epi. It's really your call, you can try the test recovery stack by primordial performance, or maybe form stacked with like stoked or DTHC, any ai natty test boost combo.

 

[Shuggah]

Thanx man,

Ill prob just go ahead with it then, I did read some good things about Novedex.

Freak it, i can always get prescriptions when things get outa hand...

thanx again, any further feedback is very welcome...

 

[rubberring]

I wouldn't go above 30mg on the Epistane. Minimal returns for the sides you'll get at that dosage. It's your first Epi cycle, so your receptors should be fresh. Any higher, and your chances of shutdown and even estrogen rebound (gyno) increase greatly... and you'll need more than your 'legal' options. IMO, your PCT protocol will most likely suffice if you remain at 30mg. For me 20mg was more than adequate. I know you see a lot of guys using much higher doses, but that's where issues arise... and you'll end up with less gains in the long run.

My recommendation:

Wk 1 - 10, 10, 10, 20, 20, 20, 20
Wk 2 - 20, 20, 20, 30, 30, 30, 30
Wk 3 - 30 (if tolerable)-->
Wk 4 - 30 (if tolerable)-->

Make sure you taper the Novadex... and I wouldn't start the Reduce XT until the 3rd week of PCT.

Good luck.

 

[Shuggah]

I wouldn't go above 30mg on the Epistane. Minimal returns for the sides you'll get at that dosage. It's your first Epi cycle, so your receptors should be fresh. Any higher, and your chances of shutdown and even estrogen rebound (gyno) increase greatly... and you'll need more than your 'legal' options. IMO, your PCT protocol will most likely suffice if you remain at 30mg. For me 20mg was more than adequate. I know you see a lot of guys using much higher doses, but that's where issues arise... and you'll end up with less gains in the long run.

My recommendation:

Wk 1 - 10, 10, 10, 20, 20, 20, 20
Wk 2 - 20, 20, 20, 30, 30, 30, 30
Wk 3 - 30 (if tolerable)-->
Wk 4 - 30 (if tolerable)-->

Make sure you taper the Novadex... and I wouldn't start the Reduce XT until the 3rd week of PCT.

Good luck.

Thanx man, what kind of gains should I expect on 30mgs?

 

[rubberring]

Thanx man, what kind of gains should I expect on 30mgs?

Most likely the same as you would at 40mg. If your diet's in check and you're training heavy, you'll probably net about 8-10 solid pounds, and drop some body fat at the same time. Obviously, it varies from person to person. Keep in mind that Epi is a pretty dry compound, so you probably won't experience that temporary bloat that some steroids can cause.

I'd highly recommend liver support of some sort, as this is a methylated compound. 'Cycle Support' is a great product, and I also recommend a product called 'Hepatapro', which contains an ingredient called polyenylphsophatidylcholine (PPC), also known as "compound N." Apparently, it was shown in studies to prevent steroid-induced liver damage.

 

[Shuggah]

Awesome dudes, thanx a bunch! I'll take Milk Thisle for the liver, should be good enough right?

I'll defo go on the 30mg max cycle then, to reduce risks. BTW, what do you mean with 'taper' the novedex?

 

[rubberring]

Awesome dudes, thanx a bunch! I'll take Milk Thisle for the liver, should be good enough right?

I'll defo go on the 30mg max cycle then, to reduce risks. BTW, what do you mean with 'taper' the novedex?

I don't know what dosage you plan on taking, but four caps is the max. No matter what, I'd taper it down gradually to one cap nightly... and then maybe even one cap every other night. The object is to avoid any estrogen rebound. Epi already has some anti-estrogen properties as it is.

 

[Shuggah]

Thanx guys, this really is a great board, loads of guys with knowledge, and a very friendly athmosphere, which just proves once again, roid rage is a fable

Last question, start the Novedex in last week of cycle right?
tHen taper after the first week of PCT or something, and start the Reduce in week 3?

 

[james1]

Thanx guys, this really is a great board, loads of guys with knowledge, and a very friendly athmosphere, which just proves once again, roid rage is a fable

Last question, start the Novedex in last week of cycle right?
tHen taper after the first week of PCT or something, and start the Reduce in week 3?

No take novedex the day after your last dose. Don't take novedex until your epi cycle is completely finished. Yes start the reduce xt either 2nd or 3rd week of pct, this is when cortisol levels will begin to surge.

 

[nattydisaster]

I would rather see you use something like Formex in your PCT than ATD, which has anti-androgen properties. Sample:


2) Without a SERM[/B]

Needed: 1 bottles IBE Formex, 1 bottle AI Cycle Support/PCS

Not everyone can get SERMs. This method is not as good as above, but is still much better than nothing.

Week 1: IBE Formex 50mg, AI Cycle Support (or PCS)
Week 2: IBE Formex 50mg, AI Cycle Support (or PCS)
Week 3: IBE Formex 25mg, AI Cycle Support (or PCS)
Week 4: IBE Formex 25mg, AI Cycle Support (or PCS)

 

[Shuggah]

I cant get Forme, it's not in stock with the supplier i'm obliged to use.
Would 6-Bromoandrostenedione be better than the other product I chose?

 

[lennoxchi]

I cant get Forme, it's not in stock with the supplier i'm obliged to use.
Would 6-Bromoandrostenedione be better than the other product I chose?

i personally like 6-bromo vs. ATD. ATD has a negitive effect on my libido. i've taken it 3 times and every single time it has sucked. some report nothing bad happening. can you get i-force products where your ordering from?

 

[james1]

I'm using formex in my upcoming pct hopefully its effective as planned.