Think civil war will erupt in Iraq. I think, eventually, there is a chance it will, but I'm voting for "unsure"
By most objective measures, Iraq is already in a state of civil war. I would refer you to this chart showing deaths in Iraq in just thr month of January 2006 alone http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2006/02/06/opinion/20060206_IRAQ_GRAPHIC.htmlDon't see it happening. I much rather trust the people that live in Iraq and are going doing some studies here, than political figures... the majority of the people just want peace.. but they are finding that they will prob, be like the problems ireland. Majorty of the Iraqi "states" for lack of a better word, are in peace. less than 10 are hot
What are you talking about? The troubles in Northern Ireland were largely a war for independence from a colonial occupier with some citizens staying loyal to the crown much like what happened in the American war for indepndence. In many ways it WAS a civil war but that war has been over more or less since the Good Friday Peace Accords. The IRA has been certified to have put their weapons "beyond operational use" and most of the loyalist paramilitaries have disarmed as well.then northern ireland is also in a civil war.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2006-02-25-iraqi-army_x.htmIraqi army is good. They are working out very well, but yes, are slow to come around.
The Iraqi police are running death squads and secret torture prisons.Iraqi police are being shot up there with mexican police. Just not good.
No, Iran doesn't want a civil war in Iraq. Iran wants a Shiite dominated government in Iraq which is what we delivered to them. The problem is that the Sunni insurgency and the Kurds are refusing to go a long with Shiite domination.The future of Iraq is beholding to Iran. But Iran's wishes to start a civil war are not working as well as they hoped.
This is a completely flawed analogy. Most of Ireland is peaceful because it WON its independence from the colonial occupiers (Britain) in 1920 when the Irish Free State (independent) and Northern Ireland (still part of United Kingdom) were created as part of a peace treaty between the IRA and Great Britain.. Thus, fighting ended in most of Ireland because they achieved the goals of their fighting. Fighting has continued in Northern Ireland because Irish Nationalists continued to fight to free Northern Ireland from colonial domination with Unionists fighting to stay within the UK. In contrast, most of Iraq is peaceful because it is uninhabited desert. In the areas where people live, fighting is non-stop (even the Kurdish areas in the north and Shia area in the south experience regular bombings and assasinations. Whenever you see a politician caliming that "most of Iraq" is peaceful, know that they are lying to you through deception. It's like claiming that crime is nonexistent in most of Alaska. True, but what matters is the part of Alaska where people live. They are counting on the fact that most Americans don't know anything about the geography and population distribution patterns of Iraq.I use the Ireland example because the violance is out of a small amount of the counties... in Iraq's case.. only 2 out of the 18 are causing issues... and if you wish to say who they are loyal too.. much like England... they are to Iran.. but not to the country of iran.. to the ideas of iran.
This is nonsense. Operation Swarmer, the largest air operation since the invasion using 1500 troops....accomplished what? We captured 40 suspected insurgents (releasing 17 of them within hours) and found a few minor weapons caches. This latest operation was a fiasco. The only good thing that came from it is that no Americans died during it.http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4816710.stmThis past operation may have been the most successfull ever to take place in Iraq. They have been flushing out those terrorists ( or as some of you view them as.. Patriots) and we are catching them as they leave the cities to flee into the desert. The Iraqi army just EFFED up any sort of controlled leadership of these loyalists, or iranian interest fighters.
No, the only vote that the Republican leadership would allow to come to the floor was a vote to withdraw all troops within 24 hours. They framed it this way because they knew it was so silly all the Democrats would have to vote against it (and they did) AND because they knew it would confuse Americans (who weren't paying close attention) into thinking just what you thought.The democrats scream and yell to bring everyone home... but when they get to vote on it.. they vote to stay.
Um, no. The rigged vote was a scheme to cut off any true debate. By only allowing one question to come to a vote (remove all troops within 24 hours), they created a fasle impression of unity.The vote was to either make people put up or shut up.. and.. they shut up.
Um, no. They drove their colinial occupiers out of 95% of their country, establsihed an independent nation, and then dismantled the apartheid-like restrictions in the remaining 5% still ruled by Britain. Then they turned their arms over to control of clerics from Protestant and Catholic churches without ever surrendering or disbanding their army. That's called victory.As for Ireland.. there is peace because they are tired of fighting. They didn't win jack.
No again. If you look at the original pronouncements at the start of the Operation the Pentagon was predicting a repeat of Fallujah. Instead, not a shot has been fired....and a handful of people have been arrested with no indication that they were any sort of badguys.Operation Swarmer was not a fiasco.. the job did what it was suppose to do. The people putting together these road side bombs are not a platoon sized army.. they are small groups of people hiding amongst another group of people either scared or unwilling to do anything about their current situation in life..
This is simply not true and I challenge you to find a single citation. On this point, you simply have your facts backwards. Iran is interfering in Iraq but NOT by supporting the Sunni insurgents. Iraq is supporting the Shia militias which SUPPORT the government. Iran LIKES the government we put in place....many of whom CAME FROM IRAN where they lived in Exile during the Hussein years. Heck, the supreme cleric in Iraq (Al Sistani) IS Iranian himself. The Iranians and the Shia Iraqis are different ethnic groups (Persians and Arabs) but they are united by the Shia faith which is a discriminated-upon minority in the Isalmic world.because all they are use to is... nothing....do they support iran.. no.. but Iran supports them and that is all that matters.
This mission wasn't Iraqi lead at all. Once again, I challeneg you to find a single citation for this assertion. This was an American mission with Iraqis riding around in our helicopters. Would the Iraqis have performed well if this mission had actually engaged in combat, I don't know. The Pentagon recently certified that ZERO Iraqi brigades are capable of fighting on their own so I'm suspecting that their performance wouldn't be all that great even with our troops holding their hands.Operation swarmer was also put together to be one of the first true iraqi lead missions. And it worked in that aspect as well.
You've gone off on a tangent. You kept saying that "most" of Iraq was peaceful as if this was evidence that things are actually going well in Iraq. I pointed out that most of Iraq is unihabited desert, so of course it is peaceful. To see how things are going you have to look at where the people live.Most of Iraq is a desert... yes.. but also know that almost all of the midwest.. Kansas to give an example was also said to not be fit to live in... but over time, areas like that are now turning out to be the new hubs for buisnes.. sure all this takes time.. but as long as the world is spinning and a common idea of peace through a global market is a alive.. we have all the time we need.
That seems to be the Democrat's biggest problem. Most of them won't out andout join the antiwar crowd, but then they're faced with the problem that the bush administration is persuing a reasonable policy. There might be alternatives to it that are also reasonable, but I haven't heard one come from a Democrat's mouth yet.All the talk was how much they hate the war in Iraq with no better way to run it.
We have perhaps less to learn from the British in that sense and more to learn from the British occupation of Iraq that took place from 1920-32. The rhetorical war at home was virtually the same, their goal was virtually the same as ours is now, and even after 12 years the place was a cluster **** that went to hell almost as soon as they pulled out.Hey YeahRight.. i think you and i agree on the powell aspect of war... but did you see the articles found.. actually by a more leftist orginization that proffessed the main reason we "lost" vietnam is because we used such a great amount of troops for a style of war that doesn't call for such... I found it but lost it... said something that when the british went in.. they learned from the US's mistakes and only did a small amount.. Maybe you can have better luck in finding what i am talking about
True, as is the point about how long it takes a nation to stabilize. Doesn't say anything about whether or not it's a good idea though. Kind of like pointing out falling test levels are normal in older men. That it's normal doesn't make it a good thing.we are still in germany and france from WW2
For it to be 'civil war', it would have to be among civilians of THAT population. The people killing other people are largely from Syria, Iran, etc...NOT Iraq.By most objective measures, Iraq is already in a state of civil war. I would refer you to this chart showing deaths in Iraq in just thr month of January 2006 alone http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2006/02/06/opinion/20060206_IRAQ_GRAPHIC.html
Yeah...they've been downright detrimental to the war. Its disgusting really. But, if the shoe were on the other foot, I honestly believe the Republicans would do the same thing. I see almost no difference between the two parties other than the bases who support them.That seems to be the Democrat's biggest problem. Most of them won't out andout join the antiwar crowd, but then they're faced with the problem that the bush administration is persuing a reasonable policy. There might be alternatives to it that are also reasonable, but I haven't heard one come from a Democrat's mouth yet.
No doubt. But me being generally conservative I have more fun pointing out the foibles of Democrats than Republicans.Yeah...they've been downright detrimental to the war. Its disgusting really. But, if the shoe were on the other foot, I honestly believe the Republicans would do the same thing. I see almost no difference between the two parties other than the bases who support them.
You mean the media is mistaken?? No way. They would never state "civil war" mistakenly. Their political beliefs never conlfict with the actual situation. Funny, I was speaking to 2 veterans in the airport the other day. CNN was on. They were laughin yet angry at the same time.Definition for a civil war
A war between factions of the same country; there are five criteria for international recognition of this status: the contestants must control territory, both have a functioning government, enjoy some foreign recognition, have identifiable regular armed forces, and engage in major military operations.
You're referring to the compare and contrast between the US war in Vietnam and the British war in Malaysia.Hey YeahRight.. i think you and i agree on the powell aspect of war... but did you see the articles found.. actually by a more leftist orginization that proffessed the main reason we "lost" vietnam is because we used such a great amount of troops for a style of war that doesn't call for such... I found it but lost it... said something that when the british went in.. they learned from the US's mistakes and only did a small amount.. Maybe you can have better luck in finding what i am talking about
Where did you get this definition? This is a very conservative definition of civil war which would exclude almost all conflicts that historians and international law experts consider civil wars. The more generally accepted definition is something like this wikipedia entry:Definition for a civil war
A war between factions of the same country; there are five criteria for international recognition of this status: the contestants must control territory, both have a functioning government, enjoy some foreign recognition, have identifiable regular armed forces, and engage in major military operations.
Same here...the dems are much more fun to poke fun at.No doubt. But me being generally conservative I have more fun pointing out the foibles of Democrats than Republicans.
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