:icon_lol: You're right. But we only "detain" them, the terrorists have a tendency to behead them on National tv. :saw:I don't agree with giving in to "terrorist" demands, but I say we let the women go in this case. We shouldn't have kidnapped er.. detained them in the first place.
It's not that simple in this case. We did the same thing to them(kidnapped their wives. As delta pointed out, the only difference is that we won't behead them. But on the other hand you're right, it does set a precedent. This is a tough one.Giving into terrorist demands sets a terrible precedent that will only result in MORE kidnappings/beheadings in the future. If they think kidnapping innocent civilians is a bargaining tool with a civilized nation they are wrong. I can't wait until these sickos are wiped from the planet.
:blink: i dont think thats a good idea, but at the same thim if it was a loved one of mine, i might cchange my mind, you really cant say what yyou would do unless you were unfortunate enough to be in that situation. to give in to me, shows weakness and only more bad can come out of that.I say give in. One American is worth a hundred of them. (just like the way Israel trades with the terrorists)
Every time they harm even a hair of an Americans head,...... level a city. Sunni triangle should have been leveled long ago. We need to fight wars like, well, wars. Remember WWII? We carpet bombed citys, civilians and all. $0.02
Yeah I'm pretty sure I heard that almost exactly the same statement on his show tonight!sounds kinda "michael savage"ish to me...lol.
wait...i love michael savage.... im with u!
Every time they harm even a hair of an Americans head,...... level a city. Sunni triangle should have been leveled long ago. We need to fight wars like, well, wars. Remember WWII? We carpet bombed citys, civilians and all. $0.02
Rediculous? Maybe in practical application, but theoretically right to the point! It is almost imperative to fight this kind of enemy using the language that they understand and consequences they can experience, which send them the clear message that a cost/benefit analysis of their terrorist action indicates clearly that the costs (to them) outweigh the benefits.i take from swordfish:
Anyone who impinges on America's freedom. Terrorist states, Stanley. Someone must bring their war to them. They bomb a church, we bomb 10. They hijack a plane, we take out an airport. They execute American tourist, we tactically nuke an entire city. Our job is to make terrorism so horrific that is becomes unthinkable to attack Americans.
This is a necessary step, I as a leader would do it out of respect for the lives of the volunteer soldiers who make a great sacrafice for us. I say "Kill 'em all" just like Metallica's first album :head: and no, I'm not psycho, we're dealing with psycopaths here and the only way to handle them is by extremely brutal forceEvery time they harm even a hair of an Americans head,...... level a city. Sunni triangle should have been leveled long ago. We need to fight wars like, well, wars. Remember WWII? We carpet bombed citys, civilians and all. $0.02
I'm like a broken record with these, but here they are again.i take from swordfish:
Anyone who impinges on America's freedom. Terrorist states, Stanley. Someone must bring their war to them. They bomb a church, we bomb 10. They hijack a plane, we take out an airport. They execute American tourist, we tactically nuke an entire city. Our job is to make terrorism so horrific that is becomes unthinkable to attack Americans.
Says the man with Che' in his avatar.All this move did was prove that we're no better than the terrorists, the same savage assholes who take us hostage and torture soldiers and civilians.Oh wait, we have those secret CIA torture prisons in Eastern Europe.
Pretty shameful on the US's part but the Administration is full of bullshit like this so its not surprising.
yeah yeah, maybe we can all hold hands and sing 'kumbaya'.
1) There will never be peace without victory of one side. Compromise will never occur with radical islamists.I'm like a broken record with these, but here they are again.
1) "Darkness can not remove darkness, only light can remove darkness. Hate can not remove hate, only love can remove hate." MLK jr.
2) If we never supported Israel, the terrorist wouldn't hate us.
BTW, what heartless, souless ass whole voted for choice #3
Yeah, you are like a broken record. Who would you support? The terrorists? Or would you just keep your nose buried in the sand and mind your own business until terrorists had taken all the little countries and there was no one left for them to terrorize except us? Who gives a **** if the terrorists hate us? As long as they fear us, I could care less, as their opinions are as useless as a broken record. When a record gets broken, I throw it away. It has no value...I'm like a broken record with these, but here they are again.
1) "Darkness can not remove darkness, only light can remove darkness. Hate can not remove hate, only love can remove hate." MLK jr.
2) If we never supported Israel, the terrorist wouldn't hate us.
How in the hell are we not on the same level?Says the man with Che' in his avatar.
You think we're on the same level as terrorists? You need a reality check...
Don't forget Gandhi, which was supposedly the main inspiration from MLK.1000 Black Panthers with guns did less then the peacefull words of 1 man...
Thats a pretty tunnel visioned way to look at things. Instead of saying, "Lets kill em all!", we need to look at why they are willing to pull this ****, kill their own people. We need to look at how they get their money. We're buddies with Saudi Arabia, who doesn't hide the fact that they give these organizations money. We then need to look at how we're dicking around that area since the 1950s. The US fucked Iran and Afghanistan over in the 1970s and 1980s.There will never be peace without victory of one side. Compromise will never occur with radical islamists.
Stop looking at things as black and white. Its that kind of ass-backwards thinking that causes this **** in the first place. Hell, its the mentally of the radical Muslims: "They're either with us or against us."So we shouldn't support nations with similar values and government to our own? We should have sided with the sickos in Palestine who now blow themselves up in crowded areas with the intent of murdering as many innocent men, women, and children as possible? Should we take sides with Iran now, they also hate us because we support Israel?
What exactly is the right thing? Kicking out a leader without waiting to see if the fucking weapons were there? Placing military bases on Muslim holy lands? Organizing coups that come back to bite us in the ass later?You don't stop doing the right thing just because the terrorists "wouldn't hate us." You don't condone, or look the other way when someone preaches genocide. You annihilate evil and show the rest of the world that such behavior is completely unacceptable and will be dealt with.
Dude, these TERRORISTS can't be dealt with in the same fashion as MLK Jr dealt with racism and civil rights, they are different issues. Terrorists must be killed not reformed and in order to do so you will have to use brutal force and accept that there will be civilians killed, I'm sure the terrorist didn't mind killing 3,000 innocent Americans, they didn't care about blowing up a train in England when innocent people were going to work, they didn't care about holding a school with elementary KIDS hostage in Russia, they didn't care then and they don't care now.I'm like a broken record with these, but here they are again.
1) "Darkness can not remove darkness, only light can remove darkness. Hate can not remove hate, only love can remove hate." MLK jr.
2) If we never supported Israel, the terrorist wouldn't hate us.
BTW, what heartless, souless ass whole voted for choice #3
If you think we are on the same level as them, you're as out of touch with reality as they are.How in the hell are we not on the same level?
Capturing civilians? Check. We're capturing wives. Bringing family into this is really, really low. Just because the shithead terrorists do it doesn't mean we have to.
Torturing POWs? Check. We have secret torture camps in Eastern Europe. Or closer to Iraq, the Abu Ghraib prison.
The only difference I see is that the Coalition doesn't behead the people they capture on tape..
Why do they pull this ****? You tell me. These people don't put the same value on life as we do. That is evident in their actions. Sending your children out to blow up. If becoming a martyr is such a wonderful thing, why don't the adult terrorists go out and do it? Because they are chickenshit, thats why. It is much easier to send out children that don't know better. You're right, we shouldn't give any of them any money, just go in and kick their ass and then leave. But we always try to help the people in hopes that they will seee the error in their ways....Don't forget Gandhi, which was supposedly the main inspiration from MLK.
Thats a pretty tunnel visioned way to look at things. Instead of saying, "Lets kill em all!", we need to look at why they are willing to pull this ****, kill their own people. We need to look at how they get their money. We're buddies with Saudi Arabia, who doesn't hide the fact that they give these organizations money. We then need to look at how we're dicking around that area since the 1950s. The US fucked Iran and Afghanistan over in the 1970s and 1980s.
Hindsight is 20/20 so **** the past. We need solutions now and its not to kill, kill, and kill some more. That just gives these organizations a reason to exist. We need to uncover real solutions...
Black and white is usually a very good way to look at things. What have we missed?Stop looking at things as black and white. Its that kind of ass-backwards thinking that causes this **** in the first place. Hell, its the mentally of the radical Muslims: "They're either with us or against us."
What exactly is the right thing? Kicking out a leader without waiting to see if the fucking weapons were there? Placing military bases on Muslim holy lands? Organizing coups that come back to bite us in the ass later?...
Fiercely pro American? You sure don't sound like it. So you have all the common sense and anyone that doesn't agree with your views doesn't? I don't think so. I think the US has done the right thing in the Middle East. I hope we will continue. I've heard first hand the thanks the Iraqi people feel for what we have done to make freedom a reality for them.I'm fiercely pro American but anyone with a shred of common sense must realize that the US fucked up big time with the Middle East. Once this Iraq **** is over, we need to get back to basics: paying off the trillions in debt, curbing poverty and unemployment, educating our people, and furthering society with more opportunities for all.
Actually having Che Guevara in your avatar says alot. It says alot about anyone who walks around with those stupid shirts. Che was a communist extremist. Period. He is on par (if alive by his own admission) with Castro himself. I guess my point is why in the world should your opinions be considered valid or rational in anyway if you put a villian like that on a pedestal? I'm actually curious as to why you or anyone would appreciate a character like that. Not that it has to do with this thread but always seeing those 13-21 yr olds with those shirts really always bothered the piss outta me. Anyone else?How in the hell are we not on the same level?
I don't see how my avatar has anything to do with the discussion. Nice try though.
.
There is no difference between a criminal shooting a cop and a cop shooting a criminal?All this move did was prove that we're no better than the terrorists, the same savage assholes who take us hostage and torture soldiers and civilians.Oh wait, we have those secret CIA torture prisons in Eastern Europe.
Pretty shameful on the US's part but the Administration is full of bullshit like this so its not surprising.
As far as I know, the US has given millions of dollars in aid to the Palestinian Authority in the past. This government is an authoritarian dictatorship which funds suicide bombers to attack Israelis.2) So we shouldn't support nations with similar values and government to our own? We should have sided with the sickos in Palestine who now blow themselves up in crowded areas with the intent of murdering as many innocent men, women, and children as possible? Should we take sides with Iran now, they also hate us because we support Israel?
Because Islamist states initiated the use of force against the West. They invited self-defence on behalf of the free countries.How in the hell are we not on the same level?
The only difference I see is that the Coalition doesn't behead the people they capture on tape.
This is the logical fallacy of equivocation, and in this case is the result of divorcing context from morality. If Muslims think in black and white it does not disqualify black and white thinking. It may simply disqualify the ideology in which they base their thinking--Islamism.Stop looking at things as black and white. Its that kind of ass-backwards thinking that causes this **** in the first place. Hell, its the mentally of the radical Muslims: "They're either with us or against us."
PLAYBOY: In Atlas Shrugged you wrote, "There are two sides to every issue. One side is right and the other is wrong, but the middle is always evil." Isn't this a rather black-and-white set of values?
RAND: It most certainly is. I most emphatically advocate a black-and-white view of the world. Let us define this. What is meant by the expression "black and white"? It means good and evil. Before you can identify anything as gray, as middle of the road, you have to know what is black and what is white, because gray is merely a mixture of the two. And when you have established that one alternative is good and the other is evil, there is no justification for the choice of a mixture. There is no justification ever for choosing any part of what you know to be evil.
This is true, but the point was, you don't stop supporting Israel just because "terrorists are mad at us for supporting IsraeL"As far as I know, the US has given millions of dollars in aid to the Palestinian Authority in the past. This government is an authoritarian dictatorship which funds suicide bombers to attack Israelis.
I believe the US also supports a "two-state solution," which means compromise between a free country that respects that rights of its citizens, and a slave-state that is a launchpad for the destruction of the free country next to it.
Right. The "White" side of this issue would be to end our support of a two state solution, as a dictatorship in Palestine has no right to exist, especially as a launching pad for militant Islamists to attack the only remotely free state in the region. It would be to instruct Israel that they have the moral right to persue any means for their self-defence.This is true, but the point was, you don't stop supporting Israel just because "terrorists are mad at us for supporting IsraeL"
Actually, the Che avatar back story is that I let my hair grow out for a while and a friend who was drunk at a party told me I looked just like him.Actually having Che Guevara in your avatar says alot
What in the ****? Is there any time where I said the US should lose in any situation?Would you agree with the logical extension of your acontextual idealogy--that Japan was the good side of WWII and the US should have lost?
Hi Crowler :wave:Holy CRAP
Exbannana eater welcome back. Where the HELL have you been and how are you bro?
CROWLER
This is taking your ideas to their full, unseen consequences.What in the ****? Is there any time where I said the US should lose in any situation?
Mike Mentzer always quoted ayn rand too, and he was able to grow a bitchin mustache.he's got ayn rand in his sig. must be smart
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