Obamney 2012 - Barack Obama And Mitt Romney Are Essentially The Same Candidate

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by DAdams91982

    Look at Ford. That is what happens when there are people who actually work hard and change as the times need.

    Ford was in the same position GM was, only difference is GM took the bailout and Ford is strong as ever.

    Now GM cant even get rid of the Feds from their operations.
    The feds own GM. They still owe billions of dollars to the feds. It's is now called government motors.


  2. Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    The burden shouldn't be taken on others that had nothing to do with it.
    I don't view people who have played by the rules as being burdens.
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  3. Never enough
    EasyEJL's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    I don't view people who have played by the rules as being burdens.
    why should my earnings go to support a bank that was failing because of bad choices? As you can see by the fine job done with it, it did absolutely 0 for the people who played by the rules, but did get bank execs big bonuses. Had the banks been allowed to fail instead, it would have created a lot more caution within the financial industry. Instead it let them know that so long as they find a way to take the risky choices or pad books in ways that don't break the law, they can go ahead and do it with assurance that taxpayer dollars will cover it.

    And yes, I know it was a Bush agenda item, I was against many bush agenda pieces including Medicare part D.

  4. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    I don't view people who have played by the rules as being burdens.
    Why not? They should have known that doomsday was coming when they did nothing about the quality of the cars.

    They put a lot of energy being activists for their union but not their product.
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  5. Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    why should my earnings go to support a bank that was failing because of bad choices? As you can see by the fine job done with it, it did absolutely 0 for the people who played by the rules, but did get bank execs big bonuses. Had the banks been allowed to fail instead, it would have created a lot more caution within the financial industry. Instead it let them know that so long as they find a way to take the risky choices or pad books in ways that don't break the law, they can go ahead and do it with assurance that taxpayer dollars will cover it.

    And yes, I know it was a Bush agenda item, I was against many bush agenda pieces including Medicare part D.
    I understand the core principal of your argument and in many ways I agree with you. I'm NOT for bailing out banks either. However, it's not that simple when you take into account what is involved. The holdings these banks had, investments, pension management, a lot of innocent people stood to lose EVERYTHING, at the very least they were able to transfer their investments and walk away with what they had, while some even lost a substantial amount of their earnings. I agree the banks did not play by the rules, but those that did shouldn't have to risk their futures as punishment for that. So again, I understand your point. But my point is, it's not as simple as just letting them crash and walk away. There ramifications are far reaching. I'd say f*ck big banks too, if innocent people weren't harmed as a result. They deserve protections too.
  6. Never enough
    EasyEJL's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    I understand the core principal of your argument and in many ways I agree with you. I'm NOT for bailing out banks either. However, it's not that simple when you take into account what is involved. The holdings these banks had, investments, pension management, a lot of innocent people stood to lose EVERYTHING, at the very least they were able to transfer their investments and walk away with what they had, while some even lost a substantial amount of their earnings. I agree the banks did not play by the rules, but those that did shouldn't have to risk their futures as punishment for that. So again, I understand your point. But my point is, it's not as simple as just letting them crash and walk away. There ramifications are far reaching. I'd say f*ck big banks too, if innocent people weren't harmed as a result. They deserve protections too.
    but the bailouts didn't particularly protect them. The bailouts kept the banks open, but the markets crashed, and people lost 40% of their investments anyhow.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    Why not? They should have known that doomsday was coming when they did nothing about the quality of the cars.

    They put a lot of energy being activists for their union but not their product.
    I wasn't just referring to one sector, the auto-industry. :/

  8. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    I wasn't just referring to one sector, the auto-industry. :/
    The industry as a whole failed. Also you cant just blame those on top. Those on top get bugged for higher pay, benefit after benefit, etc....lose incentive to make quality products due to rising cost demands from Unions. Unions ime cause a socialistic state with the workers and they loose all their incentive to do better.

    Its not the job of the tax payer to save these jobs.

    What you have to do is let it crash, liquidate the company and hope someone else picks the company back up. If not then people should have been prepared because there is no such thing as security, only self reliance.
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  9. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    a lot of innocent people stood to lose EVERYTHING, at the very least they were able to transfer their investments and walk away with what they had, while some even lost a substantial amount of their earnings. I agree the banks did not play by the rules, but those that did shouldn't have to risk their futures as punishment for that. So again, I understand your point. But my point is, it's not as simple as just letting them crash and walk away. There ramifications are far reaching. I'd say f*ck big banks too, if innocent people weren't harmed as a result. They deserve protections too.
    Alot of innocent people are going to be punished that had nothing to do with people making wrong decisions on who to trust with their finances. People have been warned for years not to involve themselves in these ponzi scheme investments, but they get blamed for being a "conspiracy theorist"

    I dont invest my money in these crappy banking institutions. I as well as others shouldnt be responsible for other peoples irresponsible risks trusting some blood thirsty bank to gamble their money.

    The fed is infinitely pumping 80 billion a month in bailout money infinitely. Money is printed out of thin air and currency is devalued and in greater danger of being collapsed globally.

    You cant save everybody, whats important is not letting the system collapse and so far the solutions have amounted to just about nothing other than more debt and having the country closer to collapse.
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  10. Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    but the bailouts didn't particularly protect them. The bailouts kept the banks open, but the markets crashed, and people lost 40% of their investments anyhow.
    The numbers ranged anywhere between 20% to 60% on losses, depending how much you had tied up in the market. The point is it allowed them to walk away with something they'd earned, rather than losing it all. I didn't want to see my parents lose anything, much less everything. They lost over a lifetime's worth of savings. I've seen the impact that its had on my parents. When I look at my father, I can see the pain of that inside him, even though he never talks about it. That he came here with a dream, worked his a$$ off (no entitlements) and took us from sleeping on a wooden floor, to an apt, to eventually our own home. I can't and won't accept that. Here you have two people who did everything right so that their kids could live a better life, and here they are struggling in the years where they are supposed to be enjoying the fruits of their labor. No, can't do it. Won't do it. AX claims his passion is raging against wars, mine is consumer/employee protections.It's why I took advantage of the market and created a compliance firm, not allowing the market to take advantage of me.
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  11. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    AX claims his passion is raging against wars, mine is consumer/employee protections.It's why I took advantage of the market and created a compliance firm, not allowing the market to take advantage of me.
    Consumers should be protected, and if they are abused you have to take it to court, its a constitutional right.

    Taking other peoples money to fix the problems and issues of others by force is immoral. Your screwing other consumers which is hypocritical to only think of the failing group.

    You are protected $100,000 in your bank, but any investment is a risk someone chooses to take.
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  12. Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    Consumers should be protected, and if they are abused you have to take it to court, its a constitutional right.

    Taking other peoples money to fix the problems and issues of others by force is immoral.

    You are protected $100,000 in your bank, but any investment is a risk someone chooses to take.
    Which requires money AX and I'm referring to investments, not free checking accounts. And, NO, not all investments are risky, there are different investments pools that carry different risks, at the base end most are negligible. Stick to wars.

  13. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    Which requires money AX and I'm referring to investments, not free checking accounts. And, NO, not all investments are risky, there are different investments pools that carry different risks, at the base end most are negligible. Stick to wars.
    No, my passion is consumer protection too. I stick to whatever I choose to stick.

    You can determine whatever investment you want to take, and take whatever level of risk you take. But if you get robbed by the bank take them to court, dont ask Goverment and the tax payer to be your sugar daddy and bail you out.

    If someone robs me on the street after I pulled a withdrawal out of an ATM, and the money was most of what I had and I cant pay my rent, should the tax payers feel sorry for me and tell goverment they must be taxed to pay my rent? Or print money out of thin air for me and have their money devalued?
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  14. Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    No, my passion is consumer protection too. I stick to whatever I choose to stick.

    You can determine whatever investment you want to take, and take whatever level of risk you take. But if you get robbed by the bank take them to court, dont ask Goverment and the tax payer to be your sugar daddy and bail you out.

    If someone robs me on the street after I pulled a withdrawal out of an ATM, and the money was most of what I had and I cant pay my rent, should the tax payers feel sorry for me and tell goverment they must be taxed to pay my rent? Or print money out of thin air for me and have their money devalued?
    Then try to make sure that your "opinions" at the very least, are of the informed variety. Comparing getting robbed on the street, to what is involved in a regulated environment, is not just overly simplistic, but silly. You have a 401k? If so, I want you to explain to me how it works?

  15. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    Then try to make sure that your "opinions" at the very least, are of the informed variety. Comparing getting robbed on the street, to what is involved in a regulated environment, is not just overly simplistic, but silly. You have a 401k? If so, I want you to explain to me how it works?
    No I dont have a 401K, and when I had regular jobs I opted out. I have my own thing I do with my money, and I dont spend more than I earn and take out irresponsible mortgages hoping some company is going to sugar daddy me for life and expecting tax payers to bail me out should I screw up.

    So whats your point?
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  16. Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    No I dont have a 401K, and when I had regular jobs I opted out. I have my own thing I do with my money, and I dont spend more than I earn and take out irresponsible mortgages hoping some company is going to sugar daddy me for life. I take all responsibility for myself, when I was a kid and was homeless I didnt go to goverment for food stamps, I sucked it up and took food out of any garbage I can find.

    So whats your point?
    Neither did I, what's your point? You claim to know how the market works, so I'm asking you to explain it to me? Simple enough.

    P.S. 401K's have nothing to do with entitlements (as you mentioned above), though I know that's YOUR ONE AND ONLY reflexive response to everything. AX, is it going to rain tomorrow? "I don't know, I don't believe in free rain. I make my own rain. I like to make it rain."

  17. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    Neither did I, what's your point? You claim to know how the market works, so I'm asking you to explain it to me? Simple enough...
    When did I claim I was a markets expert?

    All Ive been saying is people need to take personal responsibility for their decisions and suck it up.
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  18. Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    When did I claim I was a markets expert?

    All Ive been saying is people need to take personal responsibility for their decisions and suck it up.
    Grand idea, AX. People need to stop blaming the government for their problems and SUCK IT UP.

  19. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    Grand idea, AX. People need to stop blaming the government for their problems and SUCK IT UP.
    No, I dont blame the goverment, I blame people who vote based on who will be their sugar daddy just like this past election.
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  20. ...all I got out of the last 10 pages is that ax makes it rain

  21. Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    No, I dont blame the goverment, I blame people who vote based on who will be their sugar daddy just like this past election.
    Lol. Warren Buffet needed a sugar daddy? Abigail Disney president of the Daphney Foundation,Celine Justice; Whitney Tilson managing partner of T2 Partners L.L.C., Kelli Alires; Frank Jernigan, who retired from Google,Teresa Gardiner; Lawrence Benenson, partner of Benenson Capital, and Carmen Peterson. <----These people needed sugar daddies? Or is that just the uninformed ideologue in you talking again...

  22. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    Lol. Warren Buffet needed a sugar daddy? Abigail Disney president of the Daphney Foundation,Celine Justice; Whitney Tilson managing partner of T2 Partners L.L.C., Kelli Alires; Frank Jernigan, who retired from Google,Teresa Gardiner; Lawrence Benenson, partner of Benenson Capital, and Carmen Peterson. <----These people needed sugar daddies? Or is that just the uninformed ideologue in you talking again...
    People vote based on the notion that government is going to be there to help them and give them things.

    Those are the people who expect government to do things for them and blame goverment for all their problems when they arent given anything.
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  23. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    Neither did I, what's your point? You claim to know how the market works, so I'm asking you to explain it to me? Simple enough.

    P.S. 401K's have nothing to do with entitlements (as you mentioned above), though I know that's YOUR ONE AND ONLY reflexive response to everything. AX, is it going to rain tomorrow? "I don't know, I don't believe in free rain. I make my own rain. I like to make it rain."
    Whats your point with 401K anyways, why did you bring that up?
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  24. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    We share a similar back story in terms of how you've described your childhood/economic status. My family immigrated here when I was a child. Three kids sleeping on a wooden floor, and this was the case for many years; as both my mother and father worked to put themselves through school, ALL WITHOUT HANDOUTS or government assistance. I watched my mother shrink down to 90lbs, as she'd pass me her dinner on a nightly basis so her kids could eat, so my perspective on certain issues may be a little different than some others here. I'm not lauding my education, I consider myself lucky. However, for some to trivialize education and tag someone or rather institutions as being "elitist" is the height of ignorance. Education is what took me out of one tax bracket and life path, and put me into another. Do I believe in unlimited handouts? NO. Do I believe that some people are lazy and game the system? Yes. However, do I also believe that some people just want a chance to improve their lives and need assistance in doing so? Yes. So it's a bit more complicated than painting everyone with a broad brush and saying let's get rid of all entitlements. You can't make drastic and immediate cuts to programs that some people utilize as a lifeline.You can't tell a kid, whose parents can't afford to pay for them to go to college that you're cutting or taking away their Pell grants. Investing in higher education is investing in the economy (not referring to lib art majors). Now we do have to make some cuts but it must be done over a prolonged period of time, NOT IMMEDIATE. I also think in order to escape a narrow perspective, people should travel outside of their little bubble, and I'm not referring to taking a trip to Cancun. So many people offer opinions about the rest of the world, when they've never even owned a passport.

    This isn't an Obama issue for me, if Mitt Romney the moderate showed up, he might have received my vote. I actually liked him as "governor." The presidential candidate and more importantly his "policies," not so much.
    not disagreeing, as an educated person as well, I think there is a misnomer that being educated makes one "smart" which is does not. There are multiple intelligences that serve people and serve them well.

    I dont disagree with your student loan comments, but at the same time we also need to consider limitations.

  25. Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    Whats your point with 401K anyways, why did you bring that up?
    Lol :/ Never mind man. Back to talking about alien invasions.

  26. Quote Originally Posted by southpaw23 View Post
    Lol :/ Never mind man. Back to talking about alien invasions.
    No seriously, I was talking about how people shouldnt be bailed out if they get laid off or screw up their investments, and then you went into 401k a couple of times, I dont get it. What is it that you are trying to say about 401k and what did that have to do with this discussion.
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  27. Quote Originally Posted by carpee View Post
    ...all I got out of the last 10 pages is that ax makes it rain
    Yes, but its Obamarain, and it goes well with new waterproof Obamaboots.
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!

  28. Quote Originally Posted by ax1

    Yes, but its Obamarain, and it goes well with new waterproof Obamaboots.
    adding those to my Obamistmas list

  29. The fact of the matter is that after Tuesday night's results we have learned one thing...

    The United States of America has finally turned the corner.

    For years you've heard people say, "This country is changing". Well... this country has finally changed.

    After decades of the communist red shirts, in Democrat Progressive disguise, increasing the welfare state, increasing entitlements, leaving the borders wide open to illegal immigration, encouraging illegal immigrants and the poor to take advantage and rip off the system, poisoning the minds of the American youth through the union run public education system as well as the universities, in which the students are tought to hate America, hate capitalism, and become USEFUL IDIOTS falling victim to the class warfare tactics....


    America has finally chosen the path of Marxism/Socialism -lite. Unfortunately, this will only lead to more unemployment... leading to EVEN MORE ENTITLEMENTS, more unemployment and more government assitance... in turn leaving more and more of the voting electorate DEPENDANT on the government. And every 2-4 years when election time comes... the Democommies will be there to offer more and more freebies, while blaming the big mean greedy rich businessmen for laying them off.

    This has been their goal for the past few decades, and they have finally brought American to it's knees.

    Everyone loves Santa Claus... you can't beat Santa Claus. So this will lock in liberal victories for the foreseeable future.

    Unfortunately for the Trotskyites, eventually you will run out of other people's money to spend and redistribute.

    But then again, you can always borrow it from China. And eventually pay them back with American land and territory. Maybe even some government control.
    PES ALPHAMINE Log
    h ttp://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplement-reviews-logs/213082-pes-alphamine-log.html
  

  
 

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